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Wednesday, 17 Tishri, 5780
  |  October 16, 2019

Still Recovering From Camp

From the COLlive inbox: Our family is still recovering from my daughter's experience as a "Pioneer Counselor" in camp. Full Story

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directors are abusive
Guest
directors are abusive

The Big camps, (Corporate camps) treat the staff like garbage, and pay them nothing, all while telling them that this is for the rebbe, so why get paid… If for one year, the directors had to come begging for staff, they would start treating them nicely.
This is besides the abuse and rejection hundreds of applicants get while applying to be staff, simply bc they didnt have the connections or name their friend had. They have a little 21 year old telling a 19 year old your not good enough as if… A very corrupt and demeaning system.

Listen to her!
Guest
Listen to her!

BS”D
Thanks for posting!

Thank you
Guest
Thank you
that is what shlichus is all about
Guest
that is what shlichus is all about

since when did we get so spoiled?

Seriously?
Guest
Seriously?

This sounds like a pretty typical camp experience.

hmmm
Guest
hmmm

attention readers while this is actually a very sad situtaion it is DEFINITELY NOT a sterotype for all camps. I have been to and have friends that have worked at many camps all over where the directors are unbelievable and do take great care of hte counselors! But i do agree that you MUST look intot he camp properly beofre going there. relying on what hte director says he will do should not be the basis for your opinion of that camp! But i do have to agree that it does happen often, where a director will agree to accomodate… Read more »

camp
Guest
camp

when i was a counsler in a aday camp in the summer we had a similar experience we went to his superior and he took care of us. he brought us food and gave us an allowance for food to buy. he made sure we should have a decent car to take also the kids where they need. if the shliach on top can do anything or you go to the head shliach of the state. you get parents to call or you leave off grounds for a day to see if he will do something if not you just… Read more »

you ought to tell us the name of this city and director
Guest
you ought to tell us the name of this city and director

so others are not subjected to teh same type of abuse. We have a camp, and go out of our way to treat the councelors fairly and decently.

Disgusting
Guest
Disgusting

I don’t blame her for not wanting to go away for the summer. But another thing is that not all of the shluchim’s camps are like that, in fact most of them arent. I would suggest that you should call references for the camp itself and see how it is. It is such a shame to hear that she was treated that way, no one should ever be rested like that.
My heart completely goes out to this girl… What the camp directors did to her was disgusting and there is no other way for me to put it.

thats digausting
Guest
thats digausting

i feel so bad 🙁 the camps dont rlly care as long as they have staff ! theypromise these stuff and then when they agree its sudddenly …………………. take thier word back !thank u 4 pointing this out

Wondering,,,
Guest
Wondering,,,

To whom, if anyone, is the camp director accountable?Besides the Aibishter, of course! Is there a head shliach involved?
(Or is he the culprit?} Distressing situation. I feel for your
daughter and you.

Been there....
Guest
Been there....

Thanks for writing this. My daughter also had a very bad experience working in a camp. She went with a friend to be a junior counselor in a camp, being told that they wanted her and welcomed her (who else would work for no money?) when she got there, my daughter and her friend were mistreated and/or ignored by the other older staff and the shluchim. The older girls wouldnt even let them accompany them on any of their outings as counselors because they were ‘too young and its not fair to ask us to take them with us.’ So… Read more »

ummm....
Guest
ummm....

She’s 21. should be reasonable for herself..why didn’t she leave if she wasn’t being treated well? something doesn’t sound right.

#1 if this is typical
Guest
#1 if this is typical

if this is a typical camp experience – than maybe camp directors need to attend shuirim on ahavas Yisroel and that it doesn’t just apply to the frei

Thank you
Guest
Thank you

I am sorry your daughter had such a hard summer. I have worked for shluchim who took excellent care of the staff, and have worked for other shluchim who, on the outside, took great care of the staff, but behind the scenes, really worked the HC to the edge. It is simply unrealistic to ask one young girl to be in charge of 8 girls and schedule all activities and get blamed for anything that goes wrong- but a lot of times the shliach only sees that hey- she handled it, so it’s doable. yes, she accomplished it and it… Read more »

2 sides
Guest
2 sides

Dont forget the times girls come to a camp and they need to have everything from A to Z…. During work they are constantly txting and not paying attention to their job…..
IT GOES 2 WAYS

staff member
Guest
staff member

i work for an overnight camp as a married staff member. an established camp that has government requirements runned by responsible people. this wldnt happen there. when i was a girl i worked for a day camp and that is where they take advantage and are irresponsible and are neglegent about the cars they allow the girls to drive in. yes its exciting to go all around the world to exotic places but at what expense???? do parents know the safety or lack of that is going onat the local day camp. overnight camps are very aware of safety. there… Read more »

Hard to Believe
Guest
Hard to Believe

#12:You as a mother sent a 13 year old to a place and people you did not know??? I have two children on shlichus and they don’t know how to do enough for their counsellors. They treat them as they would their own children. They never need to look for counsellors, their reputations are well known. Parents need to look out for their kids and make very sure that they will be well taken care of; do your homework, ask past counsellors for references, protect your kids! This can be a memorable summer that helps our teens grow in so… Read more »

sorry
Guest
sorry

B”H Dear Anonymous mommy, I’m terribly sorry to hear about this unfortunate experience. It’s particularly painful because your daughter “got beat” while on mission to help and inspire others. I’m not a big fan of telling others what to do. In stead I will throw out an idea that might be helpful. For a few summers now, Camp Directors and Camp Head Staff have had the opportunity to take a Camp Leadership Course offered by Rabbi Shmuly Rothman. The directors who took his course have in many ways restructured the way they run camp with the major game changer being… Read more »

Totally aggre!!
Guest
Totally aggre!!

