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Saturday, 26 Iyyar, 5781
  |  May 8, 2021

Shul Rabbi Retracts Eruv Support

Kol Israel's Rabbi Elkanah Schwartz rescinds his "endorsement" of the Crown Heights Eruv, but backs the expert who built it. Full Story

Crown Heights Pianists to Perform

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Eiruv as a uniter
June 22, 2016 4:16 am

This Eiruv has the zechus to be the great uniter.
It has been years since our Rabonim have all agreed on something…..

We should introduce more controversial issue perhaps they will put aside their petty machlokes…….

@72
June 20, 2016 6:53 pm

Incorrect…. those are separate Eruvim. The grey (pun intended) area, is the only part that “covers” Crown Heights and Lefferts Gardens.

Miriam
June 19, 2016 9:32 pm

If you read the article right, the eruv does not just cover crown heights, it covers Prospect Heights, Carol Gardens, Lefferts Garden, Cobble Hill, Brooklyn Heights, Windsor Terrace, and Crown Heights, and etc. so when they put up the eruv it wasn’t put up with the Labavitcher Chassidium in mind, they knew they were not going to use it, so if you decide to take it down a lot of people are going to carry and do you want that on your mind, and I am sure the Labavitcher Rabbi would not like to see Chassidium threatening to take the… Read more »

L'mai Nafka Mina?
June 19, 2016 7:53 pm

Is Chalav Stam sold in CH? Does anyone in CH trim their beards (or shave)? Is only Lubavitcher Scheita available in CH? Are there college students/graduates in CH? Does every married woman in CH always wear a sheitel in public (and not a tichel)? We all know the answer to all of these questions, but suddenly when it comes to an Eruv everyone becomes “Shpitz Chabad” and extremely mekushar to the Rebbe and zealous for his sake. What are you so afraid of? If the Beis Din came out against the Eruv, and there are explicit instructions from the Rebbe… Read more »

#no 27
June 19, 2016 7:53 pm

Is that what Labavitch is all about, because they don’t believe in your views you are telling people do get up and move if you don’t agree with the Rabbonim that are saying that the eruv is not good enough, I thought Labavitch was all about bringing people closer to yidishkeit, and are you going to give these people money to move, like it is so easy to move

Sholom Ber Cohen
June 19, 2016 6:26 pm

Who is the mystery Eruv Rabbi.
Would one eat meat without knowing the Rav Hamachshir.
i sense that Rabbi Schwartz had no idea what was going on behind the seens.
He by his own admission is not qualified to erect an eruv and directed his members to approach an expert.
No one believes that the eruv was erected in accordance with the shita of the Alter Rebbe.
it is not for the Lubavitcher community.
the most important point however is the Rebbe’s position, he did not support the erection of an eruv in Crown heights.

RABBI HELLER SPEAKS!!!!
June 19, 2016 3:39 pm

Someone posted in another group Rabbi Heller just addressed the eiruv issue in kolel and asked to share his words. The following was written up by one of the people in attendance. 1. Eiruvin is from the three most difficult sugiyos in halacha. To make an eiruv in a city (which is a different ballgame than a bungalow colony etc). Is extremely complicated, there are only יחידים in our dor that know how to do it properly. It’s like a heart surgery, you cant just be a regular dr. you have to be a regular dr plus specialize in hearts…… Read more »

#49 and #51
June 19, 2016 10:57 am

Reb Moshe’s opinion is well known, and irrelevant. He is very much a daas yochid. Unless a person relies on his opinion to drink commercial milk, they have no reason to take any account of his opinion on eruvin.

In addition, even according to his unique shita, eruvin in Brooklyn ARE kosher. He was misinformed about the facts in Brooklyn, and based his teshuva on that misinformation. Since Brooklyn does not have 3 million people within an area of 64 square miles, even according to Reb Moshe it is not a reshus horabim.

#50, can you not read?
June 19, 2016 10:53 am

Again, horotze leshaker yarchik eduso. The map is posted in this article, and everyone can see that you are lying.

#41, why do you need to know the expert's name?
June 19, 2016 10:52 am

Rabbi Schwartz tells you that this person is an expert, and that he certifies that the eruv is kosher. Why is that not enough for you? Do you not trust Rabbi Schwartz to know who is an expert? The reason the expert doesn’t want his name bandied about should be obvious: you know very well what will happen if it becomes known. In his place would YOU want it known? No, you wouldn’t. So where did you see a halacha that in order to certify an eruv one must be willing to subject oneself and ones family to harassment? In… Read more »

to number 9
June 19, 2016 10:50 am

you are 100 % on the money !!

a divided beis din is easy to conquer

they are weak and no one respects them there is no himmel Geshrei from them on this and that’s a tragedy

#35, this is dangerous nonsense
June 19, 2016 10:48 am

Whether you think the eruv is kosher or possul, another Jew has the right to disagree with you and rely on the VAST MAJORITY of poskim according to whom it is kosher. He is certainly not a mechalel shabbos, and it is a SERIOUS AVERA to treat him as one. Much worse than carrying in what (even according to your rabbonim) is a karmelis.

