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Wednesday, 17 Iyyar, 5779
  |  May 22, 2019

    Tznius Campaign Gone too Far

    From the COLlive Inbox: What happens when a Crown Heights woman finds herself being harassed on the street by a "tznius defender"? Full Story

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    yossi
    Guest
    yossi

    if anyone harasses my family i will hunt them down and knock him out on the street. if someone wants to make a point or educate the community of their values, they can do so in a non threatening manner. anyone that threatens, harasses, or acts inappropriate to someone”s wife or daughter deserves a lesson in values from me.

    He's a nutjob
    Guest
    He's a nutjob

    Someone knows who this creep is. He needs to be stopped.

    That said, you may THINK you’re almost OK, but “almost” isn’t enough. Start dressing like a Bas Chabad & all negative comments will stop. It’s your choice.

    tzadkik
    Guest
    tzadkik

    don’t offend others and you won’t be harrased

    the real yossi
    Guest
    the real yossi

    it can never go to far, just like those running round without beards and short skirts have no limits the tznius police should act without any limits

    free country
    Guest
    free country

    lady, next time call the cops and press charges for harrasment, it is true that some woman dress not the way they should, but guess what this New York city and the only thing one can do is not look,so more than writing letter which by itself is funny because the rabbis are in a fight amongst them, all one can do is not look, and woman of crown heights if a man or a woman harasses you for the way you dress, call police and press charges, it is not IRAN here and let people live,

    the rebbe
    Guest
    the rebbe

    if you want to live in the rebbes neighborhood, think the rebbe will see you on the streets and you’ll dress 100 percent. If you put even one piece of cheese on a piece of meet it is still not kosher. Review the laws and you’ll know when you can dress as you please and when you can’t.

    Here we go again...
    Guest
    Here we go again...

    Yet another story of an innocent immodest woman being harassed by an insensitive lowlife who cares about Tznius. I’m reminded of the Palestinian-Israeli conflict. They kill people by the hundreds without batting an eyelash, but if we ever kill any of theirs, whether with good reason or by accident, suddenly we’re the evil murderers. Anyone in their right minds can see that the issue in Crown Heights is the people dressing immodestly, not the one in a hundred who has the gall to rebuke them. I can’t judge whether this guy was doing the right thing under the circumstances or… Read more »

    to the author:
    Guest
    to the author:

    I feel bad that you had to go through what you did as you were almost perfect. He should of chose someone else who was very obviously non tzniusdik.
    I see woman with long sheitels and a skirt right under there bottoms instead of right on or over their knees!!

    HOW CAN SO MANY WOMAN WALK AROUND WITH THEIR FULL KNEES AND MOST OF THE TOP OF THE LEG UNCOVERED. SINCE WE ARE 3 WE KNOW TO COVER OUR KNEES.
    I THINK WE NEED TZNIIUS POLICE WOMAN!!!!!!!!

    out of hand
    Guest
    out of hand

    !!!

    I will keep asking you "again?"
    Guest
    I will keep asking you "again?"

    I am always watching you, I see you the way you are dressed and how you are not dressed tsnisudik, I keep requesting that you dress in the right and proper way. I know what is in your heart, but I want to see action. Who am I? I am Hashem – always watching and waiting for you to follow my mitzvos. I still love you even though you do not follow my commandments.

    u sound upset
    Guest
    u sound upset

    I think the best way to teach this man is by MOVING OUT OF OUR SHCHUNA we need more people talking out and if you don’t like it LEAVE… it’s because of people like you that everything has to be in a “POSITIVE” way that we look like the way we look.

    Chillul Hashem. Isn't it worse to harass women and better to stay inside?
    Guest
    Chillul Hashem. Isn't it worse to harass women and better to stay inside?

    Next time you see him, hand him a paper bag to wear over his head and explain that you’re only helping him to fulfill not looking at women in an inappropriate manner. If you see him again after that, motion to his head and say “again?”

    old timer
    Guest
    old timer

    #1 you sound like a small guy who wants others to think that he is macho. Stop this kind of talk. What this guy did in the street is totally unacceptable. Someone stop him. He sounds like a BT or better a nut case who does not think for himself but heard that something should be done so he just does. however, this does not excuse the woman for dressing almost 100%. Either it is or it is not. Like saying someone is a little bit pregnant.. Dress like a lubavitcher or get out of the neighborhood.

    This is wrong
    Guest
    This is wrong

    But when you walk around in C H and many are dressed like people do not care about tzniyus,i’ts a terrible feeling.

    May we all have all the brochos

    keep it up
    Guest
    keep it up

    I think that at this point crown heights is so lost that the only way to help is through people like this, why is it that you can walk around the way you do and the frum people have to be afraid to talk. at this point this is the only way.

    i remember someone complaining about this type of behavior and she said “if this continues I’m going to move out of crown heights”

    KEEP IT UP

    not 100% tzinius!!!
    Guest
    not 100% tzinius!!!
    that was not the cahbad way...
    Guest
    that was not the cahbad way...
    no thank you?
    Guest
    no thank you?

    “Thinking he was looking for tzedaka, I said “no thank you” and continued walking.” I think the “no thank you” attitude would have offended me more than a woman allegedly dressing inappropriately according to halacha. If another Yid approaches you for tzadoka a “no I’m so sorry and I wish you all the best” would have been more appropriate than brushing him off like some hawker selling rolex watches. Obviously in this case, it turned out that he wasn’t after tzadoka after all, but you could nevertheless have addressed him appropriately when you had that assumption…unless thats how you address… Read more »

    Men also have a chiyuv of tzniyus - this should also be hilighted
    Guest
    Men also have a chiyuv of tzniyus - this should also be hilighted

    Men also have laws of tzniyus. Men need to be made aware of their chiyuv in tzniyus and this needs to be publicised in balance with the publicity given for women’s tzniyus. It is not meant to be a vendeta against women, as this misguided zealot obviously doesn’t understand. He needs to learn the laws of his own tzniyus responsibilities. It is not acceptable to harass anyone, especially not a man to a woman. Unfortunately the method in which the tzniyus issue is dealt with creates a breeding ground for negative implications against all women.

    crazy
    Guest
    crazy

    this is insane!! whats next? are they going to start hanging banners in the middle of the streets and squirt women with bleach filled water guns like in mea sharim???? i find it very hard to believe there arent more important causes to give masser than to tznius police. its good to raise awareness but harassing people on the street will get nowhere and yes one of these tznius police officers will get there tuchus kicked if they keep harassing people!!!

    resident
    Guest
    resident

    enough is enough, yes yesterday on kingston ave. was a young married woman dressed very untziniustik with sick bright colors and mini-skirt so until when are you going to tolerate in our Shruna, how those husband can keep quiet, if we keep quiet, this machalah will continue G-d Forbid, so let’s stop and review your halachos!!! after all you all remain Bas Chabad girls!!!..

    We, the men are at fault
    Guest
    We, the men are at fault

    Let’s not forget why the laws of tznius are here. It is because of us men. Just because we cannot control ourselves, why punish the women?

    To #1
    Guest
    To #1

    Let us know who you are so we can know who to be scared of…

    he is not being tznius
    Guest
    he is not being tznius

    what this man is doing is completelyuntznius-looking at women to see who is properly dressed-iit would be more tznius for him to be sitting with a sefer and learning

    only pictures will work
    Guest
    only pictures will work

    we need to get pictures of every person who walks around not 100% tznius and make a tznius watch website. this will all be done anonymously so nobody will know who is behind it.

    awww
    Guest
    awww

    r u offended? I feel so sorry for you…. well actually i don’t

    dont live in crown heights
    Guest
    dont live in crown heights

    when a non frum jew or goy come to a jewish wedding they put on a yarmulke out of respect. if you choose to live in CH dress according to the rules of the community. otherwise move to miami or bal harber

    What???
    Guest
    What???

    Almost 100% tznius???

    to # 1
    Guest
    to # 1

    who are you. lets see how many people you can beat up and how many years you will get in jail!
    Mendel aisekovitz

    call the police on him
    Guest
    call the police on him

    for stalking and harrassing

    tznius is the problem
    Guest
    tznius is the problem

    bec we dont keep tznius people are losing their jobs. kids are going off the way. kids and adults are being abused. there are car accidents. people are dying at a young age.
    do these women and girls have no guilt?