Shlchim should know that words go arnd how they treated their counselors! counselors are human beings…they like to be treated humanely. although i must say there are amazing shluchim out there who treat there employes amazingly..kol hakavod!!!

detroit
Guest
detroit

I have been a counselor in what you will call 2 “corporate” camps (parksville and detroit) and I can for one tell you (and I’m sure many can testify to this) the way you are treated in detroit is defiantly way beyond what the writer is describing here. They may not pay which I’m not saying is a good thing but you fell a sense of appreciation and acknowledgment and most of all accomplishment which I did not feel in other places………

sad but true
Guest
sad but true

There should be a camp blacklist and then the shluchim will realize that if they want staff, they need to treat them properly.

um...
Guest
um...

isnt that all part of the camp experience?
and in thhe cases like this where the conditions rly extreme…
b4 u ever get a job ask other who have had this position b4 and /or knows the directors… dont go working for some1 if u dont kno how theyll treat u..

last summer
Guest
last summer

I spent a summer last year in the west cost which was an unbelievable experience. We had an unbelievable staff trip and everything we needed to give the kids a wonderful summer HOWEVER I had a brother which worked the next month in the boys camp and from what I was described I don’t think abused is the word. They had top notch head staff which not only had no say in what went on…. But after all set and done were left in DEBT!!!!!! What type of treatment is this for a camp how do they plan on getting… Read more »

If this happens to you
Guest
If this happens to you

Pack your bags and leave, don’t allow people to abuse you and then cry about it, if your being abused get up and leave. Let the abuser suffer not you.

Lesson for life:
Guest
Lesson for life:

YOU TEACH PEOPLE HOW TO TREAT YOU!!! Hope this was a learning experience!!!!!

i agree
Guest
i agree

I have worked in a number of camps i do remember nice accomodation but horrible cars (we got into an accident one year)
i would never let my child drive in the cars i drove in
its very irresponsible of the shluchim
im sure there are plenty of Shluchim who this does not apply to but unfortunely many shluchim do take advantage

Not surprised
Guest
Not surprised

Where is this camp? I want to make sure not to send my children there.

#13
Guest
#13

I agree with you!
She is 21! Speak up and make sure your treated well or leave! This does not sound right at all.

Leave.
Guest
Leave.

If your director treats you like that, leave after the first day. Cut your losses and let him find another Shmatte.

Accountability
Guest
Accountability

I am writing this wearing three hats; as a parent of daughters who work in day camps, as an educator and as a parent of Shluchim who run camps.I can attest to the fact that this horrible experience that the young women experienced is a reality for some staff members, yet there are countless camps where the counselors are treated fairly and the summers are a wonderful inspiring experience.The essence of the problem is that thereis absolutely no accountability Shluchim feel a sense of responsibility to the campers and parents and not to the counselors. There have been many instances… Read more »

PLEASE TELL ME
Guest
PLEASE TELL ME

I see many writing that this is normal or shlichus, please tell me
what camps are like this to be sure not to send my kids and have others do the same, if you cant run a camp properly just dont do it. Using a car in this conditions you are risking the life of kids and adults

From a Director's Perspective
Guest
From a Director's Perspective

Not every camp is created equally. It is both the girl’s and the parent’s responsibility to check into the camp that they are interested in. I appreciate phone calls from parents after their daughters have applied, because then I know they care about their kids! Just because a camp is popular doesn’t mean it is a camp that the staff is well taken care of. Parents must find out if the housing is safe, what the food situation is, if the cars are safe and secure. If you have any doubt, don’t allow your daughter to go there! Those camps… Read more »

From a Camp Director
Guest
From a Camp Director

As a camp director, I would like to say I am sorry that your daughter had a negative experience, but it is not fair to put all camps and directors in the same boat. We always treat our staff with the utmost dignity, appreciation and respect! There is nothing that we will not go out of our way to do for them all the while they are here (and before and after)! my husband and I care for the girls in our care as we do our own children, at every hour of the day and night- a full time… Read more »

So you think she should leave?!
Guest
So you think she should leave?!

What happens if she were to leave? She’s shidduch age! You have to be so careful. As soon as someone realizes she was there one year they will call up that shliach and hear all about how she left early, was so irresponsible etc… I haave been in similar situations and I just stayed for the sake of my future. It’s a sad reality.

:) att: directors
Guest
:) att: directors

giv counselors$$$ they wrk hard they r ppl and need to b appreitiated!! $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$

To # 28
Guest
To # 28

I also wan to know where the camp is so I will not send my children there. After such a story it is the writer’s duty to reveal. This is total abuse.

exaggeration
Guest
exaggeration

i detect a serious load of exaggeration in this letter!

Red-flag the poor performers
Guest
Red-flag the poor performers

Camps that year after year mistreat their staff should have their misdeeds made public so that they cannot continue to hire girls (or boys, though this seems to be a larger problem for the girls). My daughter was in a similar situation as the girl in this story, and only later did she find out that the camp had a history of mistreating councilors. The problem is that nobody wants to rock the boat for all sorts of both real & imaginary reasons (consider that shluchim who run shoddy camps may not be above bad-mouthing the staff to save face).

old timer
Guest
old timer

parents have a responsiblility to CHECK OUT the conditions of the camp before sending your kids.

and i totallly agree that rabbi shmuly rothman is the BEST thing to hit lubavitch since sliced bread.
go shmuly!

Possible Solution.........
Guest
Possible Solution.........

Staff should not be the only ones to give references. When you apply for the job, ask the Director for names and numbers to past staff. I have worked for a few camps, and while most where awesome and I would have no problem sending others there, one of them was run by a “Director” who besides for having no idea how a camp should be (which became obvious when we would speak about camp, schedules etc.), would treat the staff horribly, and greatly neglected the basic needs of the staff. Needless to say, that if I (or any of… Read more »

Kudos to the Bergsteins
Guest
Kudos to the Bergsteins

As first year counselors, my parents always sent us to Ganeinu in Farmington Hills because they had confidence in the Mentlichkeit and judgement of the Bergsteins. We always had good experiences. It wasnt the most exciting locale, but it was Mesuder and Chassidish. Call the other area Shluchim beforesending your child to camp!

responsibility, credibility, transparancy, accountability, safety
Guest
responsibility, credibility, transparancy, accountability, safety

There should be a standard contract made available and sponsored by a mossad such as Shluchim office, which delineates the responsibilities and expectations of both employee and employer. This should be done for camp counsellors, as well as for a year’s shlichus. It should address responsibility for both the physical and spiritual welfare of the young people hired.

proof!
Guest
proof!

my whole life people told me that ___(“corporate camp name here”)___ is an awesome camp to work in… and so- i finally decided- k. i’M IN, What i didnt know – was that i was in for the worst summer of my life. They treated the janitors better than us! I was so shocked i wanted to write to the director upon completeing my miserable term. directors- Hello! we are working for you 24/7… at least give me one spare second of your attention, so that i can tell you something urgent. I had to wait a few days for… Read more »

NOT ALL SHLUCHIM ARE LIKE THAT
Guest
NOT ALL SHLUCHIM ARE LIKE THAT

I HAD WONDERFUL CAMP EXPERIENCES. THE SHLUCHIM WERE MENTCHEN AND CONSIDERATE. IT IS UNFORTUNATE YOUR DAUGHTER GOT STUCK WITH PPL WHO SEEMINGLY WERE NOT VERY CONSIDERATE OR APPRECIATIVE.

two sides of the story
Guest
two sides of the story

firstly, many shluchim simply dont have the money to pay properly. dont take it as a personal offense! they simply just dont have the money to give it and spend it, especially when you can live without it! also, it is a typical situation, but it can be better or worse. if there is a good group of considerate counselors, it should work better. and explain your needs to others if you want them to be dealt with! some shluchim work harder than others to provide counselors with what they need, so counselors need to look into places before they… Read more »

I know the feeling...
Guest
I know the feeling...

