Tuesday, 15 Tishri, 5782
  |  September 21, 2021

Rabbi Klein Rips Messianics

U.S. halachic authority Rabbi Menashe Klein has denounced the messianic group within Chabad in a new book. "This sect of crazies, which falsify the Torah and our sages words..." he called them. Full Story

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B/c of some looser...
November 22, 2009 10:49 am

B/c of some looser, who is jealos that he didn’t have a rebbe, u r going to go against everything the rebbe, nosi hador, and novi and father begged us to do… Because for sure he knows better right???!!!!!?!! I don’t belive u can call urself a chassid if u can say these words: “rebbe, I know ur nearly hear, I know everything u told us re. moshiach, but never the less, I am going to not care about u, all u were is a great godol that helped for 40 yrs and left us nice memories (CH’V) and I… Read more »

alright, enough!!
June 24, 2009 12:31 am

you might not agree with him, but were all jews, just with different beleives. he is a great rabbi, just he thinks different than us, chabd chassidim. some of these comments are disgasting.

to 174
June 2, 2009 3:43 am

the rebbe would stress hundreds of times that the frierdiker rebbe’s neshoma is down here , on earth,helping his chassidim.

to 69
June 1, 2009 9:16 am

Davka Farkert. BECAUSE He is Your Rebbe, That’s
why you Should Belive He is moshiach, especeially when he fits the crieteria To be worthy of being moshiach, which the Rebbe M”HM certainly Does. It Says That you are Supposed to belive your Rebbe to be moshiach. The Students of The Arizal, Besht and others belived Thie Rebbe’s to be Moshiach.

to #192
May 19, 2009 7:16 am

I am “point”. I never learned in a kolel. I daven in a Lubavitcher place and know them all. Yes, I learn. And, that is why I am not taken in. I studied the sichos which most Lubavitcher do not understand. It is byond them. This is why they fell into a trap.
I am sorry that teenagers need such thelogy to thrive.

To kollel for life
May 16, 2009 3:56 pm

you make no sense at all..but hey you go learn your fanataic judaism…i always learnt that judiasim was a religion that was not extremist but you…your totally changing that…..ever heard of dirah bitachtonim…making this world a world for Hashem not just sitting over your shtender and learning (not that im saying thats a bad thing) but you need to open your eyes and look at the world…im a teenager and i see lots of kids my age going off the derech because of people like you

May 14, 2009 2:14 am

Let me point out what I see after learning many of the Rebbie’s sichos. He talked about everything. He has at least 4 sichos where he discusses the rambam’s opinion. He learns him like te abarbanel does that the Mashiach will come before techiyas hamesim. That is the seder. The Abarbanel asks how can the rambam say there will be no change in the order when techiyas hamesim is the biggest? The abarbanel discagrees with teh rambam and says taht after the Mashiach comes there will be a change in phase two. The rebbie put taht into the rambam himself.… Read more »

May 13, 2009 5:42 am

I wrote the last post because I see (almost) no one read closely what he said. He did not say what rav Miller said. He was responding to a kuntres sent to him. There is nothing to retract. People will annoy him that is another matter. He is not presenting hatred or repeating the old arguments. Neherag velo mes has nothing to do with what he is discussing. The rebbie is not disqualified. It just turns out that he never was the Mashiach (chezkas or vaadai) in actu. He is at square one. Maybe and maybe not he was the… Read more »

May 13, 2009 4:42 am

The point that Rav Klein is making is that the following belief is prohibited. A man came and was established as the Mashiach (say chezkas) in his life time. He then died (the way we define it-even R. Y. hanosi died). Then this same man will be resurected and continue his mission. This is what christianity believes not judaism. It isd repugnent. yes. A man can come from teh dead and be the Mashiach as long as we believe he never started as one. if so, the previous Rebbie can and even this one. but, then why name someone. Let… Read more »

chossid perspective
May 13, 2009 2:34 am

I am sorry, but this “collection of sources” is twisted
You cannot twist things to accomodate beliefs
one thing is chassiddishe hergesh, but you cannot twist Totah to accomodate this

learn inyonei geula...
May 12, 2009 6:05 pm

learn inyonei geula… you’ll be just fine

Yup Learning = believing!
May 12, 2009 5:51 pm

You can be the greatest talmid chacham on the planet, but if you dont know something you can still be wrong!!

clearly R.Klein is a great scholar in most day-to-day halachic issues, yet has probably less knowledge on this subject than those who follow the rebbe’s request, TO LEARN LEAR LEARN “INYONEI GEULA UMOSHIACH” daily
mah tov borabim!! (i wonder why)

i agree re R Majesky's =must read!!
May 12, 2009 5:20 pm

R Majesky’s collection of sources, on inyonei geula etc is CERTAINLY a must read!!


RK means well
May 12, 2009 3:48 pm

but is clearly in the minority on this matter, even when compared to the litvish gedolim, case in point R. Miller of Toronto (posek) was forced to admit in public that the belife of moshiach min hameisim is within the pail of Jewish orthodoxy!! and was forced to publicly retract his venomous statement against chabad, calling its belief in the Rebbeh as moshiach as baseless and Apikursus! many so called gedolim, were similarly forced to retract their impulsive statements which were based on HERGESH not Torah-sources!! i predict that soon, a retraction from this Rabbi too is on its way,… Read more »

a chossid perspective
May 12, 2009 1:45 pm

RM Klein is a Rebbe’s shliach My neshomo , my life was lost, after being A farbrente brain washed Moshichist for many many years, The Rebbe saved me, Yes, it was impossible to go out from this brain wash, only the Rebbe saved me, learning sichos, Maamorim, davening, I was zoche to find out ,that I could be a billion times better Chossid, being a Rebbe’s chossid,not a Moshiach’s chossid I don’t need my Rebbe to be Moshiach to be his chossid,aderaba, I LOVE the REBBE because the Rebbe. I have my personal feeling that the Rebbe maybe is going… Read more »

to: An Australian Perspective
May 12, 2009 11:15 am

interesting but soo wrong,

if you are knowledgeable of the Torah sources on the topic

and dress and talk like a mentch, you’ll be surprised at the results of a well presented sensible discussion on the matter of the rebbeh as moshiach

it all works neetly together to lead the openminded listener to 1) Jewdaism, 2) Chasidus, 3) Chabad 4) the synthesis of all the above in the reality of the immeinant geula via the Rebbeh as moshiach,

it actually makes the entire scope of yidishkeit come together!

to 172
May 11, 2009 3:26 am

the rebbe always saw himself as an extension of the frierdiker rebb

An Australian Perspective
May 10, 2009 10:56 pm

Gentlemen, Following on Rabbi Telners shabbos drosho, that Rabbi Akivah’s talmidim whilst wanting their fellow talmidim to follow what each thought was the right derech al pi halacha, in fact ended in failure and worse. One could therefore by extension conclude that having something rammed down ones throat which is not based on halacha, rather a hergesh and even then, ones own definition of a hergesh (which could very well differ in intensity between one individual to another even in similarly agended persons) certainly could not be better than what Rabbi Akivah’s talmidim were trying to achieve. The moral is… Read more »

ex-Boro Park
May 10, 2009 6:08 pm

From his point of view (which excludes Sichos an Maamorim) Rav Menashe klein is right except for the following; 1. As pointed out above, if he contends that the Moshiach must, a s a condition precedent be a King (Melech) in Eretz Yisroel, then Moshiach can never ch’v come, a s how can a king be proclaimed until after the Geula in light of the 3 shavous in Kesuvos? 2. He is obviously saying that someone must be appointed a Rebbe as successor, by comparing it to Moshe Rabbenu, who apppointed Yehushua; this comparison is not valid, as the Rebbe… Read more »

to # 39
May 10, 2009 4:30 pm

Yes, he said yechi gives chayos. He did NOT say the additional “Melech Hamoshiach L’olam Voed” part.

kvoidoi bimkomo munach.
May 10, 2009 2:46 pm
LEARN = MESHICHIST!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
May 10, 2009 7:53 am


DO WHAT THE REBBEH BEGED US TO, over and over and over!!!

“LEARN INYONEI GEULAH UMOSHIACH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!




