ב"ה
Wednesday, 6 Kislev, 5783
  |  November 30, 2022

Rabbinical Panel Hears 8 Hours of Anti Vaxx Testimony

The son of Rabbi Avrohom Osdoba, the son-in-law of Rabbi Yosef Heller and other Crown Heights individuals held a "rabbinical panel" that heard physicians and researchers question the Covid-19 vaccine. Full Story, Video

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B"H 8 hours of TRUTH
December 21, 2021 12:20 am

May everyone listen to these testimonies and learn the TRUTH of what’s going on in the upside down world we currently find ourselves in.
May this usher in Moshiach!
Thank you for posting this.

"Truth"
Reply to  B"H 8 hours of TRUTH
December 21, 2021 11:37 am

Yes, definitely only listen to the doctors and rabbonim who tell you what you want to hear.

As they say
Reply to  "Truth"
December 21, 2021 1:32 pm

“Liberals claim to want to give a hearing to other views, but then are shocked and offended to discover that there are other views.”

Nope
Reply to  As they say
December 21, 2021 2:50 pm

We’re not shocked, we’re just offended.

The right wing crazies can’t shock us anymore after January 6th.

Aha
Reply to  Nope
December 21, 2021 3:49 pm

You mean the time when the Capitol guards _held open_ doors for people (it’s on video), and then shot a woman in cold blood, while falsely claiming that one of their number had been killed? The time when Any Old Communist was whining about how “traumatized” and endangered she was, when she wasn’t even in the building at the time? That time?

U serious?
Reply to  Aha
December 21, 2021 11:53 pm

The woman named Ashli Babbit was killed completely justifiably. She broke in to the Capitol and smashed a glass in order to reach Lawmakers to do who knows what. To say it was in “cold blood” is ridiculous. And also the two entrances that were “held opened” was only after a violent mob breached over 8 others.
So you’re a silly goose

Le Amitiss
Reply to  U serious?
December 23, 2021 12:51 pm

Please check the facts. # Ashly Babbitt did not break glass (she may have been standing near broken glass as hundreds who didn’t break glass were.) # “Only” two opened the doors. Did you check how many doors were left open? How many “Capitol Gatekeepers” were ushering people in and around. # The gallows so prominently displayed [why haven’t I seen it lately?] – could it have carried the weight of a large dog? Perhaps it was just a demo prop? [Like the famous picture of a lady comedian holding the bloody decapitated head of Trump/] # Have you read… Read more »

Boruch Hoffinger
Reply to  "Truth"
December 22, 2021 4:29 pm

TRUTH, we live in unusual times. I truly believe Rabbi Y. Braun is unaware of this.
o.p.i.n.i.o.n?

Here's a thought
Reply to  B"H 8 hours of TRUTH
December 21, 2021 11:50 am

Rabbonim convening to hear testimony about a particular vaccine’s (“It’s not a vaccine!” I know, I know. Calm down. I meant treatment) efficacy is as pathetic as a group of medical researchers meeting to discuss the best heter iska’os.

Interesting
Reply to  Here's a thought
December 21, 2021 12:43 pm

The vax companies are suppressing their research records for 75 years.
Think about that.

Not true
Reply to  Interesting
December 21, 2021 11:36 pm

Not true, why can’t you be bothered to Google it yourself? There’s half a million pages to release and there’s only so much they can go through per day

Vaccine was approved in 108 days...
Reply to  Not true
December 22, 2021 4:53 am

… and FDA needs 75 years to go through all the documents?

Not true?
Reply to  Not true
December 22, 2021 10:25 am
Boruch Hoffinger
Reply to  Not true
December 22, 2021 4:35 pm

Pfizer received a $2.3 billion fine for wholesailing Bextra, a pain killer, with too many side effects. Yes, Pfizer rebelled against The FDA.
This behavior transgressed me of The Rebbe’s main acceptance conditions.

hmm
Reply to  Boruch Hoffinger
December 23, 2021 5:58 pm

so take moderna if you got an issue?….

Finally
December 21, 2021 12:20 am

Doing things the way a proper beis don should have handled things not just relieing on faceless “experts”.

EYE ROLLS
Reply to  Finally
December 21, 2021 1:28 pm

But relying on only drs that share an anti vax approach..doesnt seem the proper way.they should hear both sides

You sure
Reply to  Finally
December 21, 2021 2:13 pm

If you’re trying to say that Batei Dinim who support taking the vaccine rely on “faceless experts,” I have news for you: there are many faced experts who support taking the vaccine—many more than those who oppose taking the vaccine.

Pathetic is when they don’t research and talk asif
Reply to  You sure
February 7, 2022 8:28 am

Bais Dinim rely on facts and once you find the facts then you have to disqualify many of those witnesses. So there isn’t oa majority of doctors using facts to support the Vaacine. They rely on easily debunked information.

Mike Yeadon
December 21, 2021 12:20 am

So misleading. Dr. Mike Yeadon isn’t just a retired pharmacologist, he was a VP at Pfizer! so misleading

Binyamin Zev Wolf
Reply to  Mike Yeadon
December 21, 2021 10:16 am

He absolutely was not vp of Pfizer. He was vp of the allergy and respiratory research division within Pfizer. He basically was in charge of making puffers and allergy medicine. He never worked on vaccines and calling him the vp of Pfizer or pretending he has any expert knowledge on vaccines is wrong.

Leizer
Reply to  Binyamin Zev Wolf
December 21, 2021 1:47 pm

Zev please follow the facts.
Those who preferred ” retired pharmacologist” instead of

https://www.linkedin.com/in/mike-yeadon-3818613/?originalSubdomain=uk

Pfizer Global R&DTotal Duration
6 yrs 10 mosTitle
CSO and VP, Allergy & Respiratory Research HeadDates Employed
Jun 2006 – Oct 2011Employment Duration
5 yrs 5 mos
has some interest don’t you think? But if you think this is the same it is OK.

Like researchers and assistants
Reply to  Binyamin Zev Wolf
December 21, 2021 2:10 pm

In metalurgy or genetic crop, development, being cited as “scientists” who know about “climate change”.

Any pro-vaccine doctors
December 21, 2021 12:26 am

Seems tilted to anti-vaxxers.

Because
Reply to  Any pro-vaccine doctors
December 21, 2021 10:16 am

you can hear enough from the pro-vaxxers everywhere else.

Exactly.
Reply to  Because
December 21, 2021 10:26 pm

For those complaining we should listen to ‘both sides,’ all one has to do to hear the ‘other side’ is turn on the news – the pro vaccine propaganda is everywhere.

ובכן?
December 21, 2021 12:26 am

And? The outcome?

the outcome... quoted text
Reply to  ובכן?
December 21, 2021 12:34 pm

Therefore, we hereby express our rabbinic decision, as per the teachings of our holy Torah – a definitive Halachic ruling: 1) It is absolutely forbidden to administer or even to promote this injection to children, adolescents, young men or women; even if it means that they will not be permitted by the government to attend yeshiva or seminary or to study abroad, etc. It is an explicit obligation to protest against this mandate, and anyone who can prevent the injection from being forced upon our youth must do so, forthrightly and emphatically. The above admonition is in addition to the… Read more »

"Halachicly"
Reply to  the outcome... quoted text
December 21, 2021 2:17 pm

I’m reading through some Halachic texts at the moment, and I can’t seem to find any statue which forbids medical treatments because of the reasons you outlined. Perhaps you can direct me to some Halachic sources?