#47, who said it may not?
June 19, 2016 10:45 am

Where did you get the idea that an eruv needs the local rabbonim’s permission?

(In any case, it’s not opposed by all local rabbonim; Rabbi Schwartz is a local rov and he supports it.)

#46, what are you talking about?
June 19, 2016 10:44 am

Horotze leshaker yarchik eduso. The map is right there for all to see, and all can see that the whole Crown Heights is included. So whom are you lying to?

#38, no you do not need permission
June 19, 2016 10:42 am

I don’t know where you got this idea. Nobody’s permission is needed to make an eruv. Perhaps you were confused by the term “sechiras reshus”. “Reshus” means “property”, not “permission”. If an eruv includes areas in which goyim have a property interest, that interest must be leased from someone with some kind of right over it, e.g. the city. That has been done.

To 27 and others who feel this way......
June 19, 2016 9:22 am

Who died and made you G-d? If this is how you show your interest and patience in bringing others back – I seriously am considering not funding anymore projects by Chabad you’re arrogance and lack of kindness and understanding sound like something from before the bal shemtovs time ! Why when it comes to our own families do we show less support then we would to a newcomer? Obviously something is wrong somewhere that so many are or interested in being religious? Instead of looking to shove the blame elsewhere why not look where you are lacking .You may think… Read more »

poisen
June 19, 2016 7:28 am

If there was a controversy if a particular very important ingredient that you use to cook had food poisoning or was being recalled under suspicion that it MAY have food poisoning would you buy jt and use it anyway because there are some drs out there who say its fine.
The risk would be too great.
If you don’t see the parallel with this situation then your commitment to take g-ds word seriously and to not desecrate shabbos is put into serious question.

to #44
June 19, 2016 2:52 am

Obviously the point of recording wasn’t to denigrate or intimidate the rabbi, but on the contrary, to protect his honor. Earlier that day there was a fraudulant notice circaling on Whatsapp supposedly from the rabbi. It only makes sense that this real statement should have some proof to it, like a recording. If this rabbi feels disrespected by it, he obviously isn’t a very knowledgeable rabbi… Anyways, our community owes him nothing, and if he wades into our community, he should expect to encounter the scrutiny of a zealous community and their protectors: our rabbonim.

June 19, 2016 2:04 am

@ # 42, I am glad to see that you were confident enough, however, it is very clear that the Crown Heights Bais Din is NOT a Lubavitch institution, it is THE Bais Din of Crown Heights, back in the mid 1980’s when the elections were being held it was made clear that all Shomrei Torah u Mitzva had the right to vote.

Yankel Todres
June 19, 2016 1:49 am

B”H
If someone has “Yiras Shomayim”, he would never dream of desecrating the Shabbos. Unless there were piles of “Hechsharim” from every Rav known to mankind he wouldn’t even contemplate carrying on Shabbos. (And maybe not even then, for those of us that call ourselves Chassidim!)

Kol Tuv.

YUKEL TODRES
June 19, 2016 1:30 am

Oy CH at its best. This place sickens people like me. You mean to tell me that Eruvin in other Chabad communities are kosher and accepted by chabad people, but in CH oh it’s the rebbe’s shchuna so it’s not allowed?! Where’s the logic and halacha in that?! I see a lot of hypocrites here. Leave the rebbe out of this argument cause it’s just all politics for a group of people here in CH. The Eruv has been built and approved by an halachic expert. Period end of story. Now we can all move on and let others live… Read more »

To 42
June 19, 2016 1:19 am

Wrong.

The ppl who live outside the neighborhood should at least show minimal kovod to the rabanim and the community that resides in this neighborhood. Those who live here who choose to transgress our way of life should show respect and at minimum not publicize nor flaunt all that they transgress.
It’s not about owning the neighborhoid- it’s about showing respect to its community- regardless of the fact that some of chosen to leave it.