May 10, 2009 6:18 am

Indeed what you say is so true, this piece from R’ M K is actually incriminating to anyone who says that to believe the Rebbe could still be Moshiach is apikorsos. Though I don’t believe the notion that the Rebbe needs to be alive b’daas tachton etc nevertheless R’ Menashe’s attempts to refute it with his V’yesh Lomars and pshotim & chidushim in Medrash & Agada makes R’ Sholom B Volpo look like the Posek Hador.

Addition to #169
May 10, 2009 1:30 am

I saw a Sicha that the Rebbe said about the Frierdiker Rebbe IN HIS LIFETIME, so the Rebbe must have meant he’s alive through his Torah and Shluchim.

yechi hamelech
May 9, 2009 5:40 pm
Friedeker Rebs alive?
May 9, 2009 5:08 pm

So why the rebbe took the leadership upon himself if he mean that friedeker rebbe is alive he would never do two opposites
Poeple cut down your stupidety with some common sense

Learn the Sichos Please
May 9, 2009 3:48 pm

B”H With all due respect to the Rov, it is not fair to publish such opinions and/or statements unless one is familiar with the Rebbe’s Sichos and Maamarim. Like Rabbi D. Berger who bashed the Rebbe and Lubavitch over and over, Rov Klein’s opinions appear to reflect a lack of knowledge of the Rebbe’s teachings over the 40 plus years of his leadership. If only those who criticize would learn FIRST, they would understand the reasons WHY Lubavitchers believe the way we do, and WHY we can still believe in the Rebbe’s valid candidacy as Moshiach Tzidkenu. And to the… Read more »

May 8, 2009 11:21 am

I am very surprised at Rav Klein’s question about the eligibility of the Rebbe being Moshiach as the Rambam says “Yaamod Melech” and the Rebbe was not a Melech. Does Rabbi Klein think the Rambam is talking about someone who will have the din of a Melech even before he is established as Chezkas Moshiach? How could this possibly be. If he was appointed by a Novi, then he would not be only Chezkas Moshiach, he would be Vadai Moshiach and would not need any more simonim to prove his status as Moshiach as it wouldn’t make sense for example… Read more »

To 165
May 8, 2009 11:05 am

After the stroke the Rebbe זי”ע only moved his body/hand, to show that he was accepting there Tefilah that he should live, and every Lubavitcher believes that the Rebbe’s Moshiach, BUT I’M NOT MEFARSEM IT, and I believe he’s in the Ohel.

May 8, 2009 6:27 am


May 8, 2009 6:03 am


May 8, 2009 5:47 am

Nice of him to care so much (rolling eyes) Seems to me he could have been studying Torah, doing Mitzvohs and refining himself and his own group of followers. Guess it was more important to write about Chabad. I work in a place filled with misnagdim, they spend all day making jokes about Chabad. The name means Opposed. Don’t kid yourself how many people are jealous of Chabad’s ongoing success since Gimmel Tammuz.


to 162
May 8, 2009 4:07 am

and did the rebbe move half his body vigrously on chof ches cheshvan ? did the rebbe aprrove the text on the kever of a man ,which stated that he was an ardent follower of the Rebbe M”HM? So YAH!

May 8, 2009 2:40 am

to 147 who calls h7 who calls himself ”kollel for life”: I AM FOREVER INDEBTED TO YOU, oh holy and gaon You, i am but a mere mortal next to You, and You have bestowed on me the Honor to place my SHTENDER next to yours!!! (if you havent noticed, im being sarcastic) please practice a bit the laws of anivus. it will do good for all of us. and maybe break your promise of ‘kolel for life’, step out of the kolel and go to a mental hospital for a few days. i am not afraid of what you… Read more »

May 8, 2009 2:18 am

im absoloutely HORRIFIED by the way you speak about a godul of a man. The comments here are disrespectful, discusting.

About the Frierdiker Rebbe being alive
May 8, 2009 12:43 am

The Rebbe זי”ע said that the Frierdiker Rebbe is alive through his Torah, his Chassidim and Shluchim, NOT in a Guf Gashmi. And the Sicha to say Yeshi Hamelesh applies only when the Tzaddik Hador is alive. And if you look closely, the Rebbe never swung his hand around on 15 Iyar.

pro-rebbe anti meshichist
May 7, 2009 11:38 pm

R menashe never said meshichistim are apikorsim. he said those who beleive the rebbe is STILL ALIVE are apikorsim. aderabe from his tshuva you can see that he holds one can beleive that rebbe can still be moshiach, only that he will get up through tchiasHAMEISIM. i’m saddened that everything must be said so bluntly. but not speaking clearly brought this problem in the firs place

hey HE'S HUMAN!!!!!!!!!
May 7, 2009 7:59 pm


May 7, 2009 7:57 pm

to LUMP together all yechi amd Meshichistim as he does

is the biggest evidence of his “IRRELEVANCE” and how misinformed and out of touch he is (perhaps thanks to his inner circle of chabad-lovers)

let him get to know some of our “mishichist” rabonim personally before making sweeping generalizations!!

let him her the arguments etc…

unfortunately HE HAS TURNED DOWN all attempts the last 5 years!!

what is HE afraid of??!

when he came to 770 after gimel tamuz 2 bachurim, stumped him silent and left him flustered! HE HAS CLEARLY NOT GOTTEN OVER THAT SINCE!

May 7, 2009 7:50 pm

get off your high horses and learn alittle “inyonei geula and moshiach” be prepared for some uncomfortable “growing pains” you are gonna be SHOCKED and STUMPED (and hopefully HUMBLED) by what you findout! yes to believe that the rebbeh can be moshiach is 100% within torah sources, and to believe that the Rebbeh is NOT dead in the grave like any otherTzadik, has a number of Mekoros as well, exactly what the Rebbe;s status is untill the complete hisgalus is spelled out in Zohar, Yalkut shimony, Rashi, Several meforshim, see Rabbi Shlomo Majesky’s booklet on Geula and Moshiach where he… Read more »

May 7, 2009 7:43 pm

why is everyone soooooooooooo in shock that a mere mortal wrote a whole book (many books) and FINALLY u cought him by a mistake! cut him some slack!! please! hes like really old! he;s surrounded by sonei-mishichistim feeding him one big jumble of info, what do you expect??? leave the Rabbi alone again, NO BODY IS PERFECT, WE ARE ALL ENTITLED TO MAKE A MISTAKE ONCE IN A WHILE, soo get over it, and appreciate all the nice things he wrote in the rest of the Sefer!! ONLY A REBBEH CANT MAKE A MISTAKE, OTHERWISE HOW DO WE KNOW THAT… Read more »

the MAN means well
May 7, 2009 7:37 pm

he really wants to know the truth!!

why not send to him, a delegation of TALMIDEI CHACHOMIM, equiped with 1000 pages of Torah sources (that he probably never knew existed)
than we’ll see which SNAGS or ANTIs are gloating!!

simple q. (2)
May 7, 2009 7:35 pm

2) sicha of parshat mishpotim 5752, that moshiach started to have an affect on the world, disarmement agreament, see

in english:

1) kuntress beis rabeinu shabbovel in english:

2) sicha of mishpotim 5752:

May 7, 2009 7:34 pm

THOSE WHO ARE OPENMINDED will do the research and discover the SHOCKING TRUTH

that what seems NUTS! is actually well backed by many torah sources

and surprise surprise!!

many gedolim are actually very “IGNORANT” of major amounts of INYANEI GELAH… its really AMAZING!!!!

simple q.
May 7, 2009 7:30 pm

1) kuntres beis rabbinu shebbovel,

May 7, 2009 7:29 pm

try this, (its lots of FUN!!) find any Snag Posek, Godol etc ask the following questions: 1) is there a Makor in Daas Torah that allows Moshiach min hameisim? 2) is there a Makor in Daas Torah that allows a convincing appearance of Death, yet in fact was a test (in faith of Moshe’s words)? 3) Is there a Makor,,, that right before Moshiach comes, he will be resisted by BIG BIG TALMIDEI CHACHOMIM? 4) is there a Makor… that Nosi = Moshiach, 5) is there a Makor… Moshiach’s body will be hidden for a Darker period of galus After… Read more »

May 7, 2009 7:05 pm

how many lechayims did you have before your comment?

loz oput

May 7, 2009 6:31 pm

when a mishichist asked him to proove that moshiach cant be “min hameisim” he squirmed!!!!!

then the m. asked, did you ever find a makor that actually predicts that noshiach will be NISGALEH, NICHSEH, CHOIZER VNISGALEH? …again nisht gelaint!! …he never read that either!!!