    Slanted journalism
    Guest
    Slanted journalism

    This is a peculiar way to present a letter signed by a majority of Badatz. (Why it wasn’t unanimous is beyond me!) Who cares if a few people are overworked about this issue? Let thous who flout the Rebbe’s standards of tzinius reconsider their conduct; it can do no harm.

    if you cant dress 100% properly stay home
    Guest
    if you cant dress 100% properly stay home

    do you stop and think how much damage you will do to my kids if you “parading on Kingston in a bathing suit”

    "Almost" doesn't count
    Guest
    "Almost" doesn't count

    Dress tznius (according to halachah -and in this community Minhag Chabad) not “your style” and you won’t be harassed.

    tzip
    Guest
    tzip

    next time call the police for harassment

    Letters are easy to write
    Guest
    Letters are easy to write

    If the Rabbanim would behave like Rabbanim people would be able to respect them and things would be looking very different and yes maybe their “letters” would not be so necessary

    <<Comment removed>>
    Guest
    <>

    This comment accused a particular individual by name as being the man in the article and was unintentionally approved, is apparently incorrect, and has been removed.

    to # 3
    Guest
    to # 3

    You sound extremely educated and successful with your methods of education. Go back to school and learn how to be POSITIVE –

    imature
    Guest
    imature

    so imature of you to write u want to go down kingston in a bathing suit that is what a teenager would write

    Oh, stop whining already.
    Guest
    Oh, stop whining already.

    So the man is missing diplomatic skills. You are offended by his behaviour, yet you offend so many with yours.

    No sympathy here.

    -An out of towner who cringes every time she comes to CH and sees so many of these untznius whiners.

    This man is mentally
    Guest
    This man is mentally

    This man is mentally ill, please do not be offended by him or give him any thought. You should only do what you feel is right and what you are comfortable with.

    To #3
    Guest
    To #3

    You are offending me. Can I harass you?

    To #3
    Guest
    To #3

    How ugly are you that you are offended if someone else is pretty?

    Agreed!
    Guest
    Agreed!

    I agree with you!!
    t’s very inappropriate for a man to walk over to a woman and start talking about tznius!

    Why is the man looking at her to begin with?!

    Drill a Whole in your seat... is NOT PRIVATE BIZ... =(
    Guest
    Drill a Whole in your seat... is NOT PRIVATE BIZ... =(

    unfortunately, since how women dress in public has a (Massive) impact on the (Blessings & Fortune of the) Entire community

    it is not private personal preragative no more!

    according to many Torah sources (including the Rebbeh who we all trust)

    immodesty chases away Devine protection from a comunity R”L

    many tragedies occur as a result of lacking Hashem’s protection Ch”V

    no need to elaberate on the clear corelation of the spike in Tragedies we’ve all seen recent years, as the Tznius declined!

    (The politics was always with us in the 80’s 90’s etc)

    what changed was the Huge increase of Tragedies & Tznius…

    as a women
    Guest
    as a women

    it hurts Men (my husband) is silently very uncomfortable on kingston Ave

    its very inconsiderate of these ladies to disregard the feelings of Men & Wives too, let alone the known tragedies “Hepech Hatznius Brings to Sooo many HYR

    #45 Well said!
    Guest
    #45 Well said!

    sadly true! Sinas chinum was always around! what changed was the Tznius to a level that is very desperate…

    Tznius brings many Brachos to the whole family
    Guest
    Tznius brings many Brachos to the whole family

    Lets do it for Hashem! Lets do it for the Brachos it brings to our children

    we all do soo much for our children!!

    whats going on?
    Guest
    whats going on?

    everyone agrees that everyone needs to be tznius(men & women & children)
    however ,theres no way you can have a man(or women) harrasing anyone.
    no need to justifiy and wrongness, case closed

    i struggled with my attire too!!
    Guest
    i struggled with my attire too!!

    it aint very easy to dress tznius! my only way to overcome my temptation for provocative dress was, therapy!

    the better you feel about yourself about your life the less you’ll be needy for the wrong kind of attentionj

    stop attacking those who wanto protect our community from TRAGEDIES!
    Guest
    stop attacking those who wanto protect our community from TRAGEDIES!

    its tough love! when you have the courage to say it as it is! people must know how to prevent the huge escalation of Tzaros (BadNews)

    the Rebbeh teaches us how

    1) Check Tfilin & Mezuzos annually
    2) Study shiur chitas Rambam/Sefer HaM. daily
    3) Dress with dignity & self respect! aka following halacha (g-ds will)

    self esteem is the solution!
    Guest
    self esteem is the solution!

    #50 is correct!

    to 5
    Guest
    to 5

    “free country lady, next time call the cops and press charges for harrasment, it is true that some woman dress not the way they should, but guess what this New York city and the only thing one can do is not look,so more than writing letter which by itself is funny because the rabbis are in a fight amongst them, all one can do is not look, and woman of crown heights if a man or a woman harasses you for the way you dress, call police and press charges, it is not IRAN here and let people live,” SORRY… Read more »

    Women
    Guest
    Women

    Stand up for yourself and for others, women and kids, this guy is a pervert to tell you that you are beautiful?!? and to be analyzing how you are dressed, and keeping track of you, and to talk to you about it!??!!! Next time ask him his name, and file charges against him for harrassment. A pervert like this needs to be labeled so that people can keep their kids away for safety!

    is it INAPPROPRIATE to stop someone from hurting the public??
    Guest
    is it INAPPROPRIATE to stop someone from hurting the public??

    i think this (fictional) man was wrong, bec his approach doesnt work “practically” if it did actually work! to stop women from dressing against halacha, then matbe it can be justified, considering whats at steak (the upsurge in tragedies to our community) bottom line: we must do all we can to help bring back Hashem’s protection to our community, thus we must use that which works! “Devorim Hayotzim Min Halev” if you really care about a women and her family, she will surely sense it & accept the (good-will) message bec after all who doesnt wanto put a stop to… Read more »

    This women is wrong ... so to is this Man
    Guest
    This women is wrong ... so to is this Man

    their both not tznius!

    im not that modest
    Guest
    im not that modest

    but i dont try to justify it either, or to vilify those who try to defend it

    oh my!!! WHAT HAS THIS SITUATION COME TO?
    Guest
    oh my!!! WHAT HAS THIS SITUATION COME TO?

    whats with the almost????!!!!
    u need to be 100% tznius – its halacha!!!!!
    Just like you need to keep shabbos, kosher, you need to cover your knees, elbows, collar bone and hair….. what has this come to??? since when is it okay to be “almost”!!!!!! ITS A HALACHA PEOPLES!!! HELLO!! GET IT!!!!!!!!! And if you can’t respect the community, which abides by halacha – than LEAVE!!!!!!

    Nu, so what about non Tznius sheitels?
    Guest
    Nu, so what about non Tznius sheitels?

    Is it tznius to have a 30 inch sheitel (wig) for an Orthodox Jewish woman? 2 years ago Report Abuse Archie B Archie B E. Long Sheitels When a sheitel is longer than shoulder-length, it sways freely with the movement of the head and with the general movement of the body. This swaying is similar to that of living hair, which is particularly bouncy and sways easily. Such a sheitel therefore gives the wearer a distinct girl- like look. In contrast, a short-haired sheitel lies flat on the head even when not tied down and does not sway. This is… Read more »

    I would call the cops
    Guest
    I would call the cops

    You can probably have these guy arrested for harassment

    rong
    Guest
    rong

    this whole thing is rong when you walk down the street and see her nees its very atrctive so you can say dont look but if she is dressed like that she wants you to look because she knows its very atractive now thats why we have rulles of tznius that hashem gave us to keep and if you cant keep them then stay away from guys so they wont have a bad thot im not saying its not hard but do it. youl see it makes this world abetter place and we need it that way thanks in advans

    Brochos
    Guest
    Brochos

    If he chooses to harass you it’s his problem. His level of yiddishkeit is his problem. His interpretation of Torah is his. BUT your tznius level is in your hands. If you weren’t fully tznius it’s up to you to do what you need to. Youu base your yiddishkeit level on someone else? You will choose to be less tznius, lower your standards, and your respect level, because of someone who followed you? The shulchan aruch tells us not to be embarrassed of people who mock us. If u are keeping Halacha, great. You get Hashem’s brochos. If you need… Read more »

    Hmmm
    Guest
    Hmmm

    It’s interesting to read that “although I find it hard to follow the letter of the law, I am modest in the spirit of the law”. I’m curious to hear what this woman finds SO difficult in covering knees, elbows and neckline! In what way does she consider herself modest, whilst not respecting these basic halachos 100%? Especially as she say’s that she is “modest in style”. Perhaps it would be good to have open discussion, not shiurim where people would be talked down to, but genuine and respectful discussion.