The same ones
Reply to  "Halachicly"
December 21, 2021 3:52 pm

that the pro-mask, pro-mandate, pro-control, etc., have been foisting on us for years now: ונשמרתם מאד לנפשותיכם.

Funny, isn’t it, how the chance of a virus with a 0.6% death rate (and even less than that in this country, about 0.25% – and orders of magnitude less among the young and otherwise healthy) has everyone in a tizzy, but the chance of side effects from a vaccine that so far doesn’t do squat is pushed aside as unimportant.

Frauds
Reply to  the outcome... quoted text
December 21, 2021 6:37 pm

They very intentionally did what Rabbi Braun said NOT to do and cherry-picked the few people who support their beliefs. This ‘psak’ is a complete sham.

Rabbi bluming
Reply to  Frauds
December 22, 2021 3:50 am

I would trust rabbi bluming more than any rav in ch

He has the bittul,he knows halacha,an anav

He would do what he believes in,not forcing others

Always giving both sides of the argument

These are the appropriate titles of these esteemed
December 21, 2021 12:26 am

Below is a list of some of the international doctors who have tried to bring to the world some truths and critiques regarding the global COVID-19 response, and often at great personal cost. In this list, one person was a Nobel Prize winner, one person was a Nobel Peace Prize nominee, one person conceived of the mRNA, one person was the inventor of the PCR test, one person was a Vice President in Pfizer, and one person was editor of ‘Reviews in Cardiovascular Medicine’ journal. These are not the kind of people you can write off as kooks. Search for… Read more »

From the many thousands of frum doctors
Reply to  These are the appropriate titles of these esteemed
December 21, 2021 10:55 am

From all over the world, the thousands upon thousands of frum doctors, can we find even a minyan to join this list?

SCARED & UNINFORMED
Reply to  From the many thousands of frum doctors
December 21, 2021 9:50 pm

Doctors don’t want to bother fighting what they believe is likely to be a losing battle and risk their careers and reputations. Only some brave doctors – and the list is growing – and Rabbonim, have stood up for the truth. The incredible amount of evidence about side effects, the censorship of the doctors, the suppression of science, the withholding of early treatments, the corruption of government, gain of function research, the incredible drop in vaccine efficacy, the unnecessary vaccination of children and those with natural immunity, etc. is sufficient reason to strongly question this potentially dangerous gene therapy referred… Read more »

Concerned resident
Reply to  SCARED & UNINFORMED
December 26, 2021 5:08 am

I totally agree with your statement. Too many factors seem to not align.

Frum doctors?
Reply to  From the many thousands of frum doctors
December 22, 2021 7:51 am

What does bring frum have to do with medicine and being a knowledgeable doctor?

What do all these speakers have I common?
Reply to  These are the appropriate titles of these esteemed
December 21, 2021 11:28 am

Dr Naomi Wolff is a feminist author, not a medical expert. Your list is ridiculist.

Yes, she's a feminist and a Democrat
Reply to  What do all these speakers have I common?
December 21, 2021 3:08 pm

Which makes her more credible going against all the lefty media and Government officials.

Of course, Bill de Blasio, Cuomo, current Governor, Joe Biden, etc are all eminent Doctors so we should listen to them when they tell us shut up and roll up your sleeve.

Crackpot anti-vaxxers
Reply to  These are the appropriate titles of these esteemed
December 21, 2021 11:33 am

Please Google any of those names and check for yourself.

Big tech censorship
Reply to  Crackpot anti-vaxxers
December 21, 2021 6:45 pm

It’s common knowledge that the Big tech giants are engaging in mass censorship and are suppressing any information that is critical of the covid jab and big pharma. The collive article admits that. Yet, you are using Google as your source of truth? I rest my case.

Frightening!!
December 21, 2021 12:50 am

Hashem Yerachem!

Woe
Reply to  Frightening!!
December 21, 2021 2:17 pm

Now imagine how “frightening” Covid is. “Hashem Yerachem” indeed.

Disgraceful
December 21, 2021 1:01 am

This is really disturbing. What next, a panel where Rabbonim listen for 8 hours to flat-earthers? And was this before R’ Osdoba’s supposed letter from his son? Because that would explain a lot.

Finally some common sense
Reply to  Disgraceful
December 21, 2021 10:05 am

Looking through these comment sections it’s rare to find someone with such common sense.

It’s about time the community and rabbonim come out and say it like it is,. The earth is flat! And I’m glad I’m not the only one that sees this.

Yes, the earth is flat.
Reply to  Finally some common sense
December 21, 2021 10:56 am

And those who don’t agree need to stop listening to mainstream video and goyishe scientists and be open to hearing both sides!
Also, Jews really do control the government. Even Tump recently said so (at least, he implied, when he was in office).

Jews in goverment
Reply to  Yes, the earth is flat.
December 22, 2021 4:07 am

Jews who do not care about religion,bringing athiest teachings trying to get rid every single religuos freedom

Trying to force the yeshivos to teach english

I do not believe they have any jewish beliefs all they do is celebrate some yomim tovim

I would not take my beliefs from them.

Like the rebbe said that a shliach should change the yid and not fall to the level of the yid.

What's really disturbing?
Reply to  Disgraceful
December 21, 2021 10:18 am

That there’s another side that you may not have heard? Gee, I thought science was all about keeping an open mind and listening to all the evidence. Not just parroting what Failure Fauci (“I am Science!”) says.

Common
Reply to  What's really disturbing?
December 21, 2021 2:25 pm

The commenter to whom you’re replying refuted your “keeping an open mind” and “listening to all the evidence” by citing flat-earthers as an analogy. Even you agree that sometimes it’s okay to ignore opposing views—which is why you probably ignore flat-earthers. Applying that to the issue at hand, because those in the medical field opposed to the covid vaccine are an extreme minority (98.4% of US physicians took—not just support—the vaccine), there’s reason to doubt its opposition. Moreover, those opposed to the vaccine have questionable and often outlandish views to begin with. For example, many of the doctors who gave… Read more »

Not the same at all
Reply to  Common
December 21, 2021 3:54 pm

The flat-earthers aren’t wrong because they’re in the minority, they’re wrong because the evidence is against them. That’s how science – the real kind, not the Fauci “I am Science” kind – works.

Your argument is little more than an appeal to authority, which is the polar opposite of science. It’s religion, and we’ve got a perfectly good one of our own that we don’t need to trade in for yours.

Common
Reply to  Not the same at all
December 21, 2021 5:49 pm

1. I never said flat-earthers are wrong because they’re a minority. I said they should be ingnored because they’re an extreme minority in the relevantly professional field. And antivaxxers should be too.

2. Science works by *professionals* analyzing relevant data, not shmos like me and you.

3. Appealing to authority is a falacy only if there is an equally reputable dissenting authority. Here, there isn’t. (I wouldn’t expect you to value my opinion as much as an architect’s concerning the structural integrity of your home—although that’s a bona fide “appeal to authority.”)

Well, then
Reply to  Common
December 21, 2021 8:15 pm
  1. By your logic, Galileo should have been ignored because he was an “extreme minority.” See, science doesn’t depend on majorities; it depends on facts, and if the minority has those on their side, then they’re the ones to follow.
  2. Fair enough. So here we have *professionals*, yet you claim we should ignore them because of point #1.
  3. Once again, you’re saying that they’re not reputable because they’re the minority. Sorry, but that ain’t science.
Common
Reply to  Well, then
December 22, 2021 11:53 am

By my logic, if Galileo was as an “extreme minority” as you claim, he should have been ignored by people like me and you.