51 Lubavitch
June 19, 2016 12:44 am

Rav Moshe wasn’t chabad and he also poskened it would not work

Lubavitch
June 19, 2016 12:33 am

While relying on an eruv that is not endorsed by a Rabbi, and we don’t know who the expert Rabbi is can’t be ok, the CH Rabbonim are not answering or explaining from a halachic standpoint. The CH community is diverse, and includes many people with various levels of observance, and adherence to “Lubavitch” minhagic, shitas. Many people here do NOT care if YOU tell them they do not qualify to be Lubavitch because they do xyz. That is a silly illogical way to expect people to do what you say! You don’t get to tell people how to dress,… Read more »

eruv is on other side of eastern pkwy doesnt include 770
June 19, 2016 12:28 am

I looked at the boundaries of this eruv. The area is what used to be called bed sty. It doesn’t include eastern pkwy. It has led to chilul shabbos as I and others saw people carrying near 770 which isn’t in the eruv. They carried on Kingston on our side of eastern pkwy

42 halacha
June 18, 2016 11:53 pm

But there are no rabbonim endorsing this eruv. And it is not just a chabad thing since R Moshe also paskened it wouldn’t work.

@42 Correct... CH is not "our" Schuna
June 18, 2016 11:51 pm

You’re right, Lubavitchers do not “own” CH.
CH is not our’s; it is “The Rebbe’s Schuna. Case closed. No need for polemics. We have the zchus to live in our beloved Rebbe’s neighborhood…therefore, we follow the Rebbe’s directives. IMHO be humble enough to allow yourselves be Mekarved by “Chassidim”, learn Chassidus,
and you wil eventually behave like Chassidim of our Rebbe.

To # 42 You are right
June 18, 2016 11:05 pm

Lubavitch doesn’t own Crown Heights!

However, are there any other LOCAL Crown Heights Rabbonim?

Which Rov says that an “Eiruv” constructed and opposed by ALL LOCAL Rabbonim may be relied upon to carry on Shabbos?

according to the map
June 18, 2016 11:00 pm

this eruv is not in crown heights its on the otherside of eastern parkway

To 13
June 18, 2016 10:58 pm

Wrong! In light of today’s events, they should speak up and translate their words into action.

This was so embarrassing to read!
June 18, 2016 10:38 pm

2 Beis Dins? One Rabbi records their conversation? Another one films him? Really showing Rabbi Shwartz our best side people. Way to go. Can you imagine his impression of the leadership of our community. What an embarrassment.

I would be terrified to use this "Eruv"
June 18, 2016 6:20 pm

Who messes with the rebbe ????

More "Turf Wars" and politics
June 18, 2016 4:01 pm

News Flash: Lubavitchers do NOT “own” Crown Heights or anywhere else in the world (except maybe Kfar Chabad). If they, based on the advice of their Rabannim and Rebbe, choose not to hold by this Eruv that is certainly their prerogative but this goes way beyond that. The CH Rabannim are worried (and rightfully so) that they are losing authority over their OWN people, who are looking elsewhere for Halachic and Hashkafic guidance, and THAT is what terrifies them. The fact that they even need to speak out against an Eruv that everyone knows they and the Rebbe oppose says… Read more »

OY VEY
June 18, 2016 2:53 pm

WE will not use the eruv when we are in CH, for us it doesn’t exist, but I am not sure about our married children. We don’t have any say in what they do, I just pray they understand this is against the Rebbe. As for this unnamed “expert”, if nobody knows who that is what does that say about the “kashrus” of the eruv? I should listen to some unknown person who tells me it’s Kosher? If this “expert” believes it’s good, let him man up and stand by his work. I like #39’s idea. If husbands were more… Read more »

ERUV WITHOUT HECHSHER
June 17, 2016 7:47 pm

WOULD YOU EAT MEAT WITH NO NAME OF A RAV HAMACHSHIR??

It is important to oppose the eruv
June 17, 2016 7:37 pm

But it is also important to listen to the women who feel stuck at home. Husbands should consider going to an earlier minyan and be home with the kids so the wife may go to shul without carrying

@30
June 17, 2016 7:22 pm

Explain to me how the “Greater Crown Heights Eruv” was even kosher to begin with? To my knowledge, one has to ask permission of the people within the area, for it become a reshus ha’yuchid. Otherwise, it is just some random string.

#30, NOT the same rov
June 17, 2016 7:20 pm

The new eruv is NOT certified by the same expert who does Park Slope or Brooklyn Heights.

Can someone please explain
June 17, 2016 7:19 pm

If Rabbi segal was told by Rabbi Schwartz that he is withdrawing his support for the eiruv because he was told that he didnt take the Crown Hights Rabbonim’ s opinion into account why didnt he just say thank you and hang up the phone
What benifit is there to telling him that there are two botti dinim and that we are a divisive disfunctional community when all rabonim clearly agree on this issue?