    Each one of us
    Guest
    Each one of us

    Most of us dont dress 100 percent Tznius. Dont be sooooo Shocked by the authors ”almost Tznius” Lets just start with ourselves. I know it is hard to find long enough skirts and closed tops. But we REALLY CANT let our knees show when we stand or sit. It is very important! it has to be out of the question to buy something not 100 percent. Once it is out of the question you will start finding Tznius clothes. And yes, I agree with whoever wrote that it is a horrible feeling for me to walk around in CH and… Read more »

    Crown heights znius below all standards
    Guest
    Crown heights znius below all standards

    A short while ago my wife visited CH. She returned in total shock. Maybe 5% of the woman in CH, which she saw in the street, dressed according Halocho. At the Ohel Lubavitcher woman where praying by the Rebbezten, and they where dressed very not tzeniusdik. From what she saw she is now convinced that Lubavitch in CH doesn’t know any more wat tzenius is really about.

    dear lord
    Guest
    dear lord

    when did crown heights turn into afganistan

    Sorry but both are wrong
    Guest
    Sorry but both are wrong

    Approaching a lady in this manner is not tznius either! The woman too is wrong as she admits that she was not 100% tznius H”Y.

    You're right "almost"
    Guest
    You're right "almost"

    If you say you know how you look, and that you are “almost always” properly dressed, take it upon YOURSELF to do what’s right. True, a man should not apporach a woman, especially in the manner you discussed. But if it there wouldn’t be a reason, any call of attention to make someone do so, then one wouldn’t be approached as you were.

    Stupid Issue
    Guest
    Stupid Issue

    If someone wants to live in CH they will. How can some state move out? It is a free country, and as such I and any of the many can and will live here. NYPD will get involved and lets see how many of these stupid comments get locked up.
    While not condoning the attire – the method and some of these posts are totally off.

    CH the city of judges......
    Guest
    CH the city of judges......

    There is no such a thing as a bad jew. One day a woman is not tznius and one day she’ll make Teshuva. She’ll have more chance to make T’chuva living in CH than in Manhattan.You want Geula? Let’s start with love your fellow jew as yourself.

    KOSHER STYLE
    Guest
    KOSHER STYLE

    our restaurant is not 100% kosher, but dont worry its Kosher “style”

    Dude
    Guest
    Dude

    I love it how people say that if the rebbe was here what would he say. I guess all these teachers in yeshivah that are molesting kids is not the issue at hand. Don’t get me wrong about the women, they should dress as best they can. The fact is this should not be the big issue.

    The spirit
    Guest
    The spirit

    Let’s reword the opening paragraph…

    “I am a married man, who, for the most part, tries to stick with kosher laws. Although sometimes it is difficult to follow the letter of the law, I am always in keeping with the spirit of the law, eating only kosher style”

    Coming from a person who claims to be a Torah keeping Jew, that sounds ridiculous, doesn’t it?

    its nice to see how many respectful posts there are in favor of Halacha
    Guest
    its nice to see how many respectful posts there are in favor of Halacha

    those who favor Halacha & Tznius all agree that this man (if its true) did not really care about halacha or tznius, thats why his words fell on deaf ears

    Liberals never argue the ISSUE
    Guest
    Liberals never argue the ISSUE

    instead they try to DIRTY MOUTH the messenger instead of focusing on the message

    EVEN IF THIS STORY WAS TRUE, that is no excuse to do the wrong thing!

    he wasnt tznius & u wernt tznius

    he botherd you,
    & you bothered soo many others!

    (because untznius dress brings bad klalos R”L to the community)

    so before you get all upset that he is hurting others take a good look in the mirror

    they were both wrong!
    Guest
    they were both wrong!

    she cant complain about him being inappropriate on the street nor can he to her
    they both acted against halacha and tznius

    they both forgot the importance of tznius & all the brachos it brings

    lack of tznius hurts sooo many ppl
    Guest
    lack of tznius hurts sooo many ppl

    according to torah immodesty brings very negative courses!

    so please stop (selfishly) hurting the public

    thanks

    its all about self esteem issues
    Guest
    its all about self esteem issues

    i know many women who suffer from self image & self esteem issues!

    no speeches will help, the underlying issue must be fixed, if their fathers & husbands gave them proper attention & made them feel important & loved etc they would not be soo desperate for the low brand of “trashy” attention

    so stop with the speeches & show some love

    ''In Your Face'' Immodesty Requires ''In Your Face' Tznious.
    Guest
    ''In Your Face'' Immodesty Requires ''In Your Face' Tznious.

    We all have seen Kosher Style restaurants.99 1/2% won’t do.
    Since the merit of our religion is carried by the women,(not to mention our leaving Egypt and Moshiach’s imminent arrival) we must sacrifice our desire for materialization over G-dliness

    He had a point!!!!
    Guest
    He had a point!!!!
    self esteem
    Guest
    self esteem

    agreed!

    self esteem also comes from having good relationships, & accomplishing things in life,

    sometimes ppl pretend to be proud of them selves but deep down they have serious self esteem issues!

    so lets have mercy they are not selfish they are simply hurting inside (this doesent make it right)

    dont hurt your kids
    Guest
    dont hurt your kids

    if women knew what they are really affecting by untznius dress, they would never dream of being immodest again!

    its just wide spread ignorance, how it affects Nachas, Parnasa, Health etc etc

    which mother wouldn't sacrifice for her child
    Guest
    which mother wouldn't sacrifice for her child

    its ignorance not selfish inconsideration

    Yitzchok
    Guest
    Yitzchok

    What a pervert.. Why was this creep looking at women other then his wife? I walk up and down Kingston avenue all day long and I don’t see anything wrong with anybody. This guy is “mamesh” a “chazer” I feel violated that some out there is oggeling my wife, mother, sister whatever. Next time you see him start screaming PERVERT!!!

    spirit of the law...
    Guest
    spirit of the law...

    @comment 62:
    It means that the skirt may not cover the knees while sitting, but the clothing are never in bright colors or tight. They are subdued and classy.

    the Rebbeh wants our good
    Guest
    the Rebbeh wants our good

    since the Rebbeh begged us re Tznius and Sheitul
    that’s thats because it really does brings soo much good into our life…

    its not just sifrei mussar that talk of the harm caused by Immodesty! the Rebbeh who never condoned mussar also (on this matter) warned of the dangers RL…

    is it ok???
    Guest
    is it ok???

    so its not ok to dress untzinus BUT its ok for men to talk to MARRIED women on the street??? what would the REBBE say about that? and the MEN dress with thier shirts untucked???? i never saw the rebbe dress with his shirt untucked

    Inappropriate
    Guest
    Inappropriate

    Regardless of the way a woman is dressed, it is absolutely inappropriate for a man who is not her father or husband to be physically scrutinizing her and speaking to her about her physical appearance.

    Two words: restraining order
    Guest
    Two words: restraining order

    This type of behavior easily escalates to violence. CH has had enough violence in the past which led to a total rehaul of the CHJCC and the BD.

    Do what you can to stop the downward spiral of the community and put a restrating order on such people. Do not wait until you are a victom of violence and nip harrassment in the bud.

    Chassidim!
    Guest
    Chassidim!

    #13 why do you assume that only a BT speaks this way?? I find it funny that most of the non tznius action going on on Kingston ave are FFBs not BT! Author – you are in the Rebbe’s schuna! Don’t like it – get out! When Williamsburg came protesting the streets of CH everyone said it was their right because they wanted to keep non-tznius shops out of their neighborhood… what about ours? Are we not Chassidim??? Cover your knees and hair and you won’t be asked to dress in a tznius manner… KINGSTON AVE is disgusting to see,… Read more »

    Sick people
    Guest
    Sick people

    What the heck are these men who PREACH about tznuis, even glancing at women??? sick world!! people’s priorities are messed up! Look what’s happening with these “so called rabbi” being molesters..I think we need to take a moment and realize what is going on in this world!

    not tznius
    Guest
    not tznius

    Its not tznius for a man to talk to a woman, if anything a woman should be the tznius police. which i think doesn’t work anyway.
    A woman has to feel that not dressing tznius it’s an aveira like eating treif of michalel Shabbos. It’s not a nice thing to do or a chumra, its DIORAISA.