Again, this “do your own research” is a ridiculous principle that you’d never apply to anything other than the vaccine. Can you disprove that 9/11 was an inside job? Perhaps Yitzchak Rabin was killed by the Shabak—prove me wrong!

Actually
Reply to  Common
December 22, 2021 2:56 pm

thinking people do their own research on many different things that affect their own lives. The causes of 9/11 or of the assassination of Rabin are a world away from the question of a vaccine with at best unknown side effects.

And re your first sentence – hm, so the universe actually _was_ geocentric until more people started accepting Galileo’s theories. Is that what you’re saying? Because that sounds pretty witless and unscientific to me, and probably to any normal person.

Extreme minority
Reply to  Common
December 21, 2021 8:17 pm

No we don’t ignore flat earthers because they are an extreme minority. Use your own head

Common
Reply to  Extreme minority
December 22, 2021 11:50 am

So why do you ignore flat-earthers? I’m willing to bet that you can’t prove that the earth is a sphere. Clearly, you’re relying on those who you deem to be reputable. And you probably determine “reputable” by their being the extreme professional majority

Actually
Reply to  Common
December 22, 2021 3:00 pm

It’s quite easy to demonstrate that the earth is a sphere. As far back as the Greeks, for example, it was noted that a distant object such as a ship disappears hull-first.

Now, of course, those who think that “science” is “whatever ‘I am SCIENCE!’ Fauci says m” – no critical thought involved at all – why, then, such people are also going to claim that it’s too hard to prove basic scientific facts and that there’s no choice but to rely on the “experts.”

My summary
Reply to  Common
December 22, 2021 10:04 pm

Mafias also should be ignored unless they are coming for you and your children. A lot of this video explains the frauds and the manipulation of numbers . This is enough to not feel comfortable taking an unknown and reupdated (booster) experimental product that honestly has no clear benefits on healthy population. I see it as why would I take something I don’t need? Do I work for Pfizer? Seriously I am allowed to just care about myself in this case. I am not interested in this “product”. Done. If you would put money into this then go for it…but… Read more »

Berel
Reply to  Disgraceful
December 21, 2021 10:25 am

These ‘flat-earthers’ were leaders in the field before they had a view on a hyper politicized issue in an area of world-wide panic, and a issue dead center of their area of world recognized expertise, that isn’t in favor.

You are the ‘flat-earther.’

Name-calling: SO masterful!
Reply to  Disgraceful
December 21, 2021 11:39 am

When someone starts ad hominem attacks (a.k.a. name-calling), you know they have nothing of substance to argue in their favor.

This is when it goes from earnest info-seeking to a catfight.

Let’s see: Who started in with the name calling here (“flat earthers”)??? Whomever did this has no valid argument and is resorting to a catfight here.

A concerned grandmother who is sensitive to differ
Reply to  Disgraceful
December 21, 2021 12:29 pm

Excuse me, but it’s not disgraceful to listen to opposing views, it’s disgraceful NOT TO!!

disturbing
Reply to  Disgraceful
December 21, 2021 1:30 pm

Can you articulate what you found disturbing? I find it disturbing that countless legitimized scientific and military professionals consider the vaccine a bioweapon. (I would find it concerning even it it were ust one.) Also, NASA, Air Force, Navy and all military, commercial and private flight, space and naval documentation related to application development articulate design premises including “assume a flat non-rotating earth” (which would include ICBM’s, lasers and laser guided and needless to say submarines and aircraft that never have to nose-down or up to account for curvature.) Now, if you have a question why Hashem made Malchus d”Asiya… Read more »

It’s good to hear other sides
December 21, 2021 1:16 am

At least now we are hearing some other info, without being banned thank you collive, now ppl can make their own decisions, it’s important.

What do all these speakers have I common?
Reply to  It’s good to hear other sides
December 21, 2021 11:32 am

These are people who make absurdly false claims, compare other doctors to Jozef Mengele. They’re not credible sources. If you want to shop for an opinion you can find anything you want from someone with an MD. I can even find you people with smicha who will allow you a pilegesh

The mandates
Reply to  What do all these speakers have I common?
December 21, 2021 10:35 pm

The mandates, (not the vax) are a form of avoda zara.

Daas Hatorah
December 21, 2021 1:17 am

These is a group of lunatics ,waisted 10 minutes listening to these losers

Name-calling: SO masterful!
Reply to  Daas Hatorah
December 21, 2021 11:41 am

When someone starts ad hominem attacks (a.k.a. name-calling), you know they have nothing of substance to argue in their favor.

This is when it goes from earnest info-seeking to a catfight.

Let’s see: Who started in with the name calling here (“lunatics”)??? Whomever did this has no valid argument and is resorting to a catfight here.

Twisted
December 21, 2021 1:33 am

Sad how twisted and one sided this article was written.
This is aside the fact that the roles of some of attendees is not correct.
Interesting to note that in rabbi osdobas article and this one there is link and description to rabbi Braun’s but on track Braun’s article you did not mention the fact that rabbi osdobas had his own opinion

Berel
Reply to  Twisted
December 21, 2021 10:28 am

‘Daas Torah’ as currently bandied about is a litvishe myth. It’s the framework applied to modern rabbinical utterances that have no basis in Torah. The notion is that with enough Torah study your boich svorahs have Torah legitimacy.

Write a Teshuva or perform a miracle. Until then it’s just you boich.

Embarrassing
December 21, 2021 1:35 am

This video is an embarrassment for Lubavitch

Not Just Lubavitch
Reply to  Embarrassing
December 21, 2021 2:27 pm

Frum Jews all over look ridiculous because of their disproportionate opposition to the vaccine. The only other groups equally opposed to the vaccine share the same level of education as us—next to none. vd”l

Not just Jews
Reply to  Not Just Lubavitch
December 21, 2021 6:41 pm

It’s not just Jews who are choosing to not take the vaccine. There are not Jewish people at my workplace who haven’t taken the vaccine and have told me about their friends who aren’t taking the vaccine. Good for them

If you were educated
Reply to  Not Just Lubavitch
December 21, 2021 8:22 pm

You would simply and clearly point out the error instead of saying people look ridiculous. Let the doctors speak out for themselves but this is not your debate since you also don’t know that much…

Embarassment
Reply to  Not Just Lubavitch
December 22, 2021 12:49 am

Actually, I’m in some solid telegram groups with close to a half a million. My family and no one i know are there. So easily my presence represents one in 20-50+ likeminded do the math. Yea, Crown Heights is decidedly anti-vax along with the majority of the USA. Most of the vaccinated, globally (which is still a minority despite what government and media say were coerced, plain and simple. The proof is – at some point they got off the variant/ booster bandwagon. The only Jews that look foolish are those who are pro-vax. The antisemites have a field day… Read more »

Why didn't Dr. Zev Vladimir Zelenko join?
December 21, 2021 2:09 am

I commend this group for getting together and raising awareness. Hopefully truth will emerge.

Although probably not the popular opinion, I think that the truth probably lies somewhere in the middle of all this mess; the benefits of the vax outweigh the risk for some, especially the elderly and those with compromised immune systems, and the risks outweigh the benefits for the young and healthy. Generally, people for whom the risks outweigh the benefits should not get vaxxed to protect others; but there may be exceptions.

He has a new battle
Reply to  Why didn't Dr. Zev Vladimir Zelenko join?
December 21, 2021 2:28 pm

Recently, Dr. Zelenko took up fighting the Illuminate. There are only so many holy fights brave people like him can take at once

Lol
Reply to  Why didn't Dr. Zev Vladimir Zelenko join?
December 21, 2021 7:21 pm

Because he’s a quack who went off the deep end!