Many years ago I was a counsellor in a large Day Camp on the Canadian Coast and we were given a very very old automobile which was wider then the length of most cars today. One evening brakes failed causing a small dent. At the end of summer I was not paid the promised amount, which caused me great emotional pain and hurt which lasted me some years, although I did take checks and cash from the office which more then covered the debt.

West Coast camp
Guest
West Coast camp

I was in a camp on the West Coast, & we were not given enough money for food. Breakfast didn’t really count – one box of cereal for the week for 12 adults! Dinner – we had to pick up from another Chabad Houses’ “soup kitchen”. Yes, there may have been enough on occasion, but it wasn’t edible. We’ll gladly take cans of corn. We will not take it poured into a pan, without its juice, but submerged in oil! Shabbos – go fend for yourselves and find somewhere to go to sleep and eat! I was lucky BH to… Read more »

NO DOUBT
Guest
NO DOUBT

I SURE HOPE NO ONE HERE IS ASKING FOR MONEY FROM SHLUCHIM THAT DONT HAVE!!!! WHEN IT COMES TO MONEY IF YOU ARE NOT GETTING PAYED AND DONT LIKE IT GO SOMEWHERE ELSE. The problem is when shluchim take advantage and don’t treat staff with respect etc. But I’ve worked for shluchim didn’t get a penny but left with the best feeling in the world… Appreciated….. Nice people that show they care AND THAT IS WORTH MORE THEN THE LOUSY FEW $$$ THAT WOULD GO ALOT FARTHER IF THE SHLIACH KEPT IT FOR HIS MOSAD….

To #46
Guest
To #46

Not having money is not an excuse or a justification for abusing your staff. Every camp director should ask herself/himself the following question: WOULD I BE HAPPY WITH THIS ACCOMMODATION/TRANSPORTATION/TREATMENT? If the HONEST answer is no, then put it right. It has nothing to do with being spoiled. It isn’t unreasonable to expect a vehicle in good working order. Nor is it unreasonable to expect decent food especially if dietary needs were explained in advance. My son was offered a similar job last summer but declined (very sensibly!) when he was told he would probably be the only driver. It… Read more »

To #47
Guest
To #47

YOU STOLE???? And you’re OK with acting worse than the people who cheated you? You took MORE than you were entitled to?

Words fail me.

dear shluchim
Guest
dear shluchim

The biigest issue is please give a safe car for staff to use. It is your Achreiyos.

noooooooooo
Guest
noooooooooo

to # :
that is not what shlichus is about.
ive been n shluchos my whole life and if anyhting the most important part is how u treat eachother. alot of goyim become jewish because they see how well we treat eachother and if camp directors cant treat their on counselors well, then how can parents know that their kids will get treated well. counselors are just as important and if not as important as campers, no counselor should ever feel the way she did, escipacially on shluchos

Esq.
Guest
Esq.

Thank you for the article. I am very happy this is finally coming to light.

Do you also need Mommy to be with you in camp?
Guest
Do you also need Mommy to be with you in camp?

Why does a 21 year old girl need her mother to write about
her poor summer experience?
This girl wasn’t ready for a counselor job the fact that she
didn’t write this article herself, rather having MOMMY writing
it for her.I also think that this girl had no previous driving experience by that weird story of being pulled over.

Dear readers,
Guest
Dear readers,

It has nothing to do with spoiled, it has to do with shluchim having some mentchlichkeit. I sent my daughter on Schlichus for a year to shluchim in the states. Yes they were nice but dont think she wasnt abused. She was the only driver for the year and had to take on the responsibilty of not only her job but that of another girl that left that year at her original salary. Not only did she chauffeur the shluchims children to school everyday but was also involved in shopping for the food and school supplies and shlepping it all… Read more »

Yesh Vyesh
Guest
Yesh Vyesh

As a mother of teenage daughters, I have had both experiences, mostly good, though.

Some shluchim are real mentchen, responsible, predictable, organized and great role models…others…not so much.
The issue of multiple stopovers is a particular pet peeve of mine – it took one daughter over 26 hours to get home from a flight that should not have taken more than 5!

All in all, most shluchim, like most people, are decent, good and hardworking and fair.

okay..
Guest
okay..

im very sorry for your daugfhter and her experience . however to everyone out there , there ARE amazong sweet shluchim out ther and yhou can have an amazing time and help dont let this turn you off . it is also a problem that because shluchim can get girls every year they dont treat them nice moshiach now

dear col
Guest
dear col

Thank you for posting this letter, however I feel you should not post letters that are signed anonymous. If it is true, then there should be no shame in signing a name. Also, whomever these shluchim are, it is outrageous that the writer should not want to make it public knowledge.

IT'S NOT ONLY SUMMER
Guest
IT'S NOT ONLY SUMMER

TODAY sHLICHUS IS STRICTLY BUSINESS. OF COURSE NOT ALL SHLUCHIM BUT MANY ABUSE THEIR GIRLS BOTH BEGASHMIUS BY NOT PAYING AND NOT PROVIDING PROPER MEALS AND LODGING AS WELL AS BERUCHNIUS. MANY GIRLS ARE FINISHED WORKING BY 5 WITH NOTHING TO DO AND NO SUPERVISION FOR THE REST OF THE EVENING. THEY GO TO LOCAL PEOPLE’S HOMES WHERE THE KASHRUS IS HIGHLY LACKING ETC.

How can she reveal the Director?
Guest
How can she reveal the Director?