    Illegal activity
    Guest
    Illegal activity

    What ever the halachic opinion is will never give anyone the right to harrasanyone under the US law this is not Iran or Afganistan! The rabonim has the right to publish the halachic opinion as a reminder of who we are and what are our values but if anyone is taking the law in to their hands and try to enforce is by all kind of tactics should be arrested and put away women has the rights to dress as they wish and it is between them and their creator Men, you should not look at any woman especially if… Read more »

    WHEN WILL WE ATTACK THE MEN?
    Guest
    WHEN WILL WE ATTACK THE MEN?

    lets start by asking men to stop cutting their beards, wearing pink shirts & way too tight pants! In ch stores, men are being ridiculed for wearing a kappata that isnt the length of a mini skirt, or pants that are not like womens tights! If your “holy” men wanted tznius wives & found tznius attractive you would not have this problem! They all want runway models. So now kingston ave looks like Milan! Hope all you men who wanted this are happy! & ladies….if someone does harass u CALL THE COPS! there are laws against the pervs who bother… Read more »

    Long Shaitel
    Guest
    Long Shaitel

    Stop here. You want knees covered, fine. Women are supposed to look good for their husbands and feel good about themselves when they walk in the street.

    Just because you get married you have to look plain and flat headed and ugly.

    Extremism is wrong…Rebbe says Middle path

    innapropiate
    Guest
    innapropiate

    in crown heights this should not be happening of course i agree that tznius is a very important matter and everyone in crown heights should dress accordingly to these standards but for a man in ch to go over to a married women and start harrsing her is just unacceptable wat would the rebbe do would the rebbe go over to that woman and start screaming at her and embarresing her ofcourse not do u think it would make that women want to dress more modest after some1 harrassed her only she can decide you cant change some1s mind 4… Read more »

    Damage controll
    Guest
    Damage controll

    Sad to come to this, but the ladies and girls crossed all red lines and are causing damage to ALL our children and families. We are all harased by the “pritzus” of some ladies. Time to take our streets back, for 10 years some people (ladies and men) have made us and the rebbe uncomfortable in OUR sechuna, we tried many ways maybe not enough, but yes now will make YOU uncomfortable if you ruin our streets and families. While this may not be right way the alarming damage is forcing us to do things out of frusteration. So if… Read more »

    just wondering
    Guest
    just wondering

    so looking at a women to see how she is dressd, and so much so to even notice her again….and stoping her to talk to her about that. IS THAT TZNIUS????????

    shouldnt this at least be a “job” for a women to do??????

    long sheitl
    Guest
    long sheitl

    halevai every women in ch will go out to the street with a long sheitl instead of tichl that covers hal heads!!!

    chinuch
    Guest
    chinuch

    I think it came to a point that mosdos have to reject talmidim that their mothers go untzinusdik. when this will happen and they will have to send their kids out of the schuneh they will move out or they will realize that they can’t spit on our faces and they will change for better. Then, our kids will be better too. Hashem yerachem!

    challenge
    Guest
    challenge

    I think we should challenge those women, that obviously are not ashamed, to seat by a table with Rabbonim, mashpiyim and mechanchim to discuss the issue of tznius. Neshei ubnos chabad should make parlor meetings of 10 women at the time it will have a great effect. If we get one women per session to change it will be tremendous!!

    Both are wrong
    Guest
    Both are wrong

    The man has no right to do it in such a manner as it is not at all a tzniusdike way. The woman too admits that she was not tzniusdic 100%!

    The reality is that the way ladies (chasidishe ladies!) dress in the community is a pure emabressment!

    Also COLLIVE: you forgot to add a ? mark at the end of your title or are you not just reporting but stating an opinion?

    Just curious
    Guest
    Just curious

    Why dont the non jewish women walking around dressed with barely a fig leaf get harrassed by these people? I do agree that the problem with tznius needs to be fixed but harrassment is not the way to do it. This turns people off and pushes them further from yiddishkeit. There must be a better way to get the message across.

    spirit of the law
    Guest
    spirit of the law

    is only lifnim mishuras hadin. it is impossible to act in the spirit of a law that u r violating. Hashem should help you.

    you morons
    Guest
    you morons

    Kosher = black and whiteTznius = gray area
    so you cannot compare the two!

    Anonymous
    Guest
    Anonymous

    I wonder what you meant by “almost”. Whatever you wore must not have been according to proper halachic standards. Maybe it wouldn’t be such a bad idea to have “tznius police”. We don’t sem to be able to be tzniusdik without it…

    Finally!
    Guest
    Finally!

    Finally, Rabonim speaking out about the importance of Tznius. I think many of us are so ignorant, and don’t realize just how important Tznius is!!

    Aaron
    Guest
    Aaron

    BH 50 and 94 ecellent points

    Almost Tznius
    Guest
    Almost Tznius

    Very simple, it means that on a scale of 1-100 it’s somewhere in the 90’s.

    No, it’s not like almost pregnant (don’t know where you pulled that example from). it’s like, I almost got everything right,

    Test of our generation
    Guest
    Test of our generation

    One of the tests of our generation is in matters of tznius, as we see how very difficult it has become. Since it is so difficult, it means we all have to work on that and improve in that area. It is true that criticism should be done with sensitivity and in an appropriate manner, but it is also true that women and girls should be given shiurim not only about the laws of tznius, but the deeper inyanim and the affects lack of tznius could wreak in a person’s personal life, marriage, and for the community as a whole.… Read more »

    Kosher,  Tznius and Grey areas
    Guest
    Kosher, Tznius and Grey areas

    There are many kosher restaurants (especially out of NY) where it’s 95% okay, such as a pizza or bagel shop where people buy the bagles and salad but not the cream cheese which they know isn’t cholov yisroel. etc.

    Yes not everything is black and white, not in kosher and not in Tznius.

    proof, you say “bright colors” are bad and “dark colors” are good. now there are 1000’s of color shades, go find a rule book that says which is ok and which is not.

    That’s the meaning of “spirit of the law”

    to 25!!!!!!!!
    Guest
    to 25!!!!!!!!

    only pics will work!!!
    are you crazy who the heckl do you think will be looking at these pic’s

    105 who's the moron
    Guest
    105 who's the moron

    Kindly find one Jewish Halacha book that backs up what you are saying that tzniyus is a grey area???

    Did you learn chitas this week?
    Guest
    Did you learn chitas this week?

    In this weeksa parsha the TORAH tells us that we are responsible for each others and therefore are punished for the sins of others as it says “hanisturois L”Hashem Elokeinu vhaniglois lonu ilvoneinu” – we are responsible for anything done in public and it is our responsibility to take it up and be mochiach those that sin.

    The minhag in many places is that the above mentioned possuk is read louder than the rest of the parsha so that everyone should hear it CLEARLY!

    Yes, according to the Torah, if you would, consider yidden the Taliban…”

    Thank you!
    Guest
    Thank you!
    Stop Harassing the resident of CH! Dress Properly!!!
    Guest
    Stop Harassing the resident of CH! Dress Properly!!!

    Well I feel I am being harrassed by not being able to walk the streets as a chassidishe yungerman would like.
    Why do I need to be privy to the most uncomfortable of situations??? If I would seek that Ican go to Times Square for 1 MTA fare..!

    Finally!
    Guest
    Finally!

    Rabbonim you are doing right.

    The people have heard the tznius cry for quite some years now and have chosen to ignore it. It is time you take it to new hights.
    If they feel they can’t do as they wish they can leave the neighborhood and the Rebbe will be thankful!

    (If you can’t take the heat get out of the kitchen. You are burning the neshomos of innocent yidden.)

    old time
    Guest
    old time

    This guy has no social skills. Does that mean that he is wrong? This is not the way to do it. However, what she did is a lot worse. Do not pollute our streets, our youth and our minds.. If you want to dress the way you want to, go to a different neighborhood. Please get out of here!!!!!!!! We do not want you here. You do need to be taught how to dress. However, this guy is not the one to do it. I wish there were enough men and women with guts to harass people like you. Maybe… Read more »

    to comment 105
    Guest
    to comment 105

    Your Wrong. Period. It is NOT a grey area… it is a HALACHA, that’s the mistake that everyone is making, its not an option, it’s not a chumra – its a halacha!!!!! plain and simple!!! look how much sense this makes: A person says their keeping shabbos, and does everything right, except friday night after the meal he goes outside and lights a cigarette, and says “Im ALMOST completely 100% keeping shabbos….”, what kind of narishkeit is that??? Either you are or you arent, that’s first of all – second of all, it is a halacha, if you call yourself… Read more »

    Is it the same guy?
    Guest
    Is it the same guy?

    Something similar happened to me last Friday. I was approached by a bochur who asked me to speak to a nearbye woman about her lack of tznius, which was offensive to him. He explained that he, as a bochur, could not approach the woman, but he was asking me to do it instead. After I explained to him that the Taliban has not yet taken over in Crown Heights, I asked him what her thought I could accomplish by verbally attacking the other woman. (And yes, even if I had done it nicely, she would have perceived it as a… Read more »

    go ahead and blame the effect not cause
    Guest
    go ahead and blame the effect not cause

    instead of spending all your time bashing the guy who has no clue how to approach someone why dont you realize that the real problem is your clothing?

