From the COLlive Inbox:
On yom tov, we use hot plates in the kitchen to heat the food. (On Shabbos, my wife wraps food in towels and places it in the hot oven, turned off, to keep the food hot. We eat the meal of Shabbos day in shul at the Kiddush, and do not need hot food Shabbos afternoon at home.)
Last summer, a friend brought us an artistic cover from Israel that is used to cover the food on the hot plate. It is like a blanket. On Shavuos night, sitting at the dining room table, we smelled something burning. Running to the kitchen, my wife noticed that the hot plate cover was smoldering, having caught fire from the surface of the hot plate.
We quickly carried the blanket outside to the porch, and opened the windows to air out the kitchen. Fortunately, we caught it before there was much smoke in the kitchen. With the immediate urgency gone, I fetched our fire extinguisher from the closet, and sprayed the hot plate cover. Knowing that it is difficult to fully extinguish this material, we waited, and sure enough, the fire flared up.
With the fire extinguisher now empty, I called the fire department, and asked them to come. I explained that we were safe, and the burning object was outside, but I could not fully extinguish the flame. (I had another objective: I wanted to impress on my children the importance of not hesitating to call emergency services on Yom Tov when there is even a small chance of danger. This is not a halachic ruling, and I recommend that people check with their rov for guidelines on the appropriate procedure.)
The police arrived first, and the policeman used my garden hose (duh!) to spray the cover for several minutes until he was sure the fire was out. (As far as Yom Tov, it was better for him to put out the fire than one of us.) One fireman came with a truck who made sure that everything was under control and then walked through the house to check that the level of smoke was safe.
I have never used the fire extinguisher before, but I am sure glad I had bought one many years ago. We also have smoke alarms hooked up through our burglar alarm, and I added a horn near the bedrooms a few years ago. If the alarm goes off, the alarm company will try our house phone first, then call a list of numbers we provided them, if we are not home.
We are most grateful to Hashem that we are safe.
I am sharing this so people know that if they use a cover for their hot plate, it may not be safe. Please review your kitchen procedures for weekdays, Shabbos, and Yom Tov, to make sure everything is done safely. If you are not sure, you can call your fire department and ask. They may even offer to stop at your house to check your arrangements firsthand.
Test your smoke alarms and carbon monoxide alarms every rosh Chodesh. If you work at a school, please do your part to ensure that the alarms in the buildings are tested frequently. (Who is responsible for the smoke alarms in the dorms?)
It is important to be prepared for emergencies, because you never know when something might happen. And if something does happen, it is easy to panic and not think straight. It is impossible to eliminate or to prepare for every situation. But the better you plan, and the more systems you have in place, the better your chances are of getting through the event safely.
The author states that the blanket was carried outside to the porch and there was no immediate danger.
I’d suggest simply to quickly bring the fire extinguisher (and maybe a bucket of water) to the porch, and than stay there and watch the blanket burning out!
Only if something goes wrong and a really danger appears, what is very unlikely, he is allowed, and has to, to extinguish the fire.
Extinguishing a fire on Shabbos, particularly for safety reasons, can surely not be in the same category as deliberately lighting one.
WHEN I WAS IN KOLEL IN 5767 RABBI YOSEF HALEVI SHLITA HELLER ANNOUNCED AS FOLLOWS: “PLEASE PUBLICIZE THE FOLLOWING IN EVERY SCHOOL, SHUL ETC. NOWADAYS WHEN ONE EXPERIENCES A FIRE ON SHABBOS OR YOM TOV, IT IS TO BE TREATED JUST AS A WEEKDAY! CALL 911, POUR WATER, DO WHATEVER IT TAKES TO PUT IT OUT” END QUOTE. PART OF HIS EXPLANATION WAS THAT THE HALACHA OF JUST WALKING OUT OF THE HOUSE REFERS TO PEOPLE WITH STRONG MINDS WHO DO NOT PANIC AND KEEP THEIR SANITY, AND OF COURSE COULD BE CERTAIN THAT THEY HAVE NOT FORGOTTEN ANY PEOPLE… Read more »
Whenever people post something to share their gratitude to hashem, people always have to find a reason to argue and show they are smarter. we just had sefira, when rabbi akivah’s students died for that reason. swallow your silly ego, say thank you to gd and move on in life. What’s with the need to be right at such a inappropriate time? so embarrassing.