Shehecheyanu Lizman Hazeh
December 21, 2021 2:18 am

Boruch Hashem that the facts are finally being presented. Hopefully this will help
the people to understand what going on. May Hashem send MOSHIACH NOW!

A clown show
December 21, 2021 2:20 am

This is embarrassing

Why did Dr Zelenko not testify?
December 21, 2021 2:20 am

Dr. Zev (Vladimir) Zelenko, a Lubavitcher chossid, pioneered early treatment for COVID that saved many lives. Why did he not testify at this event?

Dr who
Reply to  Why did Dr Zelenko not testify?
December 21, 2021 9:23 am

Because he had no qualifications

Dr zelenko
Reply to  Why did Dr Zelenko not testify?
December 21, 2021 9:53 am

Dr zelenko has testified before to rabbonim. Last i heard he has been quite ill which would be why he wasnt there to testify

don't you ever wonder
Reply to  Why did Dr Zelenko not testify?
December 21, 2021 10:59 am

how come there aren’t an army of our own frum doctors lining up behind dr zelenko?

NO group think
Reply to  don't you ever wonder
December 21, 2021 12:29 pm

As a medical professional who’s father is a physician with 50+ years of medical practice , and a host of siblings also physicians, I’ll give you an opinion why “how come there aren’t an army of our own frum doctors lining up behind dr zelenko”

 Most medical personnel subscribe to group think. If the AMA endorses these vaccines , then the physicians push that agenda. Most MD’s dont do their own research or investigate the opposite side. To give the benefit of the doubt, most can’t use search engines to find out the other side since it’s not allowed.

So you're saying
Reply to  NO group think
December 21, 2021 2:01 pm

that out of tens of thousands of frum doctors there isn’t even a tiny fraction who have integrity? not even a tiny fraction know how to use search engines??
C’mon!

What do all these speakers have I common?
Reply to  Why did Dr Zelenko not testify?
December 21, 2021 11:34 am

He pioneered nothing. He claims he pioneered. He says that the Israeli government is worse than the Nazis and Stalin and has said that a parent who vaccinates their child against covid should be executed. These are the “experts” leading the anti vaxx movement.

Rabbi Braun
December 21, 2021 3:26 am

Rabbi Braun was very clear
All these conspirative theories are bobbo mayses for naive ppl

Name-calling: SO masterful!
Reply to  Rabbi Braun
December 21, 2021 11:43 am

When someone starts ad hominem attacks (a.k.a. name-calling), you know they have nothing of substance to argue in their favor.

This is when it goes from earnest info-seeking to a catfight.

Let’s see: Who started in with the name calling here (“bubbe meisos for naive people”)??? Whomever did this has no valid argument and is resorting to a catfight here.

so now...
December 21, 2021 3:42 am

The government is going to mysteriously get rid of these dr’s?

SMH
Reply to  so now...
December 21, 2021 9:29 am

Halevai!

Yes.
Reply to  so now...
December 21, 2021 11:02 am

Harav hagoan Doniel Green is secretly and heroically working with inbedded heros of the government who seem to be in favor of the govenment but are secretly plotting to finally get rid of all the democrats who are pro-vaccine, and in every community to get rid of the evil and murderous pro-vaxers, and he is in charge of doing it in our community. His brother may not be harav hagoan, but he’s heroically putting himself at risk to help in this valiant effort.

Ummmmm what?
Reply to  Yes.
December 21, 2021 7:25 pm

You mean the former shliach who took to conspiracy theories and psychotic rhetoric about science, of which he has no credentials, instead of, you know, helping Jews in their Yiddishkeit, which was his JOB!? Yeah, such a gaon. Mamish unbelievable.

You are kidding
Reply to  Yes.
December 21, 2021 8:29 pm

Green? He is a sick and dangerous man. He doesn’t give his poor kids any vaccines. Pays off Drs who make things up. I’d listen to a witch Dr before him. Does nothing. Knows nothing and people listen to him? Next time
you get sick ask him for advice but write your will first

Dr. Malone’s video- he invented the vaccine
December 21, 2021 4:04 am

Why children should not be vaccinated is explained in the video.

He did NOT invent the vaccine
Reply to  Dr. Malone’s video- he invented the vaccine
December 21, 2021 10:21 am

Nor did he invent the technology it relies on.

What do all these speakers have I common?
Reply to  Dr. Malone’s video- he invented the vaccine
December 21, 2021 11:36 am

Malone ha said that older people SHOULD get vaccinated. Then he claims that this is the “greatest experiment in history”. He’s a quack. He can’t even pretend to be professional.

Moshe Haber
December 21, 2021 4:16 am

Why are you taking sides?? The differences among the Rabbonim have been resolved.

Berel
Reply to  Moshe Haber
December 21, 2021 10:36 am

You can’t wish things into being.

Thank you
December 21, 2021 5:51 am

Kol Hakavod

Unfortunate Majority is NOT Always Correct
December 21, 2021 6:06 am

The Facts have been manipulated specially by the media and politicians across the globe The importance to check the facts based on pure (not manipulated) pressure it extremely Crucial , The Torah says clearly the Beis Din has a responsibility (MUST) listen/hear both sides before (rushing) proceeding to a conclusion/ judgment… Everyone has been under tremendous pressures from the outside/overwhelming global powers to move ONLY in one direction and removing the LEGAL choices from all individual to practice some std necessary rightful (Neutral) due diligence. If right or wrong choices were made, we all need to know/understand why/how did it… Read more »

Vaccine
December 21, 2021 7:07 am

Can you post the full video of what they all said would love to see it

It's right there
Reply to  Vaccine
December 21, 2021 9:32 am

At end

If you can't question it, then it's not science
December 21, 2021 7:47 am

Collive first acknowledged that there is widespread censorship on this issue by mentioning how big tech companies try to suppress any information that is critical to the covid jab. Doctors are also threatened with job loss and imprisonment if they don’t toe the government line.

So it is simply disingenuous for Collive to conclude that we must follow the “majority” of doctors by getting the jab…how do we know what the majority of doctors think if there is no free discussion on this topic and doctors are being threatened?

Common sense
Reply to  If you can't question it, then it's not science
December 21, 2021 11:39 am

Gotta love how the fact that social media companies are censoring is proof against the leading experts that the vaccine is safe and effective. What’s the kesher? You’ll listen to every fringe conspiracy theory just because it was censored by the blue bird app?

If you can't question it, then it's not science
Reply to  Common sense
December 21, 2021 6:15 pm

Try re-reading my comment again. I never mentioned anything about “proof against the leading experts that the vaccine is safe and effective.” I simply stated that we cannot determine what the true majority consensus is among medical professionals regarding the covid jab, when there is mass censorship and no free discussion (doctors are muzzled and threatened with job loss etc). Claiming that the majority of doctors endorse the jab in an environment where doctors are muzzled is akin to claiming that the overwhelming majority of North Koreans had elected Kim Jong Un to represent them. But since you brought up… Read more »

Well, now
December 21, 2021 7:50 am

Are all the naysayers, who keep claiming that those opposing the mandate are “anti-science” and have no evidence other than social media posts, going to fess up and admit that it’s not so?

Doubtful. Because it seems that at least for some of them it’s not about public health, but about being able to look down their noses at their fellow Jews.