    What is the world does almost 100% mean?
    what if i tell you this food is almost 100% kosher?

    you are looking for ways to make yourself feel good by bashing the nut who followed you

    You should be embarrassed to write it was not 100%

    From A shlucha
    Guest
    From A shlucha

    Women should feel scared and petrified to walk down the streets of cCrown Heights in an untznius way. just like someone is aware f the consequences wen they walk around meah shearim. yes, its the only way! when i take peope to crown heights i want to show them the beauty and dignity of the Rebbes Shechuna, not that kingston is just like Main Street usa……we are an am kodosh, its time to start dressing that way too

    you can move
    Guest
    you can move

    for all that have a problem with Tznius the Gemorah give a choice

    תלמוד בבלי מסכת קידושין דף מ עמוד א

    אמר רבי אלעאי הזקן: אם רואה אדם שיצרו מתגבר עליו, ילך למקום שאין מכירין אותו, וילבש שחורים ויתכסה שחורים ויעשה כמו שלבו חפץ, ואל יחלל שם שמים בפרהסיא

    go live in mea sharim
    Guest
    go live in mea sharim

    anyone who doesnt like the way people in ch dress should go live in mea sharim. Will you also keep track of how the goyim in ch dress and harass them as well. How about all the actresses on TV and internet that you find in your own homes. Please people pull it together. Love your fellow Jew before it is too late.

    No proof that he went too far
    Guest
    No proof that he went too far

    Nobody should blame that guy. First of all, the author of the article didn’t even describe how she was dressed. She is giving vague description. But I’m sorry, it is not a proof that she was tzniusdike. I know many women who, for instance, wear body fit skirts, claiming at the same time that because it reaches below the kness it’s OK. Tznius is not only about the skirt lenght. It’s also about the colors of your clothes and wheither it’s body fitting clothes or not. So, a woman can have the impression that she is tzniusdike while the truth… Read more »

    whats with the klalos?
    Guest
    whats with the klalos?

    are all of you losing your minds?? true , being untznius is wrong. the beis hamikdash was destroyed for sinus chinom,not for women dressing untznius or other terrible sins its so easy for people to hate and say its not so bad,but if you dont do 100% right,then they are ready to tell you off. the funny thing is , that all these people screaming about tznius, are doing major sins and they arent worried about that. by the way , i think its terrible the tznius situation,but we need to explain to the women in a nice way ,… Read more »

    Dumb
    Guest
    Dumb

    if u are writing a article u dont leave out details like “almost 100 % tznius” how are we supposed to translate that to mean?? i take it that u are saying half truth that u really werent properly tznius and u were a little tznius in some places and therefore u could say “almost 100 %”

    Laws of Tznius for Our Degenerate Age
    Guest
    Laws of Tznius for Our Degenerate Age

    Tz’niyus – Not Just About Wearing Gabardine Tights in 90-Degree Weather Many women mistakenly think that tz’niyus is about covering your legs and arms. This is wrong. Tz’niyusis also about covering your feet and wrists. More than that, tz’niyus is really a way of life, a set of rules that governs everything you do – whether you are cooking meals, sewing clothes, scouring pots or doing laundry. Tz’niyus means avoiding attention, wrapping yourself in anonymity. One famous Gadol was married to his wife for twelve years before he learned her name. Even then, he only found out by accidentally overhearing… Read more »

    Moshiach is imminent
    Guest
    Moshiach is imminent

    Rabbosai, by reading the comments, I’m glad to see that there are many Lubavitchers who still stick to the Halacha and are willing to defend it. On the other hand, I’m amazed by all those people trying to justify lack of tznius and who are refering to those faithful to our Rebbe and the Halacha as being “Talibans”, “extremists”, “unsensitive”, etc. Rabbosai, in Sanhedrin 97a, it says that in the Ikvasa d’Meshicha those who fear G-d would be dispised, the generation will be dog-faced and the truth entirely lacking. So, there is not surprise that those who are faithfull to… Read more »

    Article and Video in Forward
    Guest
    Article and Video in Forward

    Have you seen the recent article and video on the Forward website: entitled, “Orthodox Women Push Limits of Modesty -New Generation Wants To Look S–y and Obey Religious Dictates” by a man (eye roll)? Women shopping in the store are described as, “an exposed elbow here, a bare collarbone there, a skirt that ended at just the wrong side of a pair of knees.” The article says the store does not accept miniskirts, yet at 3:03 minutes, that’s exactly what is seen in the video. The video is a horror with numerous non-tzniusdik women including one who extols the virtues… Read more »

    To 66
    Guest
    To 66

    When did crown heights turn into an open beach?

    All quoters of halach
    Guest
    All quoters of halach

    Instead of saying that covering your elbows “is halacha” like traife please give us a place to look in the halacha.

    Here’s for meat and milk
    Exodus 23:19
    Exodus 34:26
    Deuteronomy 14:21
    Babylonian Talmud: Hullin 113b, 115b

    #67
    Guest
    #67

    i agree with you

    Bathing Suit
    Guest
    Bathing Suit

    IN SHORT!
    1) Woman should dress tzniusdik according to halacha Not their interpertation of halacha.
    2) Tznius patrolis a good idea, but MUST be done by woman ONLY.
    3) To the writer: Please advise what day and time you will be walking down Kingston in your bathing suit!

    woman who are not happy
    Guest
    woman who are not happy

    woman who are not happy feel better wen they dress to turn on ather men thats a fact calld negative a tension

    ok... but...
    Guest
    ok... but...

    this guy was crazy and he souldnt be doing that but you have to understand that your living in the rebbes shchune and by doing so there are rules just like there are goverment laws there are jewish laws . all im saying is that tznius needs to be taking care of but not the way that guy was doing it but in some other normal way.

    4 all men
    Guest
    4 all men

    you shouldnt even be commenting u know whats rlly not tznius is men going over to a women who isnt related to them in anyway and harresing them especaily touching them if u feel that a women is not dressed properly which in the 1st place why should u notice as its untznius to look at a women aspecailly at wat she wears u could allert the head of community but its none of ur personnal buisness now the woman might be wrong but do u think going over to her and making it ur buisness is going to make… Read more »

    Jewish Women and Girls are Gems!
    Guest
    Jewish Women and Girls are Gems!

    Being a 100% tznius is no easy task but if u look at it in this perspective then it will make u have a better outlook on it. All Jewish women and girls are gems and one of the ways that we can show the world this is through being Tznius. They say that when a person is Tznius, this shows that they care about their body and therefore dont want it to be exposed.Dressing Tznius doesnt mean that your clothes will be nerdy,there are Tznius clothes that are pretty.We know that we are the Rebbe and Rebbetzins children making… Read more »

    To 122
    Guest
    To 122

    “From A shlucha Women should feel scared and petrified to walk down the streets of cCrown Heights in an untznius way. just like someone is aware f the consequences wen they walk around meah shearim. yes, its the only way! when i take peope to crown heights i want to show them the beauty and dignity of the Rebbes Shechuna, not that kingston is just like Main Street usa……we are an am kodosh, its time to start dressing that way too ” Do your mekuravim also know that you don’t believe that ahavas yisroel and being dan lechaf zechus and… Read more »

    ch resident
    Guest
    ch resident

    ” I am a married woman, who, for the most part, tries to stick with tznius laws. Although sometimes it is difficult to follow the letter of the law, I am always in keeping with the spirit of the law, modest in my style appearance.” do u find it hard to stick to all the marrage laws??? ” I was dressed almost 100% properly, and what wasn’t was definitely not obvious and “in your face.” what exactly does dressed almost 100% properly mean? Either u were tznius or u were not. Going out dressed not tzniusdik is asking for trouble… Read more »

    To #131
    Guest
    To #131

    It’s one thing to comment on an article before reading all 130 comments before yours, it’s another to comment on an article before reading the article.

    The editors here at Collive attached a two page letter from the Rabbonim of Crown Heights, probably to bring a balance to story.
    The Rabbonim, in their wisdom, accompanied everything they wrote with sources, particularly from Chabad Halacha sources (primarily Shulchan Aruch Harav), please take a look.
    Oh, and one of the sources they bring is actually saying that in some aspects, Tzniyus is more chamur (stringent) than Basar bechalav.