any 8th grader in OT. can STUMP this self proclaimed ONOV


May 7, 2009 6:23 pm


is it a shock to u, that a 90 yr old, is being fed info by “anti-chabad” ppl with an agenda,?

learn some history,






Responsible Reporting
May 7, 2009 5:34 pm

The staff of C.O.L. should be more careful in reporting things just for sensationalism. There are other non-chabad sites that quote C.O.L. and they are directly responsible for the anti-Chabad comments posted there (see vosizneias.com)

Kollel for Life
May 7, 2009 4:03 pm

To #145: See 136 – “…there is a toeles(positive purpose) to be marbitz (disseminate) my da’as Torah l’rabim (true Torah views to the masses), even if done through a non-kosher forum. ” “It is time to be mekarev (bring close) those who are tinokos shenishbu (kidnapped infants) and were born into a society that has left mainstream Yiddishkeit. Such people may not be apikorsim (heretics), since they don’t know better. By being mechanech (educating) the fringes of our brethern, we may salvage a few misguided souls.” “Learn Torah! Be meshamesh talmidei chachomim! Be mikabel da’as Torah! Support lomdei Torah! Marry… Read more »

Where did this meshugas originate?
May 7, 2009 3:21 pm

The false belief that the Rebbe belongs to a special category is not alive like other great tzaddikim. Rather, he alone still has a physical body after his demise. I recall that Mr. Rami Atiyon a”h once mentioned this meshugas at his son’s sholem zachur which I attended. He likely regrets saying it now. As we know, he was not a Torah scholar, but a fortunate person, who was rich for awhile. The Torah states that “Yaakov lo meis” – that our forefather Jacob never died. The Zohar asserts the same about Moshe Rabeinu. As Rashi explains there that his… Read more »

since when do snags come on COLLive?
May 7, 2009 3:06 pm

example: 43
i mean what do they want to kriech out

May 7, 2009 3:01 pm

MOST OF YOU ARE MISSING 1 IMPORTANT THING!!! JEWS FOLLOW DAAS TORAH, TO REB MENASHEH “hakotton” and all u posting your opinions: PLEASE PLEAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAASE! LEARN THE “TORAH-SOURCES” ON THE SUBJECT (for a chossid: include Sichos NUN ALEF+) turn down your fear of the truth!! all the sources paint a very straight forward picture! the Rebbeh is in a state of “NICHSEH” as predicted in numerous sources, and this piriod of Galus is the Last stance before the stage of “Chizer-VNisgaleh” do the research!!!!!! perhaps b/c of ppl like R M Klein, the Rebbeh insisted that HIS chasidim all KNOW THE… Read more »

To #141
May 7, 2009 2:42 pm

At the end, i’m not saying weather I belive that or not, but they base their claim on what the Rebbe said that Moshiach/the Rebbe’s house is 770, and that is his place until the geulah.

THAT is what I think THEY believe.

Kol Hatzorer Leyirael Naaseh Rosh
May 7, 2009 2:31 pm

Does he want to become Rebbe?

re 139 - What do you mean "the Rebbe is Alive"?
May 7, 2009 1:52 pm

> 139 > Likutei Mekoros > is a Sefer with actual copies of the Rebbe’s sichos > and other mekoros in Torah, > explaining why we say that > 1. The Rebbe is Alive etc. Please quote, or summarize. Chazal also asserts that a true tzaddik is called “alive”, and never dead, even after he or she is deceased. Furthermore, the Talmud says that moshiach can either be from among the living, or “min hamaysim” from among the deceased. This is explained by Rabbi Medini in his halacha encyclopedia, S’dei Chemed, and by others. So, no one argues this point… Read more »

#137 is a mistake!
May 7, 2009 1:21 pm

collive made the last two paregraphs as if it is part of the utube link

Likutei Mekoros
May 7, 2009 1:17 pm

is a Sefer with actual copies of the Rebbe’s sichos and other mekoros in Torah, explaining why we say that
1. The Rebbe is Alive, and
2. The Rebbe is Moshiach.

LEARN FOR YOURSELF and stop calling it meshichist propoganda and “hidden agenda” etc. etc.
Learn for yourself.
Get your sources from The Rebbe and not some other Gadol…

May 7, 2009 1:13 pm


To #125
May 7, 2009 1:11 pm

Do you consider the Rebbe – YOUR Rebbe -? You want to compare the Rebbe to Shabsai Tzvi Chas VeShalom?? FACT 1: The Rebbe said “The Nossi haDor is the Moshiach haDor” (if you think that by writing “Nossi Doreinu” your Parev…) FACT 2: The Rebbe said “Our Generation is the last Generation of Galus and the First of Geulah”. FACT 3: The Rebbe encoureged Yechi Adoneinu (not just “Yechi Hamelech”) not only during the entire year of 1993 but also 1991 (15 Iyar) BEFORE the Rebbe had a stroke (if such an occurance means to you that the Rebbe… Read more »

Kollel for Life
May 7, 2009 1:10 pm

To #133 Are you being choshed b’kesherim on me that I c”v use the internet? Gedolim have assured it! V’h’yisem nikiyim – I will respond to your accusation. I tell my messages to a shaliach (a proxy – not one of your”shluchim”). Since, ain shliach lidvar averah, I remain free from any internet involvement. I use a shaliach who r”l anyway uses the internet, so there is no lifnei ivayr. As far as bitul zman, there is a toeles to be marbitz my da’as Torah l’rabim, even if done through a non-kosher forum. It is time to be mekarev those… Read more »

To #104
May 7, 2009 12:44 pm

See first comment.

May 7, 2009 12:19 pm

He says not to go to the Ohel, but if you look closely at the picture on top, you see he’s coming out of the ohel. He contradicts himself.

kollel for life
May 7, 2009 12:09 pm

if you were such a great talmid chacham you would get off the interent and stop bashing people.
were sick and tired of your commetnts..go learn some real stuff that teach you how to behave bc what your doing now is not working
-chabad and proud!

Kollel for Life
May 7, 2009 11:48 am

To #118:

I am not mochel you!

You were oyver on several issurim including M’kallel (cursing out a Jew) & Bizuy Talmid Chochom. Clearly you have little regard for Torah or mitzvos.

May Hashem have mercy on your lost soul.

I hope and pray that there are none like you among Chadabniks who speak of “Ahavas Yisroel”. Clearly you have no clue what such foreign words mean.

You disgrace the ones who taught you, including your Rebbe.

May 7, 2009 10:51 am

I dont care if you say yechi in your basment ( and lock the doors ) but dont do it outside were people misunderstand it.

re: #31
May 7, 2009 9:36 am

‘The inyan of moshiach is entirely seperate. Seems like a pretty silly psak. Don’t take it so seriously.’

This led to previous groups of Jews to all lose their way. Once halchah becomes secondary to “hashkafah” (more accuratly: perceived hashkafah) all is lost.

Is Dead also Alive?
May 7, 2009 9:36 am

Rabbi Menashe Klein clearly is not rejecting the Torah validity of believe a deceased tzaddik as being moshiach. Rather, Rabbi Klein is rejecting as apikoses the false notion that a deceased tzaddik is “alive”, like reshoyim who walk around and talk. Such people are considered dead already. But a true tzaddik is always alive, even after he or she becomes deceased in bodily form. That is one toic. The other topic is the reciting of “yeshi”, which Rabbi Kleins considers wrong, like many Lubavitchers, because he feels that it promotes an apikores idea. But Rabbi Klein fails to understand that… Read more »

Interesting point...
May 7, 2009 9:10 am

Shabtai Tzvi was mentally ill, and didn’t push for followers initially (apparently, he was actually against going public). It was his aide-de-camp, Natan, who proclaimed his Messiah-ship. Obviously, you can’t compare the Rebbe zt’l to him, but the meshichistim are repeating the same mistake that Natan did.

no comparison
May 7, 2009 8:52 am

to 124
how can you compare the times of shabsai tzvi to now that the rebbe explicitly said its the 7th generation and moshiach is coming! shabsai tzvi was a heretic. LEHAVDIL the rebbe iscompletely different