You cannot expect a young girl of marriageable age to risk ruining her shidduchim. The director was “manipulative” and did not respond when she tried to “assert herself.” This is how a grown man dealt with confrontation from a counselor; I can only imagine how far he goes when this confrontation gets serious.

He sounds like a scary man and I don’t blame “Mommy” and her daughter from holding back, yet sharing some of their story with the world so other people don’t fall into a similar trap.

Best Camp In The World!
Guest
Best Camp In The World!

Well, seems like some have a had a “not so great” experience. If you want to work in a fantastic camp, have a blast and be treated right, then come to Gan Yisroel Miami. 12th Graders and Up- Please apply as Group. Also needed CHASSIDISHE bochurim 19+ . Send names, emails numbers and ages to [email protected] and we will contact you. Yes it works 2 ways, but we treat our staff right…. Thanks to all the concerned parents who really care . In my 17 years as a camp director only 2 parents have ever called me to check up… Read more »

Isn"t a 21 girl old enough to speak for her self??????
Guest
Isn"t a 21 girl old enough to speak for her self??????

Why is anonymous Mommy so on top of her, or maybe she is someone who DOES need her mommy and anything less then a “mommy treatment” is not good enough for her!!!

Please dont generalize!
Guest
Please dont generalize!

I have been to 5+ gan yisroel camps and by every one them the shluchim treated the counselors very well.

also
Guest
also

Just wanted to add that this problem is not only with camps, but also shluchim who hire young girls and boys out of sem.. etc. for the year of shlichus. Many of the shluchim demand more and more as the year goes on, don’t treat their shluchim well at all, always complaining instead of showing appreciation, take advantage and pay very little for tons of work (if they ever do get paid, many times very late). I have heard a few talented young shluchim say they don’t want to work for a chabad moisad again. what a shame to ruin… Read more »

Camps with awesome camp directors!!!
Guest
Camps with awesome camp directors!!!

These camps are run by Shluchim and Shluchos who treat the staff like their own children and go way beyond the extra mile!!!

CGI Edmonton
CGI Cherry Hill, NJ
Silver Gan Israel, Long Beach,CA
CGI Plano TX
CGI S. Barbara
CGI Port Washington
CGI Fairlawn, NJ
CGI New Hampshire

I’m sure there are others, these I know from recent first hand experience. (Can you guess how many children I have?)

Please share your positive experiences so we can know where to send our children.

overnight camp
Guest
overnight camp

Any word on how staff (not too mention campers) are treated by the head staff and directors in our overnight camps?

This sounds like a bochurs life!!!
Guest
This sounds like a bochurs life!!!

Bederech klal this just how bochurim live whenever they go around, and it definitely is not a normal way for us to be treated (though i guess that we just handle it better) but girls?!? that’s just not right!!!

Author is out of line
Guest
Author is out of line

Yes, I have had similar camp experiences. Yes, many people have had such experiences. Yes, there are many people who have such experience while working for a full – not just a summer. Get over it. If you want to get a point across stick to facts. Stick to real issues not “she was the only driver” “no special food in Timbuktu” “long hours” “had to make schedules” A 21 year old girl has a bad summer experience, let HER figure out how to deal with it. (don’t go to camp again, set better job parameters, do better research on… Read more »

Montreal boys camp is the way!!!
Guest
Montreal boys camp is the way!!!

BH, I can say that the director in camp gan Israel Montreal makes a very big effort to make sure the staff are happy and he treats them out to a special “staff appreciation night” once a week and 2 staff trips, that is the way any director should treat his staff and it should definintely be implemented in every camp. (I’m not saying to spend all your profit fromthe camp on your counselors but a little bit of showing appreciation goes a really long way).

to #68
Guest
to #68

too funny! rotfl

Agreed with number 66
Guest
Agreed with number 66

I’ve been to some of the camps you’ve mentioned or been involved with the shluchim in some of the places and i too have had a very positive experience to add to the list of great shluchim to work for is the pinsons and hanokas in pasadena, california, really really great shluchim. I do agree with the author of the article in some way since i have heard from some friends and relatives abt pretty bad experiences but i’d also like to add that your going to shluchim and may not be getting the same accomadations you have at home,… Read more »

We must listen to the other side
Guest
We must listen to the other side

A. I feel very sorry for the shluchim she worked for, I assume they are very poor. B. I wish I can hear their side of the story. C. Years ago I was a counselor in Milwaukee WI, I had a great time, 20+ years later I sent my kids to be counselors, they came back SO happy. D. I hope this mother is also encourage her doughter to get over already, and not all places are the same. Note: Imagine Straggling Shluchim that have to drive this “klanker cars” every day of the year and have no money for… Read more »

One Happy Camper
Guest
One Happy Camper

My daughter has worked at Emunah, and in day camp in Montreal. Each of these experiences were very positive. She was treated well. She was shown alot of appreciation for her hard work by the directors. She really learned alot. The girls or bochurim really need to get referrences from people who have worked at prospective camps in the past before taking these jobs.

a guy counselor
Guest
a guy counselor

though the director should NOT have made promises he can’t keep, everything else sounds like regular camp to me. of course there is only one driver, letting anyone and everyone drive a camp car is a recipe for disaster. creating a schedule? doesn’t every head counselor do that? i created a camp schedule at 18 for a day camp, it took some time, but it happened. special dietary needs? not even going to address that. going to bed at 2 AM is just the counselor life. we deal with it. camp is always stressful, always a lot of work, but… Read more »

Why should she post their name?
Guest
Why should she post their name?

She doesn’t want a man to loose his job and way of feeding his family…rather she just wants people to know to do research before sending their kids away. Don’t expect a young single girl to risk her reputation this way.

Don't scare the counselors of this year!
Guest
Don't scare the counselors of this year!

I’m a tenth grader and even though I’ve been a camper in a certain overnight camp for 5 years, I’ve never worked as a counselor there, or every. This is my first year as a worker and now I’m nervous of how I’ll be treated.

Pardes Chanah Montreal
Guest
Pardes Chanah Montreal

Please add to the list of phenomenal camps! Not necessarily spectacular Gashmius, but incredible staff support system and wonderful directors!

Similar experience for my daughter.
Guest
Similar experience for my daughter.