    THIS IS NOT THE CHABAD APPROACH
    Guest
    THIS IS NOT THE CHABAD APPROACH

    it seems like evryone is forgetting the whole chabad approach that we dont impose anything on anyone we let them know the halacha and then its up to them decide! inwould be so embarassed if i had to bring non religious friends to crown heights to show them the rebbes schuna only to have them feeling uncomfortable and feeling harassed by other JEWS! its not easy to keep all the 613 mitzvos some have a better time keeping tznius than others. some are better with the mitzvah of ahavas yisroel. some are better at not JUDGING our fellow Jews. but… Read more »

    #1 Touch anyone and you will go to Jail
    Guest
    #1 Touch anyone and you will go to Jail

    You are angry and belligerent towards a well meaning kook whose message has apparently touched a chord. What kind of hatred are you advocating? Just because you disagree with someone doesnt give you the right to espouse and incite violence towards that person. If he were to touch, or hurt someone, then he of course he should be stopped. But why violently?

    so who is going to stand up for the right  thing?
    Guest
    so who is going to stand up for the right thing?

    Ok ,I have read and heard all these replies which in a nut shell are either; its my life and free choice i can do what I want or somebody has to do the right thing. The Question is exactly who is that supposed to be and if they are why isn’t the message getting through.Is sitting around doing nothing going to solve anything either? If one doesn’t at least protest isn’t he or she agreeing to status qua? In what form should a protest take? No easy answers but at least its not sweeping it under the carpet.

    chabad
    Guest
    chabad

    we need people to stand on street and do mivta tzius the same way we do all other mivzum we need a big mitzva tank and give out sichas and halaches of tznius

    Crazy
    Guest
    Crazy

    OK, here’s whats flying: I think that it’s Crown Heights thats the problem. The people there are sooo spoiled. People on Shlichus (like myself) would never dream of this. You have the choice to be tznius, all the stores there give you PLENTY of stylish options but you choose to dress in miniskirts. There were girls in camp who showed up in miniskirts, there was quite an unpleasant “scene” of their bunkroom door flying open and they weren’t dressed, like literally. They made comments like “I can’t wait to get home where it’s back to pants, no socks and flip-flops.”… Read more »

    source of halacha
    Guest
    source of halacha

    Yes, please provide an exact SOURCE of the halachos of tznius. Please do not refer to a sicha of the Rebbe, but instead give an exact source of where the halachos of tznius are clearly laid out and defined. Thank you!

    Ironic
    Guest
    Ironic

    This is not the first time that certain people feel harassed and attacked by those who attempt to notify them about laws of tznious. the response from many are Talaiban Iran etc. But it always seems strange to me coming from Lubavitch, since the whole fondation of mofern Lubavitch is to “harass” nudge, bambard the secular Jews with information, and goading, pushing him to put on Tefilin to light Shabos candles (aacepted that men Shluchim do that), to teacj Mikvah? It is therefore quite jaring to see the dissonance between the official dogma of Lubavitch regarding the outside secular world… Read more »

    Responsibility
    Guest
    Responsibility

    People need to take responsibility for their actions. This man was innapropriate, and and it’s not the woman’s fault that he was innapropriate. How she dresses is her decision, just like how he reacts is his. She could be wronf, but that’s between her and G-d. If he is wrong he could be charged with harrassment, and I hope he is. To all our “appreciative” out of town guests: maybe you forgot that CH is part of the United States of America? Sorry your tour of the eccentric and quaint locale was infringed upon by real people with with real… Read more »

    unappropriate!
    Guest
    unappropriate!

    His behavior was what was not Tzinusdik! Why is he looking at woman and how they dress???? That is totallu unacceptable in my eyes!!!!!

    Who Is This Guy?
    Guest
    Who Is This Guy?

    And what is he doing accosting a strange woman on the street?????

    Thank God something is being done about Tznius
    Guest
    Thank God something is being done about Tznius

    Acc to Torah a woman who does not cover her knees when sitting is not Orthodox. (S”O E”H 115 and poskim)
    Everything done until now has not worked, something must be done to save Yiddishkeit. The Rambam in the laws of sacrifices would call this a situation of Shmad.
    Our women must be saved from Halachik Shmad R”L.
    Who is the continuation of Judaism is not the women, mothers.
    It must be done in the right way and if somebody was to drink a poison, would you not do anything to stop them.

    I am comment 120
    Guest
    I am comment 120

    Number 148, you are off base. It is because I value tzbius so highly that I refused to intervene with this woman. There is a huge difference between mivztoim to people brougt up in a secular lifestyle and people who know the halachos but for some reason, refuse to follow them. And in any case, no shlucha worth her salt “gaods” any woman into going to mikvah. We are talking about sensitive issues and complicated feelings. And yes, the Iranian guard recruited women to harass other women on the street to wear the veil, which is why I made reference… Read more »

    hello?
    Guest
    hello?

    99% kosher is 100% treif.

    in the gemara
    Guest
    in the gemara

    there’s a story about a rabbi who tore someone’s clothing because she wasn’t dressed tzniusdik. it turned out that she wasn’t jewish. but apparantly, if she had been jewish, it would have been the right thing to do.

    To 150
    Guest
    To 150

    Who told you that this guy was looking at her? Why don’t you consider the matter in the other way around? This is not the guy who was looking at her! When an untzniusdike woman goes out, this is HER who wants other people to look at her! Untzniusdike women and their supporters (unfortunately, there are backed by many people as the above comments prove) should no something: we are in a Chasidish neighbourhood. Think about our children! Think about all the men and women who want to live according to the rules and in kedusho. Either you stay at… Read more »

    To 149
    Guest
    To 149

    “She could be wrong, but that’s between her and G-d”

    Are you crazy? In HER HOME, it’s between her and G-d, but in THE STREETS, it’s not between her and G-d, but between her and her fellow yidden! She MUST have respect for her fellow yidden when she goes out. Stop confusing people with that displaced tolerance. What you do in the streets is public.

    to the writer
    Guest
    to the writer

    hes not right but ur not right either ur in the rebbes shcuna treat it with respect

    Asher
    Guest
    Asher

    BS”D

    Get your head on straight!

    1. Since when is it ok for a frum man first gaze at, and then to approach women on the street? Especially a “not quite tsnua” woman?
    2. Shall we no longer welcome all potential baalei tshuvah visiting Crown Heights, bannig them lest they not meet the standard?
    Kiruv is by example. Fix the man in the mirror.

    A gold ring in the nose of a swine...
    Guest
    A gold ring in the nose of a swine...

    is a woman with immodest clothing. Don’t you know men are hard wired differently ? Show respect for our divine differences. You are only looking at half of what a man SEES when you dress that way.That is the sad reality of your grasp of this issue.There is no beauty or joy in making every young man or boy in the street test his character by turning his head around with the most you can show us.Have the maturity and awareness that makes you the foundation of holiness of the world, directly descended from everyone from Sarah.Rachel and Rivkeh to… Read more »

    152
    Guest
    152

    First of all, when we orthodox write the word G-d we do not write it the way you did! Second of all, Chabad orthodoxy is not known for radicalism. The Rebbe spoke strongly on the subject of tsnius but never said a lack of it was like being shmad!!!!!! What kind of gibberish are you spewing???? YES, women must dress tsniusdikly when they walk down the streets of crown heights or any other street, but let’s not get carried away with extremism!!!

    shobbas
    Guest
    shobbas

    when u some1 asks u do u keep shobbas u cant say most of the time u either keep shobbas or u dont just like tznius if some1 asks u r u tznius u cant say ya mostly i mean i cover my knees but not my elbows u either r tznius or ur not

    why
    Guest
    why

    is tznius rlly important

    Don't blame the victim
    Guest
    Don't blame the victim

    “Dumb if u are writing a article u dont leave out details like “almost 100 % tznius” how are we supposed to translate that to mean?? i take it that u are saying half truth that u really werent properly tznius and u were a little tznius in some places and therefore u could say “almost 100 %” It doesn’t matter what she is wearing! Whether she was wearing sleeves that were a tad short or a skirt with ultra sheer hose or her skirt was to the knee but the wind was blowing it – it doesn’t matter. Two… Read more »

    To  D.Benveniste
    Guest
    To D.Benveniste

    Seriously? If the article was written about some sheltered place, maybe, BUT this is Beooklyn NY, the men better get used to minding their own business and not having a major battle to overcome every time they see an immodest woman. There are many things on the streets of this city that are innapropriate, you learn to control yourself and not pay attention to them. And at the end of the day, if he sins it is HIS AVAIRA, halacha is clear about that. Sorry to all the men who are so up in arms, but maybe that’s why, they… Read more »

    Drill a Whole in your seat... is NOT PRIVATE BIZ... =(
    Guest
    Drill a Whole in your seat... is NOT PRIVATE BIZ... =(

    unfortunately, since how women dress in public has a (Massive) impact on the (Blessings & Fortune of the) Entire community it is not private personal preragative no more! according to many Torah sources (including the Rebbeh who we all trust) immodesty chases away Devine protection from a comunity R”L many tragedies occur as a result of lacking Hashem’s protection Ch”V no need to elaberate on the clear corelation of the spike in Tragedies we’ve all seen recent years, as the Tznius declined! (The politics was always with us in the 80’s 90’s etc) what changed was the Huge increase of… Read more »

    PPL ARE DYING!!
    Guest
    PPL ARE DYING!!

    be considerate to all the families who are suffering devastating losses due to the surge in Disasters!! hiting our community

    (torah clearly predicted this HYR)

    show true love to the public & control ur urge to be immodest in public
    THIS WILL PREVENT SOO MUCH SUFFERING! PLEASE HAVE RACHMANUS!