They made up their opinion beforehand
December 21, 2021 8:09 am

If they don’t sit down now for an additional 8 hours to hear pro vaccine testimony or a rebuttal, then it’s all partisan and therefore a fake bies din.
They made up their opinion before hearing their testimony

Why are you calling them Anti Vaxx?
December 21, 2021 8:19 am

To my humble opinion no one of woke up in the morning and said ” I want to be anti something what can I choose?… oh there is a new vaccine let me be against it” Those are people that heard/saw/witnessed different experiences and wand to bring it up. Collive sounds like you are all in the vaccine and canceling all others who things different. P.s. is good to know that YouTube and Facebook are your social media Poseks. If they nam something it means that is treif. Hashem should open our eyes to see the truth which Moshiach is… Read more »

Majority?
December 21, 2021 8:20 am

Seriously? Not what Rebbe told me about my surgery. This presentation is a very serious and brings many questions. And if you afraid of questions you know you are wrong

Fake News
December 21, 2021 8:32 am

So a fake “Rabbinical” panel heard from fake medical experts a bunch of fake concerns. Where’s the news in this?

These experts are the real deal
Reply to  Fake News
December 21, 2021 9:26 am

What makes anyone here fake??

Dovid
December 21, 2021 8:38 am

What an embarrassment.

Where are our doctors?
December 21, 2021 8:45 am

Why didn’t any of our local esteemed CH doctors testify in this forum?

because it's not real
Reply to  Where are our doctors?
December 21, 2021 9:57 am

this “forum” isn’t based off of science, and any real doctor wouldn’t stoop so low as to participate.

Because the truth hurts
Reply to  Where are our doctors?
December 21, 2021 11:01 am

It would be very embarrassing for them to publicize the harm they did here….

I fear that Rabbonom will lose their credibility
December 21, 2021 8:50 am

Beside of not giving a clear message either people should vaccinate or not. Also avoiding so many testimonies can make the people trust them less.

It would be great that instead of those “little known rabbis” (as you described them) handle the 8 hr testimony that the WELL KNOWN RABBIS” will do so. It will make me and other people around to feel that the Rabbonim heard all.

Recently in Israel
Reply to  I fear that Rabbonom will lose their credibility
December 21, 2021 11:09 am

Harav Kaminietsky did just that! He took a whole lot of evidence from a group of women, and presented it to the medical people whom he trusts. He concluded that their ‘evidence’ was no evidence at all! He said his entire family, his c hildren and grandchildren anbd great grandchildren are all vaccinated and so should every single Jew!

Listen to R' Braun
Reply to  I fear that Rabbonom will lose their credibility
December 21, 2021 2:31 pm

He pretty much said anyone who doesn’t have the expertise should not be listening to the kofrim.

CH has 1 beis din. Who are the rabbis in this video?

Reality
Reply to  I fear that Rabbonom will lose their credibility
December 22, 2021 7:38 pm

This happened two months ago on כ’ חשון on the very day the FDA approved the injection for children the entire context was coersing children since children cannot advocate for themselves, the Rabbanim deal with Taharas HaMishpacha so they wanted to hear any data on pru vervu. Other Doctors from the community and different opinions were asked. However the question what is the evidence of potential mechanisms of damage when it comes to children etc.

Keep learning
December 21, 2021 8:56 am

Why wasnt dr rosen and other mainstream doctors in crown heights on the call
And rabbi braun..
Are they afraid to listen to those who think different
Maybe if they were on the call and could explain why they still hold to push vaccine… I can trust them more
But for now I will trust people who are willing to learn and grow

Hello
Reply to  Keep learning
December 21, 2021 12:08 pm

Are the Crown Heights doctors vaccine experts?
The issue is the mandates – doctors are in fear for their licenses and people are in fear for their jobs.

A disgrace
December 21, 2021 8:56 am

this is shameful, all these “rabbis” and “doctors” should lose their jobs.

for sure
Reply to  A disgrace
December 21, 2021 8:33 pm

that is how we keep checks and balances on scientific knowledge any one who is open to a dissenting view shut him up!

Lies
December 21, 2021 8:58 am

lies and lies and lies and lies and on and on and on and on.

haha
December 21, 2021 9:02 am

as if those rabbis understood half of what those words mean.

this panel is a joke.

Col
December 21, 2021 9:08 am

Col, you don’t give the doctors the proper credit when you list their credentials,
For example Dr. Malone INVENTED the mRNA technology…

No ture
Reply to  Col
December 21, 2021 9:35 am

mRNA was researched by many people over 40 years. He’s taking credit for it as if he’s Jonas Salk

Dr Malone IS one of the Pioneers of MRNA Tech
Reply to  No ture
December 21, 2021 3:14 pm

Since the mid 80’s he knows what he is talking about and hes not anti vax MRNA is not a vaccine it may be used in an emergency as a quick substitute only for those high risk. Hes only against giving it to children and young people.

Thanks COL
December 21, 2021 9:11 am

Thank you for publishing this.

You made a mistake in putting the words rabbinical court in quotation marks, because 3 rabbis do make a court, and yes, they were hearing testimony relevant in halacha.

These are highly trained in their fields. I would have left Northrup out, but she’s the only one who has some strange ideas that may seem to undermine whatever medical truths she may say.
Don’t let your emotions- and wish for the evidence presented by these experts to be false- sway you. Listen up, bc their warnings are not political or financial. They are medical.

Community member
December 21, 2021 9:26 am

What exactly does it mean when rabbis hear “testimony” (opinions) of doctors/pharmacists/chiropractors?
Did the rabbis agree? Was it a form of research? Or perhaps a way to gain knowledge of an opposing opinion, to know how to counter it?
Belittling them only (might) makes sense if they issue an opinion, very ambiguous (and perhaps misleading the rabbis real stances?)

crazy!
December 21, 2021 9:27 am

this is pure insanity!

Name-calling: SO masterful!
Reply to  crazy!
December 21, 2021 11:48 am

When someone starts ad hominem attacks (a.k.a. name-calling), you know they have nothing of substance to argue in their favor.

This is when it goes from earnest info-seeking to a catfight.

Let’s see: Who started in with the name calling here (“insanity”)??? Whomever did this has no valid argument and is resorting to a catfight here.

Todres
December 21, 2021 9:39 am

Perhaps the rabbis opinions should be verified. There was a follow up session, that was only attended by some of the rabbi’s (did the others refuse to attend after being at the first?!)

Enough!
December 21, 2021 9:39 am

Could these people please stop embarrassing themselves and Chabad!

This is cringe worthy!

Enough already!

Omicron
December 21, 2021 9:44 am

How many people in the USA have died until today from OMICRON?
Answer: ZERO
And if we listen to Biden and Fauci you would think that many thousands have died so far.

um no
Reply to  Omicron
December 21, 2021 10:10 am

don’t you remember in march 2020 that it took a week or two after everyone got it for the deaths and hospitalizations (R”L) to start happening? well this variant is less than a week or two old.

and by the way… read this: https://www.reuters.com/world/us/texas-health-officials-record-first-death-related-omicron-variant-abc-news-2021-12-21/

Um, yes
Reply to  um no
December 21, 2021 12:47 pm

First of all, it’s not “less than a week old”; it was reported at the end of November. Which is about a month ago. If you can’t get basic facts like that correct, why should anyone listen to anything else you say? Second, it may be true that it took a few weeks for the deaths r”l, but the hospitalizations had started right away. Here, nothing. As for your Reuters article, did you notice that they called it “linked to” Omicron? In other words, there’s no evidence whatsoever that he actually died from it, just that he had it. In… Read more »

Woman Witness?
December 21, 2021 9:46 am

Are woman even allowed to testify to beis din?