My daughter had 2 similar situations (though just a stints that lasted 1 to 3 days by 10thgrade, and it totally turned her off to shlichus. On another note, perhaps someone could do some investigating to see if the Rebbe really wants these girls in these shlichus positions before marriage, as I’ve heard some stories…Honestly asking. Does the Rebbe really approve?

to #68
Guest
to #68

You are actually 100% right. No joke. I was a counselor in a camp some years ago. The girls came to their place and said it was too unlivable to even walk into. And they said if they don’t get a better place they will all leave. You can guess what happened. The boys were put there and the girls got a great place. We lived in a place I would put a homeless dog.
(I must add that I had some really awesome summers at other Gan Israels. You get some and you get some.)

best camp
Guest
best camp

all bochurim know that Cgi montreal treats their staff very well!
as far as the pay, you receive a lot more than money which makes it well worth it!

from all the stories....number 47
Guest
from all the stories....number 47

It shocks me that you stole, yes taking money that isn’t yours is stealing!! The hardest place to return stolen money to is a Tzedaka!! Probably you are right and you should not have been made to pay, but stealing! And then taking a bit extra! At least you put a warning out there to all staff of Tzedaka organisations, you can’t trust even one of ours!

camp pardass channah MONTREAL!
Guest
camp pardass channah MONTREAL!

yes, i totally agree with nr 78
pc is a great great camp for staff members!
enjoyed it alot and would def. go back!
i went to diffrent camps as headstaff and staff… nothing like PC!

NAME AND SHAME
Guest
NAME AND SHAME

We dont like to name those responsible in such situations. We should, as this will go a long way in resolving such occurences

some mesiras nefesh needed
Guest
some mesiras nefesh needed

I know that many shluchim are struggling and look at their counselors or young people on shluchis as veritable slaves to help them. Are they creating a vicious cycle for the next generation? We are not shluchim, but we often have guests for meals and put people up. We always treat everyone with respect because it’s the right thing to do and also with the hope that our children will be treated as well as we treat other people’s children. I have no doubt that this horror story is true as are all the others mentioned in this post. I… Read more »

anonymous
Guest
anonymous

thank you very much 4 posting this article

Speak up if you have a misunderstanding DURING the event!!
Guest
Speak up if you have a misunderstanding DURING the event!!

Of course the camp directors have to treat the girls with mentchlichkeit, but as a previous counselor and head counselor and now camp director myself, and as BH mother of counselors and head counselors, it sounds to me that the mother here is outraged on behalf of her daughter – seeing how tired she is etc. ( Normal maternal instinct is to be concerned when kids are exhausted.)But please note: ALL counselors and campers and head counselors come home ready to sleep for a week!! There is even a minhag in Chabad camps not to go to sleep at all… Read more »

sgi long beach, cAli
Guest
sgi long beach, cAli

” I treat my ounselors like m kid. Give them a blastt while ensuring ruchnius and gashmius safety” -directors. Amazing place!!!!!!!!!! Well taken care of in alllll areas

at 21 years old
Guest
at 21 years old

why did she stay the whole summer if it was that not good??

sgtrdhfg
Guest
sgtrdhfg

wait for it. I was told by a shlucha that i would never become a shlucha because of a particular incident whilst on a shlichus ( i left after that)
Well glad ive proved her wrong.

Lubavitch its time to anonymously name and shame.
this shluchis/camp sit is way out of hand,

Some shluchim camps
Guest
Some shluchim camps

Still owe my sister money when the directors said they would pay for her flight and asked her to lay out the money and should would get paid back. Well they NEVER paid her back and this is a chabad camp how sad :(. When her parents call to speak to the director they don’t answer the phone or when they do answer they just hang up… Is this the Chinuch you work so hard all year round as a shliach to instill in our own??? Praise be those who are honest and the greats shame shall be on those… Read more »

Whats the big deal?
Guest
Whats the big deal?

We gave her an exotic antique automobile to drive, and let her do it the entire summer and every day for hours on end, people pay lots of money for old exotic cars, she should be thanking us. AC was dripping yellow? That was done on purpose so that she should get out of bed and stop being holed up in her room all day, so that she can get some exercise. The stopovers on the way were done intentionally and actually cost more, we wanted her to travel the world and see places. Also she finally got to experience… Read more »

The best directors in the world
Guest
The best directors in the world

Gan Israel Day Camps, Suffolk County & Merrick, Bellmore

HERE IS HOW IT IS DONE
Guest
HERE IS HOW IT IS DONE

As someone who served as camp director but for several years prior as a head counsellor – the counsellors are my esponsibility – I am their summer father. I will fight for their rights. I will ensure they eat well and that they have where to be for Shabbos. I will tow them in when so required but otherwise I know I cannot run a good camp without happy counsellors. That’s the way I did it in Miami, Denver, Maryland, Massachusets, London and NY. That’s the way you should do it too!

i was there
Guest
i was there

i was a counselor in a camp that had a good reputation and the director is famous for his camp ‘ideology’ and i was treated like dirt. There was no repect, his quotable quote would be “i am a big fan of open communication” gimme a break! i had to call to ask about something and hung up in tears, you had no worth to him and it was disgusting. Even though new directors took over the camp, the scars that it left me with prevent me from ever going back. Shluchim and camp directors, put yourself in our shoes… Read more »

#33
Guest
#33

Columbus was the best day camp experience I ever had. (Speaking 5 years later having gone to 5 different day camps…)I had a blast in camp and out and can personally testify that you really are well taken care of there! Thank you so much Andrusiers!

to this 21 yo girl
Guest
to this 21 yo girl

please take a trip to africa or even places in israel and see how most of the world is living today and you would appreciate everything these directors did for you

look closely
Guest
look closely

she is not complaining about the basics but about extras in life! i think we are spoiled and expect too much from this world. expect less in life and get more and you will be very happy

Cherry Hill Rocks!
Guest
Cherry Hill Rocks!

Go Directors! They are amazing to their staff!

TO 91
Guest
TO 91

10 points love it

2 sides
Guest
2 sides

You will always have that 1 or 2 girls that will not have a good time and will speak bad about the camp. i know of the best camp directors that ended up with some bad girls and had to have them leave in the middle of the summer! remember as much as the girls want to be treated as people so do the directors and the campers of that camp

camp Leah Rivka
Guest
camp Leah Rivka

The great filling that camp Leah Rivka give to is staff and campers Should be copy by all other chabad organaztion

how not mentchlich
Guest
how not mentchlich

How bout shluchim in europe that put my daughter on a flight home on ___ tishabav__, so she shouldn’t stay by them an extra few days.

to #95
Guest
to #95

was i in the same camp as you, or is there more than one director who says that he;s a fan of open communication? 🙂 some thing tells me it’s the same camp, although i had a fantastic experience there! i was there for a few summers, and many many staff members went back numerous times because the director was such a mentch and took care of us really well. and he was a fan of open communication, he listened to us, and really took what we said into account.