    Tznius brings Hashem's protection!
    Guest
    Tznius brings Hashem's protection!

    Do it for your kids!

    Whistle treatment
    Guest
    Whistle treatment

    I think all woman dressed untzniyus should get a whistle treatment from all the men they pass.

    to 142
    Guest
    to 142

    I think you are 100%. Let every girl/women go as they wish. Let the schools accept the students dressed as they wish. Let the shuls accept the women dressed as they wish and try to be mekarev them. Let your wife and kids dress the way they want. Lets be liberal.

    LIFE IS A JOURNEY BE A GUIDE NOT A STUMBLING BLOCK!
    Guest
    LIFE IS A JOURNEY BE A GUIDE NOT A STUMBLING BLOCK!

    thank you to #70
    we have to keep at this issue in the CHABAD way. YISROEL.if someone is not Tzniusdik consider them like someone you are trying to Mekarev!
    Would you talk so roughly to such a person?

    Could you imagine talking like that to someone who walks into a Chabad House?

    Our children don’t get the tznius “thing”. We did something very wrong to get to this point.

    Lets ALL start looking to how our Shluchim behave with their people and learn from them!

    to #142
    Guest
    to #142

    you’re describing the chabad approach in dealing with yidden who are not frum,who are from the outside. the chabad way for lubavitchers has never been it’s Ok to pick and choose but to exhort each other to go higher.what do yo uthink a frabregen os a mashpia is for?

    Wanda Ring
    Guest
    Wanda Ring

    Sounds like this guy was exercising his First Amendment right of free speech. Did he do anything other than say things the lady found offensive? Let her not listen. If the truth hurts … If he lifts a hand, call the police. Otherwise, tough.

    Who is the victim here?
    Guest
    Who is the victim here?

    It”s so funny that you know that you are not 100% tzniyusdik and you are totally fine with it. You see, a lot of people in this community are not totally fine with it, because this is a community that was established on the basis of halacha, not almost halacha. I chose to live here because of that. I really don’t want my daughters to be exposed to your almost way of dressing and think it is an acceptable option. It’s not. You made up your own rules and now you are imposing them on the rest of the community.… Read more »

    Kiruv
    Guest
    Kiruv

    Is annoying, embarrassing and harassing women the way that shluchim make 1000’s of Baalei Teshuvah?

    Why of all the things this “yossi” could be doing he choose to stand in kingston watching how women are dressed.

    Tznius is a sign of how disappointed and uninspired people are, and not the problem itself.

    Much harder to inspire than to shame, yossi, but it works.

    PS: If I ever see you bothering any women, I shall… bother you to say the least.

    hmmm...
    Guest
    hmmm...

    I skimmed over the last 50 or so articles, so i cannot say for sure that i am the first to bring up this topic (it’s understandable if i am not, it seems like every possible point to argue has been done so….over and over) but i just wanted to state this: i sincerely hope that all those who are commenting to “get out of CH” if this woman cannot conform to the halachos of Tznius realize what they are saying. it is ok for women to move elsewhere and dress how they wish? why is CH the only place… Read more »

    Be positive
    Guest
    Be positive

    If you want to encourage women to dress more Tznius you should have women handing out free chocolate to women that are 100% tznius. If someone comes for the chocolate and is not appropriately dressed then you hand them a pamphlet with the rules of tznius and the sources. Ask them to come back appropriately dressed. If they have the pamphlet and are appropriately dressed this time then they should get twice the chocolate. If chocolate doesn’t work how about a coupon for $1 off at a local store.

    california girl
    Guest
    california girl

    To comment #19,
    watch out when you generalize. I am born and bred in L.A. and am 100% tznius as well as my daughters. And , still manage to be stylish and not nerdy as well!!!

    ?elbows?
    Guest
    ?elbows?

    what about elbows???

    to the author
    Guest
    to the author

    listen,i’m not saying this to insult you.i’m just telling you like it is.when a women doesn’t dress tzneeus,this shows a lack of yiras shmayim and kabalos ol and i therefore won’t eat anything she baked or cooked.

    TZNIUS?
    Guest
    TZNIUS?

    TO QUOTE THE REBBE – FOR THOSE THAT STILL GIVE A DARN ABOUT WHAT HE SAYS; “WHEN A WOMAN DRESSES UNTZNIUSDIK SHE IS IN EFFECT MAKING A STATEMENT THAT SHE HAS NOTHING ELSE TO SHOW FOR HERSELF. DO YOU WOMEN WHO MAKE ME AS A WOMAN FEEL EMBARRASSED NOT WANT TO BE SEEN AS SOMEONE WITH A BRAIN AND PERSONALITY RATHER THAN JUST A BODY WITH PERHAPS A DECENT OR GOOD FIGURE????

    usa
    Guest
    usa

    Whether its right or not, this is the United States of America and noone has a right to tell anybody to move out of the neighborhood. It is illegal. As a married women in this neighborhood, I feel an immense pressure to look good on the street for none other than my husband. I dress for him only. It is my choice and you extremists cannot take away my choice and my rights to wear what I want.

    to 128
    Guest
    to 128

    I appreciated your words of wisdom in this sea of idiocy.

    seriously guys
    Guest
    seriously guys

    It is not just the women that are not tzniusdik. What about the internet problem in our community? What about the onslight of internet problems that has overtaken alot of our good men from good yichus families?
    That cannot be good for Klal Yisroel either. So yes, women please get more tzniusdik for klal yisroel but gentlemen you know who you are……… clean up you act for Klal Yisroel also.

    Why I show my knees
    Guest
    Why I show my knees

    I am a girl here in CH and I find I have to compete with all the other stylish girls because I care how I look to them. I don’t want attention from men, I only dress for myself, but seeing everyone out and about loking good and being free, makes me jealous. I don’t yet have a husband to dress for, but I think that most of the guys are looking for somone who dresses like me.

    to 185
    Guest
    to 185

    for your own good get a mashpia, its well worth the effort!

    you will find that doing the right thing is far more satisfying than trying to compete with the lowest commondenominator -race to the bottom

    a maSHPIA PROVIDES GREAT SUPPORT & AFFORDS YOU THE ADVANTAGE OF A FRESH OBJECTIVE OPINION TO AUDIT ALL YOUR GOAL TO HELP KEEP YOU FOCUSED & ACCOMPLISHING

    WHEN YOUR ON TRACK, YOUR NATURALLY LESS VULNERABLE TO PEER PRESSURE ETC

    BEC YOU FEEL GOOD ABOUT YOURSELF & WHERE YOUR LIFE IS GOING

    mind ur own business!!!
    Guest
    mind ur own business!!!