Rabbi Klein is a Friend
May 7, 2009 8:50 am

Rabbi Menashe Klein wrote this because of his respect and honor of the Rebbe. He is on our side. Yet he feels the Mshichistim are destroying the Rebbe’s image in many circles. The Rebbe was Mekarev him all the yaers. R Klein even told someone at one point , before 3 Tamuz, that the Rebbe is fit to be Mashiach and that he – R Klein – would considef it an honor to carry his thigs (like R Akiva carried Bar Kochba’s when he thought he was Mashiach). Apparently, after Tamuz 3 the Rabbi feels that now it is inapropraite… Read more »

May 7, 2009 8:21 am

Reading these readers comments, many of which belittle (at best) the words and character of R’ Menashe Klein, I shudder at the thought that history may be repeating itself. Hundreds of years ago, before Lubavitch existed, there was a messianic movement, supported by most of the Jewish community — even the Rabbanim (to be anti- was actually dangerous). People wanted so much to believe that this new leader was Moshiach, that they withdrew from common sense, paid no attention to their concerns and followed him, until it was too late. It could have been the end for us, but we… Read more »

May 7, 2009 8:13 am

It is olrordy 2009 Tuv shin samech tes DOR HASHMINI Wake up And Follow Torah And Dont makeThe Torah Folow You

May 7, 2009 8:03 am

he mocks the entire chabad
1) he writes that going to the ohal is not allowed
2) that chabad needs a new rebbe
3 )its against halacha to say that the rebbe is moshiach
but 130 people who wrote comments d’ont know how to read the small latter’s
this how far we have come using our enemy to fight within

to 116
May 7, 2009 7:42 am

just for the record the Rebbe never called him a Rasha.
As far as I know the Rebbe wouldnt call anyone a rasha.

to #119
May 7, 2009 6:54 am

excuse me what are you talking about?
yehoshua bin Nun was appointed after Moshe Rabainu.
Stop, please stop this narish, talk one says after dowsing a gallon of vodka
genug shoin
we are chabad a little saichel please just a litte saichel.
lechayim and remmber only four small ones – your post sounded like you dosed yourself with the whole bottle

May 7, 2009 6:39 am

klien himself is seen in the picture going to some sort of ohel, probabley the stiplers, and he forbids lubavitchers from going to the ohel.

shame on misnagdim, who first say that pictures of the rebbe is avodah zorah , then , 20 years later ,”Harav” svei’s picture is diplayed in the mishpacha magazine like an american idol.

i wouldent be suprised if, in 20 years, harav chaim kanievsky and r’ chaim pinchas schienberg would be fighting for the postion of moshiach in the litvishe yeshivos

Is Klein suggesting making an EGEL HAZAHAV as a "replacement"
May 7, 2009 6:39 am

Anti Meshichist, stupid as usual rejoice with their new found friend menashe Klein. The silly anti-meshichisten rejoice when anyone says anything negative and derogatory towards meshichisten. But the silly anti-meshichsiten don’t realize that their new found friend, equally does not approve of going to the Ohel and he wants the anti-meshichisten to make up a “new Rebbe” – just like the yidden in the Midbar made and EGEL HAZOHOV to replace Moshe Rabeinu when they mistakenly thought Moshe was dead. As the Rebbe says, we now live in the dor of “Yisbareru Veyislabnu” where all so called “big machers”, show… Read more »

to 43
May 7, 2009 6:34 am

you brag about the anivus of those stupid misnagdim, something that does’nt exist. how about telling the story from dem lubavitcher rebbin’s zichroynes about ‘alle di anuvim’l. yes , it does happen to be that the rebbiem and chassidim have proven thier supeirior knowledge in niglah and chassidus, but they dont brag like you , mr. sach your chazzan ish ect. you should be cursed eternally for insulting hashem, toyras hachassidus , the rebbe and evrything holy. may you burn in gehinom until your unforggivibale sins are forgivven by the all-mercifful hashem as to 116, thank you for posting the… Read more »

to 112
May 7, 2009 6:14 am

“It is the extremists of both parties, however, that do not allow peace. This is because they have formed their “own religion”. We automatically identify the members of either party with the extremists, not allowing us to clearly see what their true beliefs are. Yes, there ARE extremists in both parties. There are the extremists who act like the Taliban in 770, and have formed their own cult, and there are the extremists who live at the Ohel.” First off, this whole notion of “it’s both sides etc…” is bull. It’s just another Cheap shot. In your very own example:… Read more »

to 43
May 7, 2009 5:50 am

you dare to call the person who the rebbe called “rasha” tzadik! you call the bum who referd to the rebbe as ‘the person who sits in new york and drives the world crazy” moran virabonon. lubavitch is not destroyng itself , but some radicals and anti-radical yechi pepole are destroyng no-one but themselvs.

as to those against yechi , please read this:http://www.moshiach.net/count.htm :

it must not remain inddifrrent to anyone. it is a must evrey truth seeking individual.

to #144
May 7, 2009 5:37 am

please, please read what teh rav wrote he did NOT say that He does attack the idea that the LR will be Moshiach, but he doesn’t call it apikorsus. The teshuvah is written in response to one of the Messianic pamphlets, and addresses the usual talking points one by one. For most of them he gives the standard refutations, regarding the Abarbanel, l he says OK, the Rebbe could come back to life and THEN be Moshiach, but he can’t be Moshiach now, because he hasn’t come back to life yet. In any case, there’s no question that he does… Read more »

May 7, 2009 5:19 am

to my understanding evrey lubavitcher believes the rebbe is moshiach that means evrey lubavitcher would be included in this “psak” so therfore ignore this “goan”

May 7, 2009 4:24 am

to kolel for life
boy are you a hot misnaged! so much musar!
u show off so much. try to learn how to be a onov
i pity the kolel managers who have to put up with you

To #86 and others.
May 7, 2009 4:19 am

Whenever there are two parties (even from the same religion and sect) that are in disagreement, there are always “extremists” and “radicals” within each party. There has been no definitive answer from the Rebbe whether or not he is Moshiach, or whether or not we are supposed to publicize that he is Moshiach. The Rebbe’s reactions to “Yechi” can be interpreted either way. The Rebbe’s Sichos from ’88-’92 can be understood in different ways as well. Under normal circumstances, it would be possible for people of both “opinions” (not “parties”) to dwell in peace. After all, regarding “Milchama Shel Torah… Read more »

May 7, 2009 3:53 am


May 7, 2009 3:14 am

ז’ תמוז תשנ”ו: להלן מענה לשאלות הרבות אודות עמדתי בהנוגע לליובאוויטש ואמונתם המשיחית. לפני ג’ תמוז כללתי את עצמי בין אלה שהאמינו כי הרבי היה ראוי להיות המשיח. אני מאמין באופן מוחלט, כי לו היינו – במיוחד הקהיל האורטודוקסית – מאוחדים, היינו זוכים לגאולה השלימה. בקשר לאמונה של רבים מחסידי חב”ד (כולל רבנים מובהקים וראשי ישיבות) – אמונה המיוסדת על הצהרות דומות של הרבי בעצמו, בקשר לקודמו בתפקיד הרבי הקודם, כולל רבנים חשובים וראשי ישיבות, שהרבי יכול עדיין להיות משיח – לאור הגמרא בסנהדרין, הזוהר, האברבנאל, כתבי האריז”ל, השדי חמד ועוד מקורות – אני לא יכול לומר שהאמונה הזאת היא… Read more »

May 7, 2009 3:03 am

Indeed what you say is so true, this piece from R’ M K is actually incriminating to anyone who says that to believe the Rebbe could still be Moshiach is apikorsos. Though I don’t believe the notion that the Rebbe needs to be alive b’daas tachton etc nevertheless R’ Menashe’s attempts to refute it with his V’yesh Lomars and pshotim & chidushim in Medrash & Agada makes R’ Sholom B Volpo look like the Posek Hador.

please explain.
May 7, 2009 3:00 am

I have a question. If the Rebbe said personally to say “yechi Hamelech” then why is noone saying this? I am not talking about “yechi adoneinu”. Thats not what the rebbe said to say. The world would be so much more accepting to “yechi hamelech”, which is why the Rebbe said to say it, but noone does……i find that very strange. Can someone please explain??

Truly a Koton - Meshane Halachos
May 7, 2009 2:13 am

It should be noted that Menashe Klein has been involved in several scams regarding the heter meah rabbonim for gittin. His sefer is referred to as the Meshane Halachos in some circles because of this and other controversies.

to 105
May 7, 2009 1:56 am

Well said,
Brothers, DAYENU!!
Sholom al Yisroel!
Let’s just focus on our Tafkid!