Sick- sorry to hear :(
Guest
Sick- sorry to hear :(

That is abuse and whoever is saying that the girl should have written the article, are you serious?! Why can’t a mother stick up for her child, no matter the age or stage of life? Sounds like you are trying to sidetrack people from the real situation at hand- abusive camp directors. Yes there are good camp directors out there, I was a counselor at a day camp for a few summers, was close with the shluchim and they treated us really well but there are obviously places where that is far from the case and it is horrifying. To… Read more »

detroit
Guest
detroit

Looking to send 2 sons and one daughter to detroit camp this summer (on son was in parksville last year) anyone know how it works there? One is going as a staff member how are the staff treated, how does the camp run etc?????

calling all camp directors
Guest
calling all camp directors

You have our attention 🙂

Post your camp, contact info and some compelling reasons for our children to come work for you this summer.

Would love to see a list of camps, what the jobs entail and some convincing reasons that my child will be well taken care of.

This could be a very productive twist for this widely read and commented post.

Send to Sweden
Guest
Send to Sweden

In the Shluchim kids camp there you get treated with royalty and they REALLY care. Most counselors came back 3 to 4 times in a row

From a Camp Director of an over night camp.
Guest
From a Camp Director of an over night camp.

From a Camp Director As a camp director, I would like to start by saying I am sorry that your daughter had such a bad experience. As I am relatively new with my new role and I know there is always room for improvement. It is hard for me to believe that any one would treat a staff member like this. As I am sure every director knows that his camp will leave an impression/impact on all the campers and counselors. I am sure every director wants it to be a positive one. I for one would like to hear… Read more »

#108
Guest
#108

TOTALLY AGREE!!!! SWEDEN SHLUCHIM OVERNIGHT CAMP IS AWESOME!! 😉

once a counselor
Guest
once a counselor

go OTTAWA!!

SWEDEN
Guest
SWEDEN

Most Shluchim treat their staff with respect but with CGI TZEIREI HASHLUCHOS SWEDEN there is something special!!!
The Namdars’ treat their staff like royalty and are really mentchen!!!! The children have the times of their lives! I’ve been to their camp all the years and it was UNBELIEVEABLE!
Most of the staff came 3 or 4 times!! I have been to many camps, but this one is just INCREDIBLE!!

:-)
Guest
:-)

110 comments in one day–boy does this articles strike a nerve. Col has many juicy articles, but these numbers in evidence of the relatability of their readers. There is too much to say, and at this point it seems like most of it was said, but one point is still true in 2012. A camper or counselor gets preferential treatment if they are children of parents from “the old country.” The only way a staff member can attain a desirable job in by having a “flattering last” name. An unknown BT name gets put to the side (unless he made… Read more »

Not all camps are the same
Guest
Not all camps are the same

Not all camps are like that, in fact a lot of camps treat staff well

From a Camp Director
Guest
From a Camp Director

This has and would never happen in our camp

Why didn't she just pack her bags and leave???
Guest
Why didn't she just pack her bags and leave???

If someone treats you like garbage, why waste your time with them????

To 113
Guest
To 113

I hear you loud and clear. The good thing is we are all adults and we’ll make sure not send out kids there–unless they can prove jn changed. Thank god lubavith is no longer in the “dark ages,” and many other camps have arose. So BH we now have options. They had no reinforcement to comply with social norms for they ran the market back then.

"been there done that"
Guest
"been there done that"

I am a camp director today in my place of shlichus for the past 20+ years. I know exactly what NOT to do to my counselors from my own experiences as a camp counselor. My friend and I were BEGGED to come run a 3 week camp that was in its second year and needed a boost. We were “past camp age” 2 years out of seminary and really did it because the shliach was desperate. When we arrived he did not want us to know that his registration was all of 4 kids 2 of whom were questionably Jewish… Read more »

Shlichus
Guest
Shlichus

Unfortunately, this is what we call ‘Shlichus’ for many teenagers / young adults.
They are under paid, over worked, and treated terribly.

Im sorry
Guest
Im sorry

Im sorry to hear about your troubles, there is no excuse in the world for treating any human being that way. I am yeshiva bochur looking to go to day camp as i did this past summer. I saw a ad online for a camp, i spoke to the director and found the previous years staff members. i then went to call the staff members directly and they had negative things to say and that they weren’t treated respectfully. without hesitation that camp was off my list. Please do your research and this camp should not have a near impossible… Read more »

Ahavas Yisroel
Guest
Ahavas Yisroel

I personally know the author of this article, and my heart truly goes out to them. They are absolutely the nicest, kindest, hardest-working people I know. Consider the fact that after all this, she did not mention any names or even the name of the camp so as to not say Lashon Harah!!!
No one should have to fight for the basest amount of respect and dignity. Being on shlichus does not give the head shliach any right to make people miserable.

necessary article
Guest
necessary article

Thought about writing an article after last summer. Ive paid thousands to send my kids to a well known overnite camp.My daughter went back as a staff member and not only didnt have support (for mothering a very young bunk) but she didnt get paid.Im horrified that a well known camp that charges a fortune to attend does not pay their counselors!This is veerryy wrong! If they had no money,no problem but to charge so much and not be there for the hard working counselors or pay them (even a little-obviously the camps cant or wont pay what overnite counselors… Read more »

Detroit
Guest
Detroit

my summer i was in detorit camp as a staff member outweighs the other camps i was in.
even though they may not pay as much ..its well worth it!
in all the camps i was in i felt i went down in my yiras shomayim but my summer in detroit was exactly the opposite. And i also had the most enjoyable time! it definitely was by far my best summer bgashmius uveruchious! i would highly recommend it

GO COLUMBUS, OH!!!!!
Guest
GO COLUMBUS, OH!!!!!