Doesn’t matter
Reply to  Woman Witness?
December 21, 2021 10:45 am

This isn’t a real Beis Din. And listening to a woman is the least of their problems.

What is wrong with people??
December 21, 2021 10:05 am

You anti-vaxxers are killing people. You may get Covid & be fine, even asymptomatic. But you can transmit a STRONG strain to others – the elderly, the immunocompromised & others – and THEY could be very sick & even die. Being vaccinated does not remove the possibility of transmission…but it greatly reduces the impact it can have on vulnerable people. Yes, being vaxed does not guarantee you won’t get Covid (I was vaxed & still got it.) But MY symptoms were so minor I didn’t realize I had it for a few days, and after a week it was gone.… Read more »

YES!
Reply to  What is wrong with people??
December 21, 2021 10:37 am

Amazing! Thank you for writing this!

Hello?
Reply to  What is wrong with people??
December 21, 2021 11:38 am

My getting vaxxed doesn’t protect anyone besides me, so stop the guilt tripping, and stop threatening people with their jobs!

Aha
Reply to  What is wrong with people??
December 21, 2021 12:49 pm

“MY symptoms were so minor.” So now we see what it’s all about; ME, ME, ME. That there are people whose symptoms from the vaccine weren’t so “minor” doesn’t seem to matter to you in the slightest.

Conversely, lots of people who got Covid also had minor symptoms. Heck, quite a lot had no symptoms at all. Yet you keep on treating it as though it were the Black Death.

Pls state facts to support your well written ...
Reply to  What is wrong with people??
December 21, 2021 6:55 pm

facts pls

What did the Rabbis conclude
December 21, 2021 10:10 am

Where can you find the conclusion of Rabbis Osdabo Bluming and Kasimov!
We know what those experts say what about the Rabbis

The younger rabbi osdoba
Reply to  What did the Rabbis conclude
December 21, 2021 11:14 am

is being manipulated by his wife who is vehemently anti-vax. Please do check out her medical and scientific credentials.

Crown Heights Doctors
December 21, 2021 10:13 am

It will be very helpful if our local crown heights doctors will have a webinar explaining by each age the necessity or option to be vaccinated.
Rabbi Braun implies he has vaccinated his 5 yr old, is this the opinion of our local doctors?
If your child or you as an adult is Ch’v sick you see your doctor but if you haven’t there should be statements from our doctors.

There is no such halacha
December 21, 2021 10:24 am

that says to go by the majority of doctors. The Torah says a beis din should decide according to the majority of its members. It says no such thing about doctors, and neither does any other source of halacha. When it comes to witnesses the halacha is “two is equal to one hundred”. And when it comes to doctors you don’t even need two; one doctor is just as good as 100 or 1000.

Doctors are as witnesses
Reply to  There is no such halacha
December 21, 2021 10:56 am

2=100

See Alter Rebbe’s Shulchan Aruch 618:5

Igros Kodesh
Reply to  There is no such halacha
December 21, 2021 11:36 am

See the Rebbe’s letter dated gimmel Teves 5738 – it’s against Halacha to take a politically driven medical treatment.

Please reference
Reply to  Igros Kodesh
December 21, 2021 8:33 pm

Which chelek is it in?

Screenshot
Reply to  Please reference
December 21, 2021 10:28 pm

The screenshot going around has Yud’ Sof Shin Lamed Vov at the top.

I don't know...
December 21, 2021 10:45 am

A veterinarian, ophthalmologist, plastic surgeon -no thanks. The true experts are the ones that we should follow. Even Trump got his booster.

You're an anti-Trumper!
Reply to  I don't know...
December 21, 2021 11:16 am

It’s not true that he got his booster. The video that shows him saying so is fake. It’s meant to sow division among his supporters. He would never agree to the vaccine, and especially not hte booster. This just goes to show how low the media will stoop to discredit him.
FAKE NEWS

Baloney
Reply to  You're an anti-Trumper!
December 21, 2021 1:29 pm

The man actually spearheaded the effort to develop vaccines in record time (and for his trouble he was pooh-poohed by those who claimed that it’s impossible, and prominent Democrat politicians, for example the current vice president, said that they’d never take a “Trump vaccine” and that no one else should either).

Unlike you, though, he believes in free choice in this matter, rather unlike those who trumpet “my body, my choice” only when it comes to abortion but demand that you follow their choices in everything else.

Trump
Reply to  Baloney
December 22, 2021 12:58 am

By making a difficult wartime decision, he forced the enemy to play their cards earlier than they wanted, and in the process, the hypocrisy and lies of big pharma have been exposed. Trump made everyone aware of the therapeutics that work to treat Covid-19 starting back in March 2020. Spanish Flu ended WW1. When he says it could have killed as many – he means to say that he stopped WWIV by exposing the evil for what it is. Was their any lack of information out there for one to make an informed decision now that we’ve identified all the… Read more »

Great Laugh!
Reply to  You're an anti-Trumper!
December 21, 2021 2:38 pm

Thank you for making me laugh and putting a smile on my face 🙂

Even your title is misinformation not anti vaxx.
December 21, 2021 10:45 am

Most people are ok with vaccines as am I. The Pfiser product being coerced upon people or lose thier jobs and freedoms is not a vaccine.

Also why should one with natural immunity have to take a failing shot which requires repeated boosters, doesnt stop the spread nor protect you from catching it?

Your title should read ‘vaccine hesitant’, where theres very good reason to be hesitant.

Threatened
Reply to  Even your title is misinformation not anti vaxx.
December 21, 2021 7:49 pm

Yes this is a factual statement and it’s not black and white

Open Minded
December 21, 2021 10:57 am

I was open minded at the beginning of the debate and watched a video by Dr Christiane Northrup. She is a nut!!! Ranted on about the govt injecting people with chips to send back information, etc. A real fantasy out of science fiction land!
If the vaccine is dangerous, why have more than 99% of doctors and medical researchers AND THEIR FAMILIES gotten vaccinated??

Chips
Reply to  Open Minded
December 21, 2021 11:33 am

There was a mainstream article that the chip technology is now ready.

Check it out
Reply to  Chips
December 21, 2021 2:24 pm
Check it out
Reply to  Check it out
December 21, 2021 4:07 pm

Asking sincerely – whoever downvoted this link, please explain why.

Do not believe
Reply to  Check it out
December 22, 2021 4:35 am

While i believe the vaccine is not helpfull and not safe

I do not believe the whole theory about about the chip

And it ruins the vallitity of the vaccine hesitant

Bring the facts the way how you see it
Not the theory what might be true and might not be true but there is no way to prove

There is storys the vaccine gave people covid and died

There is claims that the vaccine made people lose baby
Those could be proven

Chips is a theory i could true but there is no way to prove

Theory?
Reply to  Do not believe
December 22, 2021 11:26 am

Google embedded chips in humans and see for yourself that it’s already being done.

Its ready
Reply to  Open Minded
December 21, 2021 1:48 pm

They already started testing the microchip in Sweden. Look it up. Glad you think its science fiction. Same as all the other conspiracy theories that came true.

Amazing that
December 21, 2021 11:01 am

They are taking time to listen to the other side,which is usually suppressed

To all u pro vaxxers that keep wishing harm on others who dont- u really make us question ur integrity, ur motivations and ur reasoning in general.