May 6, 2009 11:32 pm

Meshichisten, Lo-Meshichisten, we’re all Rebbe’s Chassidim. The Rebbe needs each of us to reach every Jew and bring Geulah to the world now.

To all those who are quoting the sicha of bais Nissan
May 6, 2009 6:58 pm

the rebbe said YECHI HAMELECH gives chayos
The rebbe did NOT say the nusach that they say now yechi.. melech hamashiach.

and this is what the rav writes
that saying yechi.. MELECH HAMASIACH is a bezoyon.

95, BACK TO 99
May 6, 2009 6:56 pm

Thanks. levi garelik just spoke to us in o.t. explaing alot about this whole thing.

to #96
May 6, 2009 6:46 pm

Excuse me but it seems you don’t understand the ravs writings. (Maybe you should have someone explain it to you).
The rav is refuting a certain person’s sefer
As he says at the beginning (6 lines into it) he says this sefer is not Kahalacha and that is why he is writing it.
He then goes on to quote from it.
Please understand this before you write a comment.
It’s the sefira so I am being kind

May 6, 2009 6:27 pm

Learn Likkutei Sichos Chelek chof-vov, the first sicha, ois zayin: the Rebbe says that there constantly must be a nassi hador in whom Moshe Rabbeinu’s neshama is enclothed. There are 2 choices: a) the Rebbe is alive; b) there is a new Rebbe (not really possible based on what the Rebbe says many times- we are the 7th generation, the last of galus and first of Geula).
It’s really kedai to learn the whole sicha inside.

to 95
May 6, 2009 5:20 pm

To 95
Don’t worry they won’t reply to such a comment, they didn’t even read the whoe letter, if he is cursing out the meshichistim they will always agree (just like they say we will always be against)
A bunch of self hating lubavitchers, he also writes that it is osur to go to the ohel what have they to say to that!?
But then again they probably all can’t read the hebrew pity col didn’t translate the whole letter!

Why This Is Happening
May 6, 2009 4:59 pm

They were the non-Jewish elite of Egypt. Unlike the holy Jewish People, the Erev Rav were immersed in a lifestyle based upon the practice of black magic, divination, exorcism, necromancy, and other spiritual perversions. They feared and despised the Jews — who were strangers among them and had distanced themselves from the Erev Rav’s behavior — so they influenced Pharoah to murder the Jewish baby boys. They were Egypt’s ruling class, its elite, and they craved one thing only — power, that is, power to rule over people and control them. After the Ten Plagues, when G-d Almighty revealed Himself… Read more »

May 6, 2009 4:59 pm

All this is whats keeping the issue of Moshiach alive and in the air – Just what the Rebbe wants

Thank you Rabbi Klein – regardless of your feelings, u made hundreds of people think about Moshiach again – graet Zechus

May 6, 2009 4:56 pm


May 6, 2009 4:55 pm

I think what comes out of this is absolutely monumental for the case of the Meshichistin. For a Godol like R’ Menashe Klein to expend 5 intense pages to try and dig out a refutation (and very shvach at best) against the meshichistin, he clearly conveys the message that they have given him a run for his life and have heavy reliable sources upon whom to rely. What’s also colossal and historic is that although the gemara & the Abarbanel is clear that Moshiach can come min hameisim, nevertheless since 3 Tammuz many antis have always attempted to twist the… Read more »

May 6, 2009 4:44 pm

Did anyone read the whole tshuvah? it says clearly chabad neads a new rebbe. if any anti has a problem, they should find a new rebbe as per the tshuvah. if you dont, that means we are all in this together.

May 6, 2009 4:41 pm

Just so you know, there are sforim where it says that all groups of chasidim say that their rebbe was moshiach.

Alinsky's Rules for Radicals/mishichistim
May 6, 2009 4:33 pm

RULE 1: “Power is not only what you have, but what the enemy thinks you have.” Power is derived from 2 main sources – money and people. “Have-Nots” must build power from flesh and blood. (These are two things of which there is a plentiful supply. Government and corporations always have a difficult time appealing to people, and usually do so almost exclusively with economic arguments.) RULE 2: “Never go outside the expertise of your people.” It results in confusion, fear and retreat. Feeling secure adds to the backbone of anyone. (Organizations under attack wonder why radicals don’t address the… Read more »

Taking Cheap shots
May 6, 2009 4:29 pm

Character assassination is what some people do when they feel like they can’t win an argument based on the merits. People who’ve made-up their minds but can’t justify their position, rationally, oftentimes resort to attacking the character, credibility or motive of their critics, as opposed to the logic. Just ask conservative talk show host Rush Limbaugh, he’ll tell you that liberals do this all the time. Truth is of course, that it’s not just liberals who do it, all kinds of people are guilty of resorting to character assassination – liberals, conservatives, religious people, as well as secular folk. Still,… Read more »

what know?
May 6, 2009 4:26 pm

Zelig wrote: “This is why I don’t really like chabad any more, cuz what people are doing to chabad. We wear once greatly respected and with all of this going on we are just loosing are respect for what we are doing to the world. The people involved in this affirmative action should be taken.” A response: Being once a Extreme Mishichist my self (in my younger years), until I grow up and started to ask questions (a lot of things in the mishichist way don’t make sense- how could it, if it’s not based on Emes…). I was about… Read more »

Rebbe IS Moshiach NOW
May 6, 2009 4:23 pm

i read the entire teshuva. Although the Rabbi steers himself into saying Moshiach can only be from the living, and every generation must have its leaders, potential Moshiach, now, and praying at the ohel is not a good thing, and then he suggests some interpretation of his own at the end about the story with Rabbi Yehudah Hanosi coming back even after he passed away and plays it down, (While the Rebbe played it up and a BIG way) he begins on an entirely different premise. he starts out saying that, to believe the dead are alive after they passed… Read more »

May 6, 2009 4:19 pm

THE LAWS OF IDOL-WORSHIP AND ITS REGULATIONS Chapter One 1) In the days of Enosh, the people deviated, and the counsel of the wise people degenerated into stupidity. Enosh himself was amongst those who deviated. Their mistaken reasoning was that since God created the skies and spheres as part of nature, and placed them high up [in the skies], and gave them dignity, and that they are servants who serve Him, it would be appropriate to laud, glorify and honor them as well. It is the will of the Almighty to make great and to dignify those who make Him… Read more »

My friend, our friend #43
May 6, 2009 4:17 pm

43 is a lubavitcher (you know this and I know this),
All you (mishichistim) are trying to do is knock him down, belittle him, so it does not matter what he says (because he’s just a sang).
It won’t work, We agree with what he has to say (I don’t care who he is, it doesn’t matter).

So it’s true, anybody who says something you don’t like, you just assassinate.

to all mishichistim
May 6, 2009 4:12 pm

It wasn’t (g-d forbid) the Rebbe that was wrong,
It was you who where wrong about the Rebbe!

we must not forget (learn from the past)
May 6, 2009 4:05 pm

When I entered 770 hours after the Kinnus Hashlochim (5767), I felt hurt. But only a little. I saw many groups of Shluchim Farbragening, with a glimmer of light on their face, Shluchim of old with Shluchim of young, in a corner of 770 under the porch were the Rebbe sat, I also saw a group of young Bochorim, which their whole purpose was to disturb the people Farbragening. With Screams, loud singing, banging on tables and benches, using any tools (that were available or made available) to make a disturbance. This bothered, this was disturbing, and therefore it broke… Read more »

Dovid Hamelech
May 6, 2009 3:59 pm

(10) “For forty years I quarreled with that generation; and I said, “They are a people of erring hearts, they do not know my ways.” (11) So I vowed in my anger that they would not enter my resting place.

common tactics
May 6, 2009 3:55 pm

I’ve come to realize over the years that the “Mishichisim” relay so much on people being stupid. Always giving misinformation, saying lies as if they are facts of life. If you g-d forbid proofs them wrong they will accuse you of purveying hatred, bigotry and of being stupid, small minded this is a common tactic etc… (Instructive lesson in bully-boy tactics). They will say anything but address the issue. When the going gets thought they all of a sudden become a “seeker of peace”.

to # 43 and 73
May 6, 2009 3:30 pm

how can you go and mention oiso haish who is amalek and faught against the rebbe,
and then say that if anybody says something it is wrong.
you yourself points fingers and doesnt listen to rabbonim you pick which ruv you want to listen to.!
too many people are writing tipshus.
we are lubavitch and will always be lubavitch no matter what anyone says. because these people hated us before gimmel tamuz and now after!