Chilull shabbos/ mevushal
June 17, 2016 7:15 pm

Just a heads up if you are inviting any person who uses the eruv into your house be careful to only serve them mevushal wine because one may not have a mechallel shabbos drink, touch or even see wine that is not mevushal

Well said #32
June 17, 2016 7:15 pm

Well said #32

@26
June 17, 2016 7:13 pm

Exactly!

Finally we'll have clarity
June 17, 2016 7:11 pm

BH this will make very clear who are followers of the Rebbe and who are not.

The Rebbe said clearly many times to follow the LUBAVITCHER RABBONIM in crown heights (and everywhere). Those who excuse themselves because of the politics, are just excusing themselves. There were politics all the years even when the Rebbe spoke about it.

So BH now if someone is seen carrying everyone will know he is not a Lubavitcher (a follower of the Rebbe), and we can start the kiruv work, easily without confusion, and be mekarev him to the Rebbe.

Nothing changed
June 17, 2016 7:10 pm

There never was a kosher eruv to begin with. Tear it, get a mysterious supporter it’s all the same. Those who want to carry will carry regardless of any details and try to ‘ blame’ the community and rabanim. Look, they already publicly display their lack of respect for anyone, or anything holy by walking around the way they do…so this is just another exciting way to get out of doing another imp mitzvah aka as shabbos which unfortunately they regard as a prison. Basically….lack of tznius is a display of lack of yiras shomayim and it’s a matter of… Read more »

ERUV was done
June 17, 2016 7:02 pm

BY a MUMCHA so if you want to believe this rov then u must believe he is relying on a good rov since the same rov is also giving to the park slope and Bed Sty and other. So it is how you feel about it.,

Truman
June 17, 2016 6:58 pm

Many people have commented on his denial and here I present just a few;

Bill Shakespeare: The lady doth protest too much, methinks.
Bill Clinton: I did not have,,,,,and, it depends on what the meaning of is, is.
Obama: You can keep your doctor….etc,etc, etc…..

Enviable company, wouldn’t you agree? And remember that a half-truth is something more than an plain ol’ lie.

Avrohom Yakov
June 17, 2016 6:53 pm

Very strange. people are complaining about the divisiveness and fighting of our Rabbis. Yet they all AGREE that the eruv should NOT be used. Rabbi Heller has also come out publicly very strongly against it. So on one side we have someone who is afraid to reveal his name (if he exists at all). On the other side we have ALL four Rabbonim in the shechuna against it. Those who carry are simply like those who choose to dress not tzniusly and do other sorts of things better not mentioned. In other words they are porkiei ol. They refuse to… Read more »

Urgent! Time to decide.
June 17, 2016 6:51 pm

To put it in simple words, it seems there are a number of people that are trying to distance themselves from their upbringing, but cannot make the jump because of guilt feelings (- a form of Bipolar disease). Its time to make the jump, either move out of the CH Lubavich community to Tribeca or anywhere else and you will not have to live with the constant reminder and family embarrassment when you cut your beard, or your wife walks around with pants or worse etc. kids going to public school. or return to your roots and join the community… Read more »

If there is no certification
June 17, 2016 6:49 pm

Then even members of kol israel shouldn’t use it

What's the Big Deal?
June 17, 2016 6:46 pm

I fail too see any big issue and don’t understand the cause of this stir. It is clear that the Crown Heights Rabbonim and the Rebbe’s secretary oppose the eiruv, on the basis that the Rebbe opposed it. So if the Crown Heights Rabbonim is your rabbinical guidance then case closed and shut. DONT USE THE EIRUV. The fact that there happens to be an Eiruv now in OUR community should not bother you the slightest. This week should feel no different to last week. For those that choose to use it is between them, their Rabbi and Hashem. And… Read more »

No hechsher - not kosher
June 17, 2016 6:46 pm

If the Rabbi gave a hechsher to a product, then removed his kosher certification but said that the manufacturers are kashrus experts – would you eat the food?

I wouldn’t.