Why is everybody arguing, think how you would feel if you were In danger and all everybody thought about /talked about is if you were wrong or right to save yourself…
i ask my rov
did you?
learning a halacha in S A is not enough you have to look all the factors
I know that some Eidut HaMizrach do hatmana before Shabbos with a towel, but not on a lit surface! It is not safe to put any cloth on such a surface, kmuvon vgam poshut!
Halacha is not always common sense. Just saying. ASK YOUR ROV
Forget about the cover. Who in their right mind still uses hot plates?
If you have a fire inside your house, it is not going to go out by itself. It will continue to burn and spread to your neighbor’s house, and then their neighbors. Even if no one is in immediate danger, someone eventually could be. It is also a tremendous chilul hashem if that fire were to spread and burn down a non-jew’s house or non-religious jew’s house or if the story made the local news that houses burnt down because someone was too “pious” to put out a fire in a house. Also, NEVER carry something on fire out of… Read more »
I am not familiar with this product. Can you please explain what kind of a cover is made to go on a hotplate while it is ON? is it not meant to keep the food warm AFTER you turn it off?
CHOSID SHOTEH
go ask your Rov
you wrong on everything
We live in urban, densely populated areas, any fire can pose a danger to surrounding buildings and people and should be treated as such. Don’t be a chosid shoteh..
We’re not talking about a danger to life. That is clear cut, you have to do anything in a case like that. But if everyone is safe then you are not allowed to extinguish a fire on Shabbos.
I think people are referring to putting out a fire IF everyone is out the house safely. Obviously if there is a small chance of being trapped, then you do what you have to do, but if it is a small fire and everyone is out the house safely, AND it does not pose a danger to immediate properties nearby, then NO, you are NOT allowed to put the fire out. Meaning you cannot put a fire out just to save your own property, if everyone is safe.
these hotplates made in Chassidisher basements are a Sakonah , your food on Sternos on YT, and for shabbos get a cold/ warm box to keep your food warm
Right on #11. See Shulchan Oruch HaRav 344: 28. When there is a even just a possibility of danger to life, it is permitted to extinguish the fire. Anyone that does so is praiseworthy! Modern research by the NFPA and UL have clearly demonstrated that the fires of today burn hotter, faster and emit toxic gasses posing a threat more immediate than the flames themselves. The dynamics of fire in the built environment challenge even the professionals. Don’t take a chance.
He clearly writes he was out of danger and the fire didn’t pose a danger.
who in their right mind would put a fabric cover on a hotplate that it on?!
but you did the right thing by calling the fire department. good job.
Any small uncontrolled fire is a direct threat to life. Before you chochamim quote halacha you’ve learned in cheder like an experienced rov, try to keep quite until you’ve actually asked one. After that family’s terrible tragedy last year, a real, experienced, learned rov in my community (not an ignorant, anonymous collive commentator) dedicated 45 minutes of his shabbos drasha to explain al pi halacha how one mustn’t hesitate even a second in extinguishing an uncontrolled fire on shabbos, and quoted the Rema who had very harsh words against those who put themselves, their families, and their communities at risk… Read more »
Check Rabbi Ribiat’s 39 Melochos Vol IV page 1264
most home fire-emergencies are pikuach Nefesh situations and the fire should be put out immediately and directly
1. Blech covers pose serious halachik issues aside from the obvious safety issues.
2. If you want to teach your children halachos, eat the day seuda at home as the halacha requires.
3. One is absolutely forbidden from using the phone unless there is a threat to life or limb.
4. You are not allowed to extinguish fire unless there is a threat to life or limb.
I agree you need to be well versed in Halachos before making decisions. As far as I know (please someone correct me if I am wrong), you are not allowed to extinguish a fire of it doesn’t pose a danger to other people’s properties.
You need to remove your family from danger but not extinguish the fire yourself
Every uncontrolled fire is a life safety threat. Do not hesitate to call 911 on Shabbos and Yom Tov. Today’s synthetic materials and lightweight construction demand new Halachic thinking. It’s pkuach nefesh, mamash! That is the only psack.
to #4 that is an ignorant statement. Any fire small or large can quickly become an immediate threat. Please don’t make statements like that, saving a life is more important. When in doubt save a life
I was waiting for the one “Chochom “to write that. There was an immediate threat.
You aren’t allowed to extinguish a fire if it doesn’t pose an immediate threat….
Thank you for sharing. My cover is definitely going in the garbage now. Baruch Hashemi everyone is safe!
Just FYI.
Not every cover/ towel/ whatever is safe to use on a plata.
Glad it ended well/
So happy that everyone is ok but please speak to your Rav as it is assur to call the fire department in such a situation!!!