No name
May 6, 2009 3:19 pm

I think this hold thing is not what the rebbe wants so let’s just bring mosiach why fight all it’s going to do is hold him back so stop all ready

ColLive - you the best!!!
May 6, 2009 3:15 pm

Now the official chabad news blog site. EVERYONE is on this site.

Check out 43 – Even the snags are reading ColLive!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

#70 like a parrot
May 6, 2009 3:07 pm

#70 repeating like a parrot.
Going the Bais Moshiach way.
I used to read that garbage to.
No! not what the Rebbe said, what Bias moshiach decided what the Rebbe said/meant.

to 73
May 6, 2009 3:03 pm

I know the feeling. Thank g-d I was only 18 when I started asking questions, thank g-d I had the right person to guide me. Yes, I was a mishichist once, I mean how could I not be, everyone was, if you wasn’t then something was wrong with you (you were not a Chossid etc… see 71). I always joke, that if I was g-d forbid still a mishichist… the shivil.. the dollars… all would be Klaner Zachin (small things). When I started to (finally) listen (the things I heard were always being said, I just didn’t listen), my stomech… Read more »

To 43
May 6, 2009 3:01 pm

You don’t belong on this site. Keep your nose in your gemmara.

You have no right to comment and if you have nothing good to say then don’t say it.

I hate you and your kind of people. If you were here I would punch you in the nose.

I read your comment and I want to vomit.

Moshiach Vadai?!!
May 6, 2009 3:01 pm

Please explain to me, those who commented earlier about Moshiach Vadai, how anyone in history so far can have been named moshiach vadai, when the rambam clearly states the criteria for one to be called so – boneh mikdash bimkomo umekabetz nidchei yisrael.
unfortunately, i havent seen the bais hamikdash physically built in yerushalayim yet.
the criteria for bchezkas moshiach i agree has been met, but moshiach vadai?!!! where is the menorah, the shulchan, the aron, etc?

To 73
May 6, 2009 2:57 pm

Lag Bomer is coming.

There will be a big bon fire.

Let’s all burn our paraphanilia – burn the evil from your midst: The flags, yamakas, pins, and all the junk.

I also read 43 and cried and cried and cried.

To #74
May 6, 2009 2:56 pm

He was saying that when the Rebbe says something – you don’t go checking Shulchan Aruch to see if it makes sense.
Your not responding to MY #$%^&. I simply quoted what the Rebbe said. You want to call that #^&#)* ??? Than you got a problem

To 70
May 6, 2009 2:44 pm

So your saying (your saying this not me, you missed my point totally, but that was expected), that (your) rebbe went againts Shulchan Aruch.
You saying that when the Rebbe said the Story of the Arizal, he was telling us not to listen to Shulchan Aruch?

[I can respond to your *^%$ty but first I will wait to see what you have to say].

May 6, 2009 2:41 pm

Everyone, read #43. The world sees and hears what we are doing…yes, it is only a snag, but while we roll in the gutter, we drag with us our self respect and the honor of Lubavitch. As chassidim, we also drag into the gutter…

I am ashamed.

#43 is my wake up call. If anyone wants the flag outside my house, the car decorations, my pin or my yechi yarmalka – you can have it!!!

Read #43 and realize that everyone sees our nakedness.

I am ashamed of myself and it hurts real bad.

To 48
May 6, 2009 2:40 pm

The Rambam writes the criteria, so you should know that when he comes, you will know that it is him, not like the Christians l’havdil who say you have to believe in him.
Also you missed my point, that pointing fingers at an individual has been catastrophic for Yiddern, and we shouldnt do that now either.

A House Divided
May 6, 2009 2:37 pm

The “Messianist” (or “Moshichists”) as they call themselves, are a fringe group of fanatics within Lubavitch. The Messianist ringleaders created this aberrant movement by using some of the same tactics employed by many of the well known tyrants of history. The same dynamics of group psychology that I studied in college are at play here. Fanaticism of all kinds, but especially religious fanaticism, all share the same ugly face of intolerance, rigidity, irrationality, hatred and rage. The difference here is that this fanatic movement has as its central figure, our beloved Lubavitcher Rebbe (zt”l), who was a great giant of… Read more »

To #68
May 6, 2009 2:36 pm

1. Regarding the Rebbe, the Rebbe tells us that for us we have the Rebbe “un hecher far dem iz far unz nita” – and there is non higher then that for us. Sounds radical? Well, thats what the Rebbe said.

2. The story of the Arizal and his talmidim Erev Shabbos, the Rebbe learns out from that the when a Rebbe says something you listen. Not go and see if it matches what the Shulchan Aruch says. That is NOT a Chossid.

Give me back My Rebbe!
May 6, 2009 2:32 pm

It’s Tafka the mishichistim who are the biggest disbelievers. If you think about it…. The Rebbe (in their eyes) is only great because he’s like this and like that etc… And if the Rebbe is not like this or that, then he’s not good enough for you?? If the Rebbe is not Moshiach, he’s not (g-d forbid) worthy to be YOUR Rebbe? WHO DO YOU THINK YOU PEOPLE ARE? YOU TELLING THE REBBE WHAT TO DO? If you want to know if something is right, just look at the results. After 15 years we all can see with our very… Read more »

The Rebbe is a man of Shulchan Aruch
May 6, 2009 2:19 pm

The Rebbe was a man of the book/Shulchan Aruch.

I am his Chassid because of that.

The Halacha says what it says, and the Rebbe never went against Halacha/Shulchan Aruch.
Since the mishichistim HAVE to make scents of everything, they end up making mistakes.
When you say thinks like…
“I know the Rambam or Shulchan Aruch says one thing, but if you learn the Sicho of…. Then you will see what the Rebbe says etc… and i only follow the Rebbe”.


Big chidush! (Not)
May 6, 2009 2:18 pm

Those that hold that the Rebbe is chai vakayum bguf gashmi mamosh are not apikorsim. They are shotim. They are potur from Torah and Mitzvos so to give them the title apikorsim is simply innacurate.

Destroy him!
May 6, 2009 2:01 pm

After reading this post this morning, I told my wife, that the first things the mishichist party will do is make this guy in to a nothing. If hes a nothing then they are something. They do this to fekllow mishichistim who thatnk g-d find there way back to Chabad, they say “him??? Hes a nobody etc…” Yesterday this guy was the biggest thing, the second somebody does not agree with them, they make him in to the biggest bigot (just like the liberals do to all that don’t agree with them, they destroy their life). Imagine if the rabbi… Read more »

We're supposed to say yechi
May 6, 2009 1:38 pm

the rebbe’s talk 2 nissan 1988

May 6, 2009 1:36 pm




May 6, 2009 1:30 pm

Did you learn or even read the Sicha of 2 Nissan 5748?
There the Rebbe says that saying Yechi HaMelech is poel “HAKITZU vRANENU SHOCHNEI OFOR the frierdiker rebbe, -and- HAKITZU vRANENU DOVID MALKA MESHICHA!!!
(trans. it (yechi hamelech) causes that those that DWELL IN THE DUST shall ARISE and sing, (that is) the Previous Rebbe; and King Moshiach shall arise and sing)

So what don’t you understand?

There’s not a reason not to say Yechi EVEN after Gimmel Tammuz – according to what THE REBBE HAD STATED.

To 41
May 6, 2009 1:12 pm

See comment 50

to top it off
May 6, 2009 1:09 pm

i made it 60 comments

May 6, 2009 1:08 pm

instead of sitting and learning the REBBE’s sichos you’re learning from another Rebbe?! Listen up there is only ONE Rosh Bnei Yisroel. You should be ashamed of yourselveS.

Honest Question
May 6, 2009 12:58 pm

When the Rebbe reffered to the Freidiker Rebbe as alive, did he mean that the Freidiker Rebbe was still saying maamarim, or giving out kos shel brocho? I.e.
Even if the Rebbe was still alive- HE would be the one giving out dollars-he would not have other people doing it for him. So why do people persist in ACTING like the Rebbe? (I believe) It is these self appointed gabboim that Rabbi Klein is reffering to.