Avrohom Yakov
June 17, 2016 6:42 pm

Very strange. people are complaining about the divisiveness and fighting of our Rabbis. Yet they all AGREE that the eruv should NOT be used. Rabbi Heller has also come out publicly very strongly against it. So on one side we have someone who is afraid to reveal his name (if he exists at all). On the other side we have ALL four Rabbonim in the shechuna against it. Those who carry are simply like those who choose to dress not tzniusly and do other sorts of things better not mentioned. In other words they are porkiei ol. They refuse to… Read more »

no rav
June 17, 2016 6:39 pm

if ther is no rav then its the same as telephone wires

How Stupid...
June 17, 2016 6:35 pm

I have no doubt that any body that considers himself Logical (or Religious), will be Mechalel Shabos based on the lay leaders of Kol yisroel and the unidentified Rabbi…

To 13
June 17, 2016 6:35 pm

Wrong! In light of today’s events, they should speak up and translate their words into action.

How Stupid...
June 17, 2016 6:34 pm

I have no doubt that any body that considers himself Logical (or Religious), will be Mechalel Shabos based on the lay leaders of Kol yisroel and the unidentified Rabbi…

@ 10 & 12
June 17, 2016 6:33 pm

Since Rabbi Schwartz no longer endorses the eruv, it is probably considered pusul. It is not kosher, and thus you cannot carry. Besides, it is high time people in Crown Heights actually learn the Halachos of Shabbos. An eruv is not meant to be a free-for-all.

Rebuttal of Rabbi Levine's Thesis
June 17, 2016 6:28 pm

See eruvonline for first part of a rebuttal of Rabbi Levine’s thesis.

http://eruvonline.blogspot.com/2016/06/part-1-rebuttal-eruv-in-crown-heights_45.html

withdrawn support
June 17, 2016 6:25 pm

definitely due to some threat which made him send out that letter

Not a single rov
June 17, 2016 6:24 pm

So there isn’t a single rov, lubavitch or not, who supports this eruv. Let’s see if this stops anyone from being mechalel shabbos tonight and tomorrow… (Hope it does)

The "Erev is up"
June 17, 2016 6:23 pm

Nope, the string is up, with ZERO Rabbinic authority!

Have a L’Chaim! Good Shabbat.

Enough
June 17, 2016 6:15 pm

All of Crown Heights beis din already asured it publicly and in writing. They don’t need to say anything more. Baruch Hashem Rabbi Schwartz has withdrawn his support.

threat
June 17, 2016 6:15 pm

Seems like there is some bullying going on. The eruv is kosher and anyone that wishes should use it. If you want to be respected respect others

Lemme get this straight....
June 17, 2016 5:59 pm

A shul that already has its own eruv, wanted to extend it into a community they are not located in, without asking permission? Should that not have made this eruv pusul to begin with?

so now what?
June 17, 2016 5:59 pm

What does this mean for the eiruv being certified or not? There is no Rav that is certifying the actual eiruv? Its hours before Shabbos and no one knows whats up and whats down.

I fear hundreds of people might be mechallel this week.

The eye of the storm
June 17, 2016 5:49 pm

What is pretty clear in these words is the negative impact cause by the divisiveness if our local Rabbinim. Thus is where the eye of the problem is. It’s high time to find a solution and force the local Rabbonim to unite and slowly rebuild kovod harabonus. Then the local residents will respect their words and the Rabbonim of other communities as well will recognize it’s authority.

Do ppl even care what the CH rabonim have to say?
June 17, 2016 5:39 pm

I mean all their fighting, they dont realize that young people just dont care anymore. For kovod hatoira they should all step down.

Read above
June 17, 2016 5:39 pm

They all put out letters

This is truly weird
June 17, 2016 5:38 pm

So now we have a mystery rabbi in favor of the eruv but nobody else will endorse it. Enough with the hoaxes and mysteries!

THE ERUV IS UP
June 17, 2016 5:33 pm

close case and end of story period. I know first hand of the expert rav who saw the eruv and said it’s good. that’s good enough for me. all the yukel todreses can go for a long hike.

Shamfull
June 17, 2016 5:28 pm

” I got an education that there are 2 batei dinim in crown hights” have our rabbonim no shame?

The eye of the storm
June 17, 2016 5:22 pm

What is pretty clear in these words is the negative impact cause by the divisiveness if our local Rabbinim. Thus is where the eye of the problem is. It’s high time to find a solution and force the local Rabbonim to unite and slowly rebuild kovod harabonus. Then the local residents will respect their words and the Rabbonim of other communities as well will recognize it’s authority.

rabbi shmuel pevzner shlit"a
June 17, 2016 5:17 pm

Kol hakavod reb shmuel the one true chosid who realy cares about our hailige shchuna

Badarz' view?
June 17, 2016 5:13 pm

Now that Rabbi Schwartz was brave to take a public stand it is only right to hear from both segments if the Badatz, Rabbi osdoba’s and Rabbi Braun’s a clear stand on this.

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