Fed up BT
Reply to  Amazing that
December 22, 2021 5:09 am

Hi, as a BT I choose to join the Chabad community over several others once I was fully observant. I did so based on their ongoing emphasis of childrens chinuch and ahavas yisrael ! The entire Chabad foundation was based on that and I wanted to be a part of it!! I got married and we made a beautiful family . Fast forward the last 3 years! I never , ever ever could have envisioned that short term , medically defined as non fatal childhood illnesses would be the cause of such division hostility amoung those devoted to the Rebbe.… Read more »

As a bas BT
Reply to  Fed up BT
December 22, 2021 8:57 pm

Yes, I will always be looked at as a bas BT, even though I’m “told” otherwise, please remember you became BT for Hashem, not for the actions of man. Man will disappoint you A LOT so remember I did this for Hashem and our Rebbe, that will hold you forever!

The who is who of anti-vaxxers
December 21, 2021 11:17 am

They have handpicked 20 anti-vaxxers but don’t mention that the rest of all the doctors, scientists, epidemiologists in the world are saying to get vaxxed.
If you want to know the truth, look at the percentages of vaxxed to unvaxxed in hospital and ICU.
Not rocket science

very true
Reply to  The who is who of anti-vaxxers
December 21, 2021 1:38 pm

80 percent of hospitalizations right now are unvaccinated

crown heights
Reply to  very true
December 21, 2021 9:04 pm

not true

My friends got this new variant and unvaccinated
Reply to  very true
January 4, 2022 12:44 pm

I also have friends who are vaccinated and got it the same as the unvaccinated

FOR THOSE WHO HAVE A PROBLEM WITH THIS?
December 21, 2021 11:24 am

What happened with “Talk to your doctor.”…yet your physician hands you dissenting studies? More to the point: why are you getting angry at patients for listening to the spectrum of expert opinion. Until literally yesterday these experts where considered some of the greatest medical opinions by everyone, so what changed? They don’t share your opinion! They are not the doctors you would like to listen to. So unless you can argue the facts that they show, and all you do is get all emotional, and begin to discredit and name calling. Just breathe….. and try to use your logic! We… Read more »

What do all these speakers have I common?
December 21, 2021 11:26 am

They all are known contrarians to the vaccine, and no other experts were brought in. Is this an exercise in finding the unbiased facts, or an attempt to be convinced that the conspiracy theories are true?

little-known rabbis in Brooklyn??!!
December 21, 2021 11:39 am

What??! Rabbis Bluming, Kasimov & Osdoba are the next generation Rabbonim in CH.

Not "vaxxed and unvaxxed"; it should be...
December 21, 2021 11:58 am

The immune and the not-yet-immune. ============ But even then, it’s not a fight or a competition. We protect the vulnerable with love and compassion, and we let ALL who are immune (regardless of how they got that way!) live a normal life. Nearly every time a person who favors the vaccine hears the words “natural immunity,” they either change the subject or start in with the name calling. When I hear a pro-vaccine physician acknowledge natural immunity as being as good or better than merely being vaxxed, THEN we can talk. Until then, this sniping and screaming and alienation of… Read more »

B”H! Signs of intelligent life in CH!
December 21, 2021 12:15 pm

When the only way vaccines can get some positive PR , is by bribery or coercion…. One should at least be open to wondering why… Those above presented are the ones that not only don’t rely on corrupt govt health agencies to spoonfeed them fictitious data & almost fatal protocols (think Remdesivir & ventilators), they are on the frontlines of peer reviewed studies that produce protocols that work! They have bravely jumped into the sea of corruption (against the mainstream current), in order to expose the truth…. In the end truth always wins…. And if it seems NOT…. It’s becuz… Read more »

Mazel Tov!
December 21, 2021 12:41 pm

ב”ה

It’s completely outrageous and scandalous that Сollive took almost 2 month(!) to publicize information related to multiple rabbinical conferences held around the world over the past few months. Better later than never. Congratulation on deciding to provide more balanced information.

so happy to see
December 21, 2021 12:45 pm

THESE SAME RABBONIM MOVED AS QUICKLY TO RECTIFY THE AGUNAH SITUATION! THEY CREATED A BEIS DIN, HEARD TESTIMONY AND CAME UP WITH SOLUTIONS

EYE ROLLS
December 21, 2021 1:26 pm

This just proves how people dont use their logic. Vaccinate dont vaccinate….your own choice , but a Beis DIn to only listen to one side of the story, doesnt seem a true beis din. We are not a stupid nation,

Big tech censorship
Reply to  EYE ROLLS
December 21, 2021 6:48 pm

They are listening to the side that is being suppressed, muzzled and censored. Whereas the other sides perspective is widely known because they are not subjected to any type of censorship

Sometimes
December 21, 2021 1:27 pm

Halacha requires us to act or do things we really don’t like

But halacha also requires us to love our fellow despite difference of opinions or if one isn’t following the way of Torah , or a dinner.

Both are really challenging to face and act apon

Every decision we make creates our future and plays out our denstiny

I'd like to know
December 21, 2021 1:27 pm

b
B”H
In this world where there are shortage of workers, when will the yetzer hara quit and stop all this machlokes from happening? The main issue is the lack of shalom this vaccine or lack of it is causing. We want Moshiach now!

Thank you
December 21, 2021 1:28 pm

To the rabbis who are giving guidance those looking for guidance…
Much appreciated!

What
December 21, 2021 1:30 pm

Doesn’t seem that these Rabbonim of the panel – Paskened anything?

They just heard testimony

Omicron
December 21, 2021 2:05 pm

Important reminder:
Bear in mind that when the media says an unvaccinated person was this or that , it can also mean a vaccinated person who was vaccinated more than 6 months ago.
עלמא דשיקרא at its best.

חברה קדישא
December 21, 2021 4:08 pm

This is great! I’d love to see our rabbanim weigh in on some other important and contentious topics. For example, Shinichi Mochizuki claims to have solved the abc conjecture using inter-universal Teichmuller (yemach shmoi) theory but Peter Scholze claims to have discovered a “serious and unfixable gap” (https://www.quantamagazine.org/titans-of-mathematics-clash-over-epic-proof-of-abc-conjecture-20180920/). Maybe Rabbis Osdoba and Heller can settle this matter and bring me some nachas ruach! Also, if they have some time left over from their study of microbiology, population statistics, and arithmetic geometry, perhaps they can turn their attention to linguistics and help us figure out, once and for all, if the… Read more »

And guess what?
Reply to  חברה קדישא
December 21, 2021 8:21 pm

When people are going to be bullied regarding those theories, when people are going to be threatened with the loss of their jobs if they accept (or don’t accept) them, when certain self-proclaimed “experts” are going to claim that halachah mandates following (or not following) them, then yes, it will be time for the Rabbonim to weigh in. Absent all of that, your post amounts to saying that you don’t really care about what people have to deal with in the real world.

Not the Torah way
December 21, 2021 6:41 pm

Since when Rabbonim/Dayonim listen – and for 8 hours – to only one side – the anti-vaxxer – and not the other side – the vast majority of medical experts who support the vaccine (at least for another 8 hours)?
Besides, a panel should have BOTH sides at the same table at the same time so one can refute the other.
This is the way is done Al Pi Din.
Now instead, their mind is contaminated with all the garbage of the Shofchei Domim anti-vaxxer and tomorrow we going to hear some biased ruling …

How do you know?
Reply to  Not the Torah way
December 21, 2021 7:42 pm

Perhaps they already heard the other side. Don Lchaf Zchus.

The other side
Reply to  Not the Torah way
December 21, 2021 9:21 pm

Would never join such a forum with known “anti-vaxxers”. Hence why the forum is one sided.