I worked there, and the Andrusier’s do an amazing job running their camp and taking care of staff! I would recommend it in a second!

high expectations
Guest
high expectations

When signing up to be a counselor, you need proper expectations. It seems as though this girl expected to receive 5 star treatment. Yes, as counselor is a 24/7 job, especially if you agreed to be a driver. You have to realize that shluchim don’t have the extra cash to but new cars or spend an outrageous sum of money on airfare when there is a cheaper option. As a counselor, you need to be willing to sacrifice amazing gashmius for unbelievable ruchnius. If this girl cannot exist on a small amount of sleep or with poor living conditions, she… Read more »

to number 12
Guest
to number 12

she wasnt 21 then she was eighteen and you should talk maybe she couldnt and its alot diffrent and its disgusting to say that

another Cherry Hill fan!
Guest
another Cherry Hill fan!

one of, if not THE VERY best camp!!!
Shluchim are more than amazing!

cgi vermont is the best camp
Guest
cgi vermont is the best camp

and best shluchim ever!!!

come to panama its seriously the BEST camp and BEST shluchim
Guest
come to panama its seriously the BEST camp and BEST shluchim
please
Guest
please

youre takin in a step too far and being an overprotective mommy of your adult child. its very normal for there to be one driver- the head counselor and not food that she would have at home. take a chill pill and stop being so overprotective shell be fine

Pardas Chana Fan
Guest
Pardas Chana Fan

If you are looking for a great camp then u should go to pardas chana it is one of the warmest camps and the staff are amazing!!!!!

brought back awful memories....
Guest
brought back awful memories....

Once i did a camp in Europe where they failed to tell us that there will be no food and nowhere to buy kosher food .

Another summer in Russia we(2 girls) were put in a ‘hotel’ which was a 15 min drive from the shliachs house . when we finished supper and working at midnight he hailed us a ‘cab’ ( homemade taxi sign) with drunk drivers (we were once attacked),i had nighmares for yrs after!! I wonder if that shliach would put his daughters such a dangerous situation!??!!

I second #33!!!
Guest
I second #33!!!

I was in Columbus, OH a few summers ago. I had a great time and was treated well. Nice, normal, functioning and SAFE cars and Aviva makes delicious food!!

Best camp
Guest
Best camp

Cgi cherry hill nj rabbi khan

I believe this was exaggerated....
Guest
I believe this was exaggerated....

im sorry, but i as a shliachs daughter know that however much they want their camp to be great, they also have to make sure the councelors are happy, if the councelors are happy then the children are happy and i dont think any shliach would be so cruel! and if this is true then its obviously to do with money wise, and instead of complaining why not try help them out and donate money to shluchim! i believe shluchim work very hard, they go out to random places and have a lot of mesiras nefesh for themselves and their… Read more »

That is abuse
Guest
That is abuse

I am sorry but what those people did is not right!

Camp Pardes Chana
Guest
Camp Pardes Chana

Camp PC is the most awesomest camp in the whole world!! There is no better overnight camp that treats the staff amazingly. If you need a place for your daughter to work this summer Pardes Chana is the place to be!!!
-A very grateful former camper and staff member 🙂
PC ROCKS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

wow
Guest
wow

Detroit really gained a lot from this article. No one has anything bad to say!!! Kudos to them!!!

Add to the list...
Guest
Add to the list...

an amazing camp that we had a fantastic experience and were treated top notch…CGI BOSTON SHALOH HOUSE!!!

No offense to this women...
Guest
No offense to this women...

I understand your complaint and halfway agree with you. I think directors should think first, and give basic necessities, however, I think your daughter happen to have bad luck (with the dripping liquid, etc.)

I feel for you.
A camper

Camp Administrator
Guest
Camp Administrator

Perhaps the proper way to rectify an obvious administrative/managerial problem is to come right out and say it as you did, because obviously, you were not successful in convincing him that he did anything wrong and that things need to be corrected in the future. Personally, I think the only way for him to get the message and learn that this is not the way to treat people and take them for granted is to have come out and say openly who and which camp you are writing about. Then, perhaps, just perhaps he might get the message; and either… Read more »

Fantastic
Guest
Fantastic

Every thing about cerry hill NJ is all true and fantastic the Shlucim r the best

22 yr old girl
Guest
22 yr old girl

hired at a cgi and they did not provide a bed!!! or a closet!

GO DETROIT!!!!!!!!!
Guest
GO DETROIT!!!!!!!!!

EVERYONE LOVES DETRIOT! BEST STAFF, EXTREMLY CARING – ITS AMAZING!

Suggestion of a camp!
Guest
Suggestion of a camp!

Best camp: CGI Indianapolis. The shluchim are Rabbi and Mrs. Schusterman. They are the nicest and most caring people that I have ever worked for.

a counselor
Guest
a counselor

i would like to say that the uminers (shluchim in chestnut hill) were amazing. they treated us like their own children and for that we are truly greatful! After reading this article it seemed like we where in heaven!!

Camp Director's Thoughts
Guest
Camp Director's Thoughts

Being a camp director myself, I am horrified by this letter, and yes I can see it happening. Unfortunately. I am so glad (now) that every camp I went to as a counselor, I had a really horrible experience. Every summer I always landed in a “bad” camp. My friends always felt bad for me ‘cuz’ they noticed the shluchim were just off the wall. So yes, there are stories out there. And unfortunately, many. That is why I am so thankful (NOW) for my experiences. I go out of my way to treat my staff great. I tell them… Read more »

wait a minute
Guest
wait a minute

everyones saying that her mother shouldnt have writen this article, THATS NOT THE POINT!!!!!!!!!! her mom said very clearly that shes writing this in the hope that camp directors worldwide will think about how they treat their staff. I know now is the time when camps are hiring and when young girls and boys look for summer jobs.

To 126
Guest
To 126

High Expectations?!?!
Would you want your daughter to be a counselor where the driver is consistently not getting adequate sleep while driving a marginally safe vehicle at best?

Attention ALL parents of staff...WAKE UP
Guest
Attention ALL parents of staff...WAKE UP

What are you thinking when your son and a friend take a job to “run the small boys bunk” in a camp that is other wise made up of girls staff? What are you thinking when you send your young adult (15-17 year old) who has no past counselor experience and challenged social skills to a camp across the country? Who will you blame when he or she comes home and tells you how they were unsupported by the head staff and got picked on by the general staff? What are you thinking when you say good bye to your… Read more »

to # 16
Guest
to # 16

no matter what the counselors do, no matter if they are texting all day, the shluchim HAVE EVERY RESPONSIBILITY to make sure that their staff are being well cared for and definitely not abused. the counselors must do their part but no matter what happens, the directors are directly responsible.