Kollel for Life
May 6, 2009 12:55 pm

To #55:


There are a few Jews on this planet that are not Chabad. I hope this doesn’t destroy the fantasy you live in.

WE were never NISPOEL
May 6, 2009 12:49 pm



May 6, 2009 12:48 pm

This Rabbis ruled against people who believe that the Rebbe is alive NOW! He has nothing against people believing the Rebbe to be Moshiach (before Gimmel Tammuz, or through Techias Hamiasim etc.), but the people who believe the Rebbe himself is alive B’Guf Gashmi and that he still gives out dollars every sunday or kos shel brocha-this is who Rabbi Klein refers to as an apikores.

Kollel For Life
May 6, 2009 12:29 pm

Are you chabad? because by your statements it reeaallyy doesnt seem like it…!!!1

May 6, 2009 12:13 pm

keep these articles coming everyday and this site will skyrocket… Its the HOT topic!!!!

To 46
May 6, 2009 12:04 pm

“If we are honest, we will see that the Rebbe had the utmost respect for ALL Rabonim who came to see him or who wrote to him.”
True, but the Rebbe never changed his opinion to accommodate the p’sak of some Rov!

a chossid listens to HIS Rebbe
May 6, 2009 12:03 pm

the only thing this fellow is saying is that you shouldn’t say the person who is dead is actually alive begashmius something that however you want to understand it, the Rebbe said differently. The Rebbe said the Frierdikeh Rebbe is living here in this world begashmius. But that’s not the point. the Rabbi makes it very clear from the Abarnanel that you actually can believe that a passed away Tzadik can come back and be moshiach. and who is to say that you can’t apply Yakov loi mais to the Rebbe. This fellow gives a casual – its not shayech… Read more »

To 43
May 6, 2009 11:59 am

Which Kolel has wi-fi?
Also, its good you showed your true colors in your last sentence.

to 32
May 6, 2009 11:49 am

Why not?
We believe the Rebbe’s Moshiach because he told us so! Not (only) based on the criteria’s of the Rambam.

No comment
May 6, 2009 11:48 am
T0 29
May 6, 2009 11:45 am

“there is no Ikar in the Rambam to point fingers at an individual nor know who it is”
While there may not be an ikur, there is however definitely a inyan to know who he is. Why else would the Rambam write the criterias?

May 6, 2009 11:44 am

Did you lovers of menashe Klien read what he wrote???

He said you are not allowed to go to the Ohel !!!!!!!

All those that scream Mashiach yes or no READ His article..

It’s againt all lubavitchers. Which ever way you do. He wants you all to make a new rebbe!!!
Now tell me is he your freind?????

Learn from the Rebbe
May 6, 2009 11:07 am

If we are honest, we will see that the Rebbe had the utmost respect for ALL Rabonim who came to see him or who wrote to him. Harav M Klein is a world renown Posek. If we read is Teshuvah, we will see that what he says makes a lot of sense with plenty of sources from Torah. It is only because of his admiration for the Rebbe and his work over the decades that he speaks out to preserve the Rebbe’s good name. Az es tut vei, shreit men!!! I admire his courage and commitment that despite his old… Read more »

to number 43
May 6, 2009 10:58 am

i was intrested untill th elast line yad hachasidim al hoelyona.
anyways – let us c”v not agree with the last line

nit an anuv
May 6, 2009 10:50 am

he didnt write “hakutun” b-cause he thinks he’s an anav (which he’s certainly not) but b-cause “klein” is “kutun” from hebrew to yiddish. and besides, the rebbes alive in his teachings!

Kollel for Life
May 6, 2009 10:34 am

No, it doesn’t matter what great Rabbonim say. (Heck, we don’t even listen to our own rabbonim, so why should we care what world renown poskim say). Nothing can change our beliefs, because we know better. (Besides, what do these guys know anyway – a little niglah?! Some halacha?! We never like those subjects anyway – not enough creative thinking like nistar). We are smarter than everyone else in klal yisroel. (Afterall, Chabad means we are intellectually superior – we are taught in chassidus that black can be white, down can be up and all is not as it seems).… Read more »

Reb Menashe Hakoton
May 6, 2009 10:28 am

We are pondering over the words of somebody who truly did not hold a great deal of the Rebbe himself, either. He is just being very diplomatic and does not want to be counter-productive. He would have called the Rebbe those same names as well, when the Rebbe said on his father-in-law, that there is no Yerushah since he is B’Chaim. And of course if he would want to comment on the Sichos of the last two years he would not use eidele wording either. The fact is that every point he tries to prove is far from solid; in… Read more »

to #37
May 6, 2009 10:09 am

please #37 read what the rav wrote… you cant mix both you just cant. btw do you know there was a book published by nshai chabad before gimul tamuz init states why the rebbe is moshiach. and then it asks why cant we say the holy rebbes or tzadikim after previous generation why cant they be moshiach. and it specifically states that the reason being is because the passed away. so,,, if before gimul tamuz we said that the rebbe is moshiach vadai – how can we now say he is moshiach vadai after gimul tamuz? like the gemara says… Read more »

bringing moshiach
May 6, 2009 10:02 am

It is olrady 2009 Tuv Shin Samoch Ches how much lorger will thin non sence go on Wake up !!! Olrady Pleeeease No More…………

you didn' post my reply...
May 6, 2009 9:29 am

number 10 asked:
please tell me when teh rebbe said that saying yechi gives chayos to a tzadik that passes away. please tell me.

see Sicha of Beis Nissan 5748. Crystal clear.

May 6, 2009 9:27 am

Chabad Is Not A Christon Riligon Thank You Rabbi Klein
Hatzloche Robba !!!

# 35
May 6, 2009 9:06 am

How could Rabbi Klein be right when the Gemoroh clealry says not like him. “and if he is from the dead (perhaps) like Daniel the beloved one”. In the recent debacle with Lipa it became clear that many of these Rabbonim have no idea what this world is about, they are pushed to write and say things by their pushers and on and on. I don’t know this fellow and as far as Moshiach goes we follow OUR teacher, the Rebbe. We take an example from the way our Rebbe spoke about the Frierdikeh Rebbe and we proudly believe in… Read more »

May 6, 2009 8:49 am

You say it is the Sefira and this should not be posted…. I would like to offer a different perspective. Perhaps because it is the SEfira, this SHOULD be posted, and perhaps all this “Yechi” business is bringing troubles to the Rebbe alev haShalom. We know the Rebbe does not rest, he appears in dreams and helps many many people. But that does not mean we have to “Yechi HaMelech” because that is contrary to Torah. The Rebbe may not want this to be occurring, and Rabbi Klein is doing us all a favour by publicizing this. It is not… Read more »

May 6, 2009 8:41 am

to 31
whats the difference? b4 and after, i and all meshichistim believe that the rebbe is moshiach

to #30
May 6, 2009 8:18 am

oh are you so mistaken

they belive that the ONLY way you can say that th erebb eis moshiach if he is chai vekayam mamash .

otherwise they claim it is liek xtianity.

this was written in a letter years ago in Israel.

boy you have no clue

to #29
May 6, 2009 8:16 am

you wrote
“first of all the rebbe said in hayom yom that u can say harachaman hu yivarech on the friediker rebbe in bentching yechi does give chayus to the rebbe”

how but how can you compare saying harachaman hu YEVORECH
and to say YECHI … Melech hamoshaich L’olom VOED

how can you compare both
thye problem stems with the melech hamoshiach FOREVER

to 26
May 6, 2009 7:59 am

again you can not have it both ways – you cant say the rebbe was moshiach vadai before gimul tamuz and then after the gimel tamuz also say moshiach vadai.