Rabbi Green
December 21, 2021 7:45 pm

The man who encouraged minyonim during the height of Corona in Nissan 5780 when people where dying left, right and center. Sorry but I can’t follow such a man.

Mottel
December 21, 2021 9:02 pm

Shameful conspiracy theories like this, that run against science and thus against halacha and thus the Rebbe’s whole approach to medicine have no place in this community.

Dr. who trusts the Drs. who got fired for antivax
Reply to  Mottel
December 22, 2021 1:17 am

Noach was also a conspiracy theorist who kept saying for 120 years that there would be a flood,
Until it started to rain…

Thank you Rabbi Green!
December 21, 2021 9:31 pm

We need more Rabbis like him

Who should you listen to?
December 21, 2021 9:38 pm

Who would you rather listen to? A) Doctors who are blindly following orders of the CDC and FDA who are funded and controlled by the globalists with an openly stated mission of ensuring that every human being have a digital ID (currently in the form of a QR code and soon a microchip if they CH”V succeed). B) World-renowned doctors and virologists risking their reputations by breaking away from the narrative in sole effort to save people from unnecessary vaccines, especially children and those with natural immunity, which may ultimately be our only hope for herd immunity. Who would you… Read more »

Medical Examiner
December 21, 2021 9:53 pm

The only one who can determine cause of death is a medical examiner after a proper autopsy, did these lunatics bring even one proof from a medical examiner’s autopsy about the thousand and thousand of people “who died” from the vaccine.
what a Bitul Zman

If you can't question it, then it's not science
Reply to  Medical Examiner
December 22, 2021 12:24 am

Do you apply the “correlation does not lead to causation argument” to all of the reported “covid death” numbers? Did the medical examiner get a final say on all of the people who either died from other pre-existing health conditions or died of starvation, neglect or malpractice (as happened to many elderly people) but were listed as “covid deaths?”

NEW REVELATION !!!
December 21, 2021 10:07 pm

it was just put out that rabbis chyrek and kosimuv are of the opinion that the vast majority SHOULD get vaccinated. only a select few with certain medical conditions should consult with doc. as its POSSIBLE the vaccine could pose such people risk. this conclusion was UNANIMOUS amongst this rabbinic panel. (YES EVEN GREEN), why you anti vaxxers getting excited without knowing concluision ?!!

100% ACCURATE
Reply to  NEW REVELATION !!!
December 21, 2021 11:40 pm

I JUST SAW THIS LETTER AS WELL. everyone pls verify THE FACTS. dont rely on some nameless anti vaxers telling you what the rabbis concluded.

Lie
Reply to  NEW REVELATION !!!
December 22, 2021 12:08 am

It’s a LIE that this panel of Rabbi’s concluded that everyone should take this dangerous shot.

Anyone who tries to coerce others to take this potentially lethal injection, has blood on his hands.

Bitul Zman
Reply to  Lie
December 22, 2021 12:35 am

so they listen to the anti vaxers for 8 hours and then they left without issuing an opinion , why didn’t they make another 8 hour video of what they think

100% ACCURATE
Reply to  Lie
December 22, 2021 5:27 pm

TO MR LIE:
very easy to deny and pronounce as lies whatever we dont like. doesnt sound very intelligent.

Statement from rabbis Chyrek and Kosimov?
Reply to  NEW REVELATION !!!
December 22, 2021 8:23 am

Do you have a statement from rabbis Chyrek and Rabbi Kasimov stating that most people should get vaccinated? Interesting that you state that they hold that only people with medical conditions should consult their doctor to inquire whether they maybe shouldn’t. Many who were injured by the vaccine had no previous medical history.

THE RABBONIM NEVER SAID THEY AGREE WITH THIS
December 21, 2021 10:44 pm

The RABBONIM didn’t give an end answer. They were asked to listen to something, and very possibly felt disagreeable and therefor didn’t state their positions.

Bitul Zman
Reply to  THE RABBONIM NEVER SAID THEY AGREE WITH THIS
December 22, 2021 12:54 am

the Rabbonim should make another 8 hour video of their deliberations and post it here

INtellectual honesty
December 21, 2021 11:32 pm

I have yet to read, see or hear one debate between peers (rabbis to rabbis, doctors to doctors, politicians to politicians, industry professionals, etc. or cross pollinated debates), not one, in which the conversation remains logical, and but it always slips into strawman arguments, red herrings, personalizing, ad hominems, etc. Of course, it’s hard to encounter a debate about any topic that stays logical and scientific and true to academic standards, but COVID and vaxing and masks has upped the ante tenfold, as to the impossibility to dialogues meaningfully. probably because there’s more unknown than known, and very few people… Read more »

embarrasment
December 22, 2021 6:52 am

This is a joke and an embarrassment to frum Jews bichlal and Chabad b’prat.

The panel is a group of Rabbis (and even balabatim) not Poskim and certainly not Gedolei Haposkim. It can hardly be called a Beis Din.

The recognised Gedolei Haposkim have all encouraged the vaccine. Only random, unknown or “small-time” Batei Din have come out against the vaccine.

Rabbi Braun’s Psak is correct. Halacha follows majority, mainstream medical opinion. Not lone medical voices.

Reality
Reply to  embarrasment
December 22, 2021 7:53 pm

Veiw Choshen Mishpat ch 3 any three can take testimony and it is recorded so you can research for yourself

Bitul Zman
Reply to  Reality
December 22, 2021 10:28 pm

yes but they didn’t make another 8 hour video of the deliberations

Bitul Zman
Reply to  embarrasment
December 22, 2021 10:26 pm

Very well said ,every random rabbi or chiropractor wants to argue with Rabbi Braun of CH Bais din,and Rabbi Yeroslowsky the av Beis din of Chabad in Israel, a shanda and Chillul Hashem for Chabad, stop this and listen to the real Rabbonim

Mandates Violate Precautionary Principle
December 22, 2021 6:53 am

The precautionary principle, proposed as a new guideline in environmental decision making, has four central components:

1) Taking preventive action in the face of uncertainty

2)shifting the burden of proof to the proponents of an activity

3)Exploring a wide range of alternatives to possibly harmful actions;
3)increasing public participation in decision making.

Shameful propaganda doctors
December 22, 2021 8:07 am

There will always be fringe Here’s the funny thing for all you anti Vaxxers out there Someone in your family gd forbid, gets cancer diabetes or has a heart attack, you are going to the top in Cornell or whatever but you ain’t calling some Chiropractor r from Wichita Kansas to get a fringe opinion. I’d like to trust that same doctor now abs thing he’s not stupid enough to be swayed and convinced of medical malpractice with vaccine recommendations. Good luck to all the chiropractor loving people out there – I mean it. Gd bless ‘em all, but hypocritical… Read more »

Here's the funnier thing
Reply to  Shameful propaganda doctors
December 22, 2021 11:44 am

that you think that there’s any comparison between cancer, diabetes or a heart attack, which have high death rates, and Wuhan Flu, which even in the aggregate (and that’s including all the elderly, obese and immunocompromised) has a death rate far below 1%. Or that there’s any comparison between actually having any of those things, vs. the paranoia that you _might_ get Wuhan Flu and _might_ be one of the relatively few who get seriously ill from it.

uvchein?
December 23, 2021 10:15 pm

What was the result of this meeting?

Akiva T.
January 2, 2022 1:57 am

The SARS CoV2 virus was never isolated and proven to cause disease. Dr. Andrew Kaufman has done research on this subject. See his lectures on odysee.com and other uncensored platforms. Search for the video “The Emperor has no Corona”. It is not a mitzvah to be a sheep.

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