    It’s a free country! Just because someone isn’t 100% tznious in crown heights u can’t judge them! Don’t judge a person till u walk a mile in their shoes. Ppl have challenges. U have you’d, others have theirs too. So until u overcome every single challenge u have which is impossible, don’t judge! What his man is doing in 100% wrong. I’ve been in boro park lately. Not one man I passed was looking at women to see if they were tznious. If men wouldn’t look they wouldn’t get offended. These ppl make such big issues with tznious because they… Read more »

    att: 128
    Guest
    att: 128

    you cracked me up!!!!

    wow!! thats alot of coments!!!
    Guest
    wow!! thats alot of coments!!!

    as for the story: THATS DISPICABLE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
    MIND UR OWN BUSINESS & GET A LIFE!!!! DUDE HAS NO BUSINESS TELLING STRANGERS WAT TO DO!!!!

    oh vey
    Guest
    oh vey

    ok, the fact that it was a man that stopped you is completely inappropriate! its unacceptable that a man should be looking you up and down BUUUUT on the other hand, being almost perfect is going against halacha to the same degree as wearing a bakini! yes, i know thats not how we think of it and foresure for oursleves, we shouldnt say “oh, if im going to wear a skirt an inch above the knee, i may as well wear a tank top!” CHAS VSHALOM!!!! but there should be no reason for anyone stop you in the first place!

    judge the ACTION not the PERSON
    Guest
    judge the ACTION not the PERSON

    its ok to call a spade a spade! if a ACTION is wrong its ok to say its wrong! just dont JUDGE the PERSON!

    maybe its not their fault! be dan lekaf zechus!

    assume the person (wrong doer) is better than you given their internal & external circumstances!

    never judge others! even if their acrtions are completely WRONG

    tznius advocate!
    Guest
    tznius advocate!

    this man (if he exists) is not following tznius!

    to 185
    Guest
    to 185

    how do “we” bochrim find u!

    Tznius
    Guest
    Tznius

    Tznius! That is our battle cry! Tznius! We’d rather do or die. Tznius! Cover your knee-es! Cover your elbows, and try not to cry.

    185
    Guest
    185

    Id like to echo the advise of 186

    Having a caring wise mentor is the smartest thing anyone can do at any stage in life
    Especially if your a teenager or looking to get ready for marriage
    Its a great idea even if it wasnt a BakashaNafshi of the Rebbe
    And even if the Rebbe did not promise his Brachos to those who _properly_ follow a perzonal Mashpia

    Disclaimer:
    Its not enough to just go to a mashpia when you have

    mashpia disclaimer:
    Guest
    mashpia disclaimer:

    To fully benifit from the brachos that the rebbeh promissed comes along with having a mashpia, read first hand the Rebbes insructions how to choose the right mentor &how often to report to them even when you have no particular questions or dilemas to resolve; also full disclosure is important as well

    to 135
    Guest
    to 135

    I agree. But what is up with the spelling? Spell check is a wonderful new(ish) development that I think you will find lovely.

    Solution
    Guest
    Solution

    Why not call in the Taliban?

    Much too far
    Guest
    Much too far

    Next time he comes by and says “again”, loudly yell at him that is is not tznius to check out women and to follow them around in the street, and ask him if his wife knows that he is a pervert. Do that loudly, very loudly, loud enough that everyone else hears.

    spelling
    Guest
    spelling

    ppl post comments from their blackberry while waiting @ red-lights!

    as long as u get th point their trying to make, to me thats well spelled enough

    YELLOW CAP???
    Guest
    YELLOW CAP???

    did the guy who harassed you wear a yellow cap ??

    a long comment, a short op-ed
    Guest
    a long comment, a short op-ed

    according to american secular law, how you dress in public is governed by secular laws of “quality of life” & “public safety” & “public sensitivities” its not a free for all. -yes despite the 5th amendment. yes even the secular world wont consider how you dress in “public” as private personal matter. what you decide to show & expose to the public street, is tempered by “public nuisance & safty laws” that means that even secular common sense recognizes that we must take the impact we have on others into consideration. secular law recognizes that there are certain “limits” (albeit… Read more »

    What does the Torah say about Tznius?
    Guest
    What does the Torah say about Tznius?

    “Ve’hatzneah leches im Hashem” “Walk modestly with Hashem”

    Treating other people rudely because you don’t like the way THEY are dressed is NOT TZNIUS. That is their mitzvah, not yours. Harassing people is a Chilul Hashem.

    Personally I can not stand people who smoke. This is a filthy disgusting habit and forbidden by halachah because of the harm that it can cause to a person. And yet you do not see squads of “Shmiras Nefesh” running around snatching cigarettes away from people.

    What are we here, Mea Shearim?

    mrs!open up ahayom yom and see a quote from the rebbe rashab,eheyv es habikeyres ki hi taamidcho al hageyva ho'amiti. p.s. if you don't understand [which you probaly don't] ask someone who dose.
    Guest
    mrs!open up ahayom yom and see a quote from the rebbe rashab,eheyv es habikeyres ki hi taamidcho al hageyva ho'amiti. p.s. if you don't understand [which you probaly don't] ask someone who dose.
    #197 [speling]
    Guest
    #197 [speling]

    it’s a clear outcome of our rebbe’s shita

    To #185
    Guest
    To #185

    You shouldn’t be jelous of how the other gilrs are dressing, just because they’re dressing that way doesn;t make it right. By being Tznius you are showing that you care about your body and therefore you don’t want to expose it. Who says that your type is the type that Bochurim are looking for now adays, I’m sure they want girls who are Tznius.

    To #138
    Guest
    To #138

    wow i thought that that was very well written and nicly put.Thanx for not being so negetive

    I actually get what she's saying...
    Guest
    I actually get what she's saying...

    I totally agree that one’s style can be modest, even it the clothes do not adhere completely to the “laws of tznius”. You can have your elbows uncovered but behave in a modest way, without asking for “negative attention”. If men can’t control themselves when seeing an elbow, those men should be kept out of the streets.

    # 202
    Guest
    # 202

    Uh, I’m an average graduate and if you were to test me on the laws of Tznius I would IYH pass that test… Maybe because I didn’t grow up in Crown Heigths. There are people who come from Crown heights and they’re perfectly fine and Halachicly “ok”. But they come far and few between…

    209
    Guest
    209

    How can you honestly know that you know all or even most of what there is to know Did you know that there are entire books on the laws of modesty. Dress. Speec. intergender guidelines. The severity of being an asset to the sin of man. The longterm afgevts pn ones own children. The impact on ones own intimacy. The impact on the adjacent neighnors. The impact on telatoves who past away. The impact on ones finances. The impact on prolongong galus. The impacton malachei ahshoreis. the impact on the success of the Israeli army. The impact on terminal illness.… Read more »

    210
    Guest
    210

    I wrote comment 209, Yes I’ve been taught well in my opinion, I knew about most of the things you’ve mentioned. yes I know there are whole books on the subject, kinda obvious, I’ve read books about tznius, yichud etc., etc,.And whatever I don’t know, I will learn, I’m only in 9th grade and some of the things you brought up are above my age to know about… so…

    to # 185
    Guest
    to # 185

    whats popular isnt all ways right and whats right is not always popular

    u should remember that the next time u think of all the un tznius girls

    Crown heights
    Guest
    Crown heights

    In ch I c people dating in public and smoking when will moshiach come??

    Objective Thinker
    Guest
    Objective Thinker

    For all those people that are “fed up” with how these women are dressing, you must think objectively. In many cases the Rebbe was a strong advocate of such thinking. If you see somebody doing something that is “wrong”, you must educate them and teach them what s right. It is clear why this man is living in Crown Heights and not on Shlichus. A Shliach is a person who can show restraint and respect, and do positive things through edcuation and warmth. Just imagine if a campus Shliach started to harshly rebuke students (let’s say for example those who… Read more »

    concerned hasid
    Guest
    concerned hasid

    On Shabbos Parshas Shemos 5751, the Rebbe again criticized those who speak ill of our generation[65] and added the following point: “There are those who wish to suggest that such a path of rebuke and citation of punishment, retribution, etc., is authentic as it is the path of the Mussar Movement. This is how the Maggidim of old used to rebuke their congregations. They further add that all the writings of the Prophets are full of such rebuke. “The answer: “In addition to the fact that in most recent generations the way of Chassidus has been embraced in most Jewish… Read more »

    CH – many communities today
    Guest
    CH – many communities today

    Hey, new flash – CH is a not a private gated community. It is a neighborhood within NY city that today is a home to multiple Jewish (mostly orthodox) communities of various levels of observance that share various levels of connection to Lubavitch. Period. Those of you that want a more homogenized level of observance and a single standard of Tznius, need to consider creating a private community somewhere else, where you can legally enact modesty bylaws and enforce them to your angry little hearts content. Just follow the Monroe or New Square model. As to your claims that the… Read more »

    abuse
    Guest
    abuse

    verbal abuse is abuse, and more damaging than physical abuse. While physical torture can inflict wounds and corrupt a person with anger… verbal assault is the most damaging to a persons productivity, their ability to love and their souls strength over their mind. next time you have a point to make to an ENTIRE GENERATION about theyre adherence to your view of jewish modesty laws.. start a revolution of gemilas chassadim, not street hazings and abuse on mild mannered civilians. …and yes, if you are so compelled to act in the way this article described… SEEK HELP. You are exhibiting… Read more »

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