Alive does not mean moshiach!
May 6, 2009 7:55 am

Tzadikim are called bchayim throughout sifrei kabalah and even the gemara. But this is a ruchniusdike thing. It doesn’t mean that all the halachos of meisim don’t apply. Don’t we all say dovid melech yisroel chai vkayum? Surely the rav doesn’t have a problem with that. In the SAME way the Rebbe is chai vekayum. The inyan of moshiach is entirely seperate. Seems like a pretty silly psak. Don’t take it so seriously.

its a fine line
May 6, 2009 7:52 am

first of all the rebbe said in hayom yom that u can say harachaman hu yivarech on the friediker rebbe in bentching yechi does give chayus to the rebbe and i dont say the yechi but maybe i will begin now but this flag business and all is disgraceful but this death of the rebbe is nonesense and he is not walking the streets and u can give chayos to the rebbe mostly through tzetlach and learning koveia ittim and mivtzayim slogans dont help much but i will say yechi moshiach or not is not the issue the fact that… Read more »

Thank You Rabbi Klien
May 6, 2009 7:43 am

I would like to point out a BIG problem in Lubavitch, we do not take Daas Torah seriously, and we aught to. With in the Rebbes Sichos you can prove any side, therefor the safest thing would be, to not make any new Avoda without popper guidance from the Rebbe. Also history will show you, any time people pointed with finger at an individual claiming him to be Moshiach, cotatstrophy struck Klal Yisroel. Also, there is no Ikar in the Rambam to point fingers at an individual nor know who it is. Based on this, a normal person should conclude… Read more »

May 6, 2009 7:40 am

this goes to prove, the prediction, “CHERFU IKVOS MESHICHECHA” as interpredted by chasidus,

that davka big ppl w long white beards will be the ones to fight MOSHIACH!

heres more raye's
May 6, 2009 6:56 am

The mezritcher maggid said that moshiach would come either from his older or younger talmidim, and therefore ,the oldest and youngest talmidim Reb Nochum Chernobler and the alter rebbe made a shidduch bettween thier granchildren. these family made 2 more shidduchim between thier great and great-great grandchildren . the frierdiker rebbe indicated that the rebbe was this descendant, since he was like the frierdiker rebbe’s son, who was officaly the only descendant from all three of these shidduchim.

Shidler to #21
May 6, 2009 6:53 am

then please explain your first statment:

symple it was BEFORE gimel tamuz!!!! What difference did gimel tamuz make in that reagard.

to 19
May 6, 2009 6:46 am

the rebbe means what he says and says what he means! we may not understand his ACTIONS , and thats not our bissunes.

if klein denies the facts, read this to him
May 6, 2009 6:44 am
Bring T Moshiach
May 6, 2009 6:30 am

Thank You Rabbi Klien For Bringing Moshiach Sooner
Enough Moshiach Sheker Enough this is Distroing Chabad And the Rebbis Name R”L

no name
May 6, 2009 6:19 am

After reading some of the comments it appears to me quite clearly that will do what they want even if its against dass Torah. I feel that there is a great lack of learning and understanding to stubbornly hold onto something that is shaky at best. Moreover who’s to say that we understand what the Rebbe meant. I Haven t heard anything plausible yet

to #18
May 6, 2009 6:15 am

To Mr. Shildler
What are you ranting about. You asked a question in regards to yechi, and I answered that yes after gimel tamuz it is very questionable to say yechi after Davening.

Now what are you on about if everything should stop – of course not. The discussion was about saying yechi not stopping everything.

to #16
May 6, 2009 6:11 am

how can you even write teh first line that you did
this shows the you are fargrebet.
please have some respect for rav klein and the rebbe

to 16 and 17
May 6, 2009 6:10 am

so then why did the rebbe say kadish on yud shvat
please a little saichel

Yosef Shidler Response to #5
May 6, 2009 6:04 am

#5 so let me get this straight, after gimmel tammuz everything stops?Why? For the very simple reason that the rebbe’s will no longer applies or it changed…. Man if you can seriously talk like this you really need to learn basic chassidus 101 like tanya and the like. Or move to Boro Park were the rebbes are seriously disposable. For some stange reason all the horas and ideas that were before gimmel tammuz we still do cause that is what the rebbe showed us. 4,000 shluchim stand strong on shlichus and many sent by the rebbe long before 3 tammuz..… Read more »

Mamash An Am Haaretz Gomur
May 6, 2009 5:57 am

He just shows his am haratzus

In Lubavitch, every Cheder Yingel knows the Rebbe’s Sichos where he shows that all of the “Ha-Kuten”‘ taanos, in this “tshuva” is shtusim vehavolim.

Listen to all the Audio Sichos and Video Sichos where the Rebbe Kocht Zich that the Freideker Rebbe is still alive, in connection with the parsha of the seforim and Barry gurrary.

"Changer of Haloches" is playing with fire
May 6, 2009 5:50 am

This “Ha-Kuten” is calling the Rebbe and Apikores!

The Rebbe said that the Friedeker Rebbe is ALIVE after Yud Shvat and the Rebbe said that the Friedeker Rebbe remains Moshiach after Yud Shvat.

Uch Un Vey to this “Ha-Kuten”

Ich Bin Em Nit Mekane

May 6, 2009 5:46 am

please pleaseeeeeeeeeee now is the sefira if you havent noticed i will be happpy if one of you listen to my advice: STOP FIGHTING! 24,000 students of rabbi akiva were killed BECAUSE they were fighting! and their teacher, rabi akiva, was the epitome of veahavta lereacha kamocha, he taught that! how could it be? because each thought that HIS way of this is te correct way. MESHICHIST or NOT MESHICHIST, we are all klal yisroel. and we have to love each other just like brothers and sisters, because we are! ‘acheinu kol beis yisroel’! please, if you want to fight,… Read more »

May 6, 2009 5:43 am

The Rebbe is Moshiach and alive NOT because it says so in Halacha or cuz any “poisek” says so!!!

Rather, because THAT’S WHAT THE REBBE SAYS!!!

We, as his Chassidim must adhare to what THE REBBE says, and to take any garbage from what any “godol” may think!!!
If you respect HIS word over THE REBBE’S word – then maybe become this guys Chosid, and leave lubavitch…

Moshaich Now!

May 6, 2009 5:41 am


Zohar Spin
May 6, 2009 5:38 am

To #6

Where does it say that Tzaddikim will arise before Tchiyass hameyssim? In the same place (Breishis 139) where it says all this will be before 5408? Or does it say this elsewhere also?

please understand
May 6, 2009 5:25 am

If it is from the chayim or if it is from the maisim
You cant say well the rebbe was moshiach vadai before gimel Tamuz (min hachayim) and then moashiach Vadai after gimel tamuz (min hamaysim)
its EITHER……
this is very poshut..

to #6
May 6, 2009 5:19 am

please tell me when teh rebbe said that saying yechi gives chayos to a tzadik that passes away. please tell me.

about time... and to #6
May 6, 2009 5:12 am

what you say is all good and kosher until you incorporate it in day to day yidishkiet (making part of teffilah, krias hatorah etc,) then it leads to apikores as teh rav paskened.

to #7
May 6, 2009 5:09 am

typical tipish

Oh, if he says to stop, thats it I"m stopping!!!
May 6, 2009 4:41 am


The Rebbe as Mosiach
May 6, 2009 4:37 am

The Rebbe said during a sicha Shavous 1950 that according to the Zohar someone who is no longer live can be mosiach. In the Zohar it says that before the coming of Mosiach Tzadikim will be resurrected and one of them can be Moshiach. At that time he was refering to those who were asking how can the Rebbe say that the previous Rebbe can be Moshiach if he is no longer here physically and the Rebbe answered that before Moshiach there will be tchias hamesim for Tzadikim and therefore the previous Rebbe can be Moshiach. So the same holds… Read more »

to #1
May 6, 2009 4:22 am

symple it was BEFORE gimel tamuz

May 6, 2009 3:24 am

please speak respectfully for mehsichistim and non.

a proud meshichist
May 6, 2009 3:23 am

what a stira for meshichistim
\come on! have some respect! i personally am a meshichist, and a proud one, but i dont go screaming at ppl who dont think the way i do.

he speaks the truth
May 6, 2009 2:29 am

but isn’t it sick that Chabad has to put up with the shame because some sick, twisted, deranged individuals wander around with flags, pins, & other yechi adornments & force their insanity on the rest of us? I haven’t been in 770 in years because of the lunacy that goes on there every day. Once again, I have to hold Aguch responsible for not pulling the rug out from under their feet.

When will Aguch do what they are legally & morally supposed to do?

Yosef Shidler
May 6, 2009 2:25 am

Klein continues to write: “Whoever can, should as soon as possible silence and stop the proclamations after or before the prayers ‘Yechi etc. King Moshiach’ which is a disgrace to the Rebbe OBM.”

Not to get in to the whole issue wrong or right… But I leave an open question to Rabbi Klein:

HOW DO YOU RESPOND TO THIS (Do you know better then the Rebbe?):