Shlichus
Guest
Shlichus

I was a counselor at a small day camp up south; the Shliach was horrible to us. He has such a bad reputation he can’t find any body to do his camps anymore, he has no choice but to use his own family as counselors.

ditto to #145!
Guest
ditto to #145!

CGI Indianapolis should be added to the list of top camps!! And the Schustermans are the most unbelievable, sweet, and caring Shluchim ever!!

#1. Camp- Gainesville FL
Guest
#1. Camp- Gainesville FL

there you are treated so nicely by chanie and berl. the dream camp! the best of the best for sure!

Columbia, SC - Best accomadationa EVER!
Guest
Columbia, SC - Best accomadationa EVER!

I was a counsellor in Columbia, SC we stayed in a beautiful hotel, brand new car and treated amazingly.

I loved it!

check it out before! yehuda s
Guest
check it out before! yehuda s

thats why before you go to any camp or school u do research!

to #5
Guest
to #5

i agree

they don't make girls like they used to
Guest
they don't make girls like they used to

Shluchim have to treat their counselors well with respect and to cater to their basic needs, but that girl sounds downright cranky. When your going to a shliach, you are joining the whole shlichus experience, with the sacrifices and everything that comes with it. Shluchim are out there not for their enjoyment, but because they are there for a greater cause, the Rebbe sent them to make the world a better place. Not every moment is hunky dory, but your either on the train for the whole ride or get off. You can either make the best out of any… Read more »

to  #125
Guest
to #125

I’m surprised at your comment. Of course young counselors don’t expect perfect luxurious accomodations, however, This counselor in the article, when asked to be part of the staff was promised that her requests would be met. 10 girls in an apartment with one bathroom??? That’s acceptable?…no airconditioning or fans in a very humid climate, sole driver 24/7 with a van with no traction and upkeep …downright dangerous!! Not given any appreciation for your work doesn’t help things either. No one is asking for the Ritz Carlton…but this is not acceptable…. and at age 21 and a pioneer counselor, she should… Read more »

CGI
Guest
CGI

CGI Gaithersburg, MD
and
CGI Bethesda, MD
are both run by really amazing and nice shluchim!!

Boo Hoo
Guest
Boo Hoo

Sweety, that is waht camp is and has been for decades.
Your daughter was obviously not cut out for the job. Too bad she had no idea before, but it seems to me that anyone who spent half a summer as staff in any camp would have expect this.

cgi running springs- CGI B-ME
Guest
cgi running springs- CGI B-ME

I would definitely have to say that one of the TOP camps out there (and I’ve worked in many) was CGI Running Springs. I was SO excited to hear that the directors, Rabbi and Mrs. Gershon Sandler are opening a new camp this summer called CGI B-ME!! From my experience working with them, I know it will be a smashing success. The camp is geared for public school grils of around bat mitzvah age (B-Me is for bat mitzvah experience), which is a demographic that very few other Chabad overnight camps reach, so its really an amazing experience. They treat… Read more »

Go CGI Columbus!!!!!
Guest
Go CGI Columbus!!!!!

CGI Columbus was the first out-of-town day camp I worked in and I had an amazing experience! The Andrusiers are the best! 🙂 (They feed their staff well and treat them properly. Their cars are safe and the camp is awesome) I totally recommend anyone looking for a place this summer (or any summer) to look into Columbus. WOOHOO COLUMBUS!!!! 🙂 🙂 🙂

By the way, I went summer of 2010, which is recent. So you can be sure it’s an AWESOME camp!!!!!!!!

same in melbourne australia
Guest
same in melbourne australia

i sympathize entirely. my son worked for a local chabad rabbi and was never apprecaited and had to beg to get paid, finally giving a discount in order to get the money he so rightly deserved.

Stop the excuses
Guest
Stop the excuses

For all of you who for some reason feel the need to defend this shliach, just accept that some people are just not nice ppl!!

goooooo columbus!!!
Guest
goooooo columbus!!!

thanks aviva!!! columbus ohio is an amaaaaazing camp!!! i totally recomend it!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

goodness!
Guest
goodness!

seriously?? this letter sounds like its based on truth but on the other hand it sounds like youve just looked for all the bad u could find in the situation. i totally understand. she might have had a terrible summer but it sounds just a little exaggerated. i hope you wrote an email to this camp after the summer. and also if it was last summer why didnt you write this then. so that those specific camp directors would see it and realise its aimed at them. i hope no one has to suffer the same experience though. and i… Read more »

Amazing shluchim!!!!
Guest
Amazing shluchim!!!!

The schustermans in indiana are unbelievable shluchim who live so simply for themselves and give Everything to their staff!

The Konikovs in Orlando are awesome shluchim and selfless!! Really treat their staff unbelievably and took total care of us!!!
Thank You!

go jgr!!!
Guest
go jgr!!!

The Labors treat their staff and campers like royalty!

I’ve been to other overnight camps and there is no comparison! Every kid gets individual attention and there is a normal ratio of counselor to camper which I haven’t seen anywhere else.

BEST PLACES 2 WORK
Guest
BEST PLACES 2 WORK

here r some camps ive worked in that have been awesome:
CGI Cherry Hill
CGI Philadelphia
CGI Milwaukee, WI
CGI Overnight Camp Detroit

Fairfax VA
Guest
Fairfax VA

Fairfax, Virginia is an amazing camp! Rabbi Adler and Rabbi Deitsch treat the girls really well.

To the deniers-
Guest
To the deniers-

If you think that any behavior close to maltreatment or abuse is defensible, you have something wrong with your thinking and your yiddishkeit. There is NO excuse for treating another as if they are trash. Your behavior is mean, pathetic, and obviously thoughtless and ignorant. If I had ANY advice to you, it would be: Quit before you cause more damage, or take a good hard look at your lack of Yiddiskeit. Make things different, and make the camp experience a mitzvah. You are required to do this as a Jew. And if you are defending such treatment, what are… Read more »

i agree
Guest
i agree

many directors are extremely abusive and treat the counselors like garbage, however there is a small minority of camps that aren’t as bad.

ouch
Guest
ouch

this article was frighting to me i want to be a counselor this year and nw i dont know what to do(where to go)

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