From the COLlive Inbox:
Hi, I’m a bochur who has gone on plenty of dates and is still looking for my bashert. I am not from Crown Heights, so many times I find myself having to fly out to meet the girl (as it is the custom that the boy goes to the girl).
To put it bluntly: The whole shidduch thing has burnt a hole in my pocket!
Before you jump to conclusions, let’s put this in perspective:
* Taking off time from work – costs me $.
* Flight ticket (sometimes only 3 days in advance notice) – more $.
* Car rental (and for the guys who don’t drive, taxis) – more $.
* As the “gentleman,” I’m the one who needs to pay for the drinks on the date (and in NY they are far from cost price) – more $.
* Then there is parking (which can get pricy if the date goes long and well). Guess what, more $.
* And if I go out on more than one date (which usually happens for both of us so we give each other another chance), we’re talking about a good $700 out of my wallet to spend on a girl that I might not even marry.
I can understand if you are one of the lucky ones to find your zivug after one or two tries. But unfortunately there are many like me who are still looking for their better half after five or six tries.
So let’s make a deal: If the guy is going to fly from out-of-town to go out with a girl, the cost should be split or shared.
This suggestion is not to exchange receipts or demand a refund if the date does not work out.
But for the most part it takes two to tango and at least the airfare and/or the rental car should be divided.
It’s just fair for the guy not to have to shell out at least $400 from his pocket every time a prospective shidduch comes up.
(I even know of some who won’t fly in unless there are 2 or 3 girls lined up, just in case the first girl doesn’t work out. Just to note: This is a bad idea in my eyes).
So be a mentsch, potential-shver-in-law and gives the bochur a few bucks as participation in our expenses so we don’t spend our entire life’s earnings trying to find a wife.
71 lol!!!!
whoever suggested 1 ad 2 to get married, they both are female.
Im not saying that it is good to spend so much money but it seems that if the person is dating he is going to get married soon and this could be the perfect opportunity to teach him financial responsibility. He should make a limit on how much he could spend and then he could try to get good prices etc. Also, if its the mans parents who are paying you have to think about the girls side. They pay thousands and thousands of dollors for the wedding. Another thing, I know men who have been dating for a long… Read more »
WE SHOULD STOP TALKING SHTUSIM, MONEY COMES AND GOES BUT MARRIAGE IS FOR LIFE!!!!!!!
I see how you confuse the issues by your comparing of meeting – some would mistakenly call it dating – expenses to childbirth. You see, the pain of childbirth is a natural occurrence that although men sympathize with there is not much that can be done about it. Also, I do not believe that the author was trying to change the social norms of having the guy pay for the date either. The other was referring to the “meeting” process with is part of the Shidduch system which compensates for (what you might consider the “natural” way of the world… Read more »
You can whine about make up costs etc etc. But the idea here is to get married, not to be RIGHT. So must guys are looking for NORMAL DOWN TO EARTH GIRLS and mother in laws. So if the girl and her family act like mentchin and say, “hey we get it, and we would like to pay for half the ticket” Right or wrong it shows really really well on your side and you started to be attractive even before getting in the car, or putting on all that make up. So many people don’t act like mentchin, like… Read more »
umm sexist much? The world is not about equality necessarily, but who says men and women are not equal. we are equal, but different. So yes, we do have different responsibilities. We do different things. But give credit where it’s due – men are not the only ones going to work.
Btw, it sounds like you need some help at home so that you can have more time to think before you write. Since you think it is normal for a guy to spend that much, my guess is that your husband is rich and can therefore afford such help.
I think that the comment regarding makeup was not literally to discuss the breakdown of the cost of makeup per date. Yes, some readers took things a bit far. This is life. Women have responsibilities as do men. Do you see women screaming how it’s not fair they have to deal with the pain of childbirth and taking care of their children?! Do you see men wailing how they hate going to work in the morning?! Life is not about equality. For every gender life is just different. The way of the world is that the boy courts the girl.… Read more »
An average girl’s fees:
1)Ok. You dont have to go around looking like a shlump with a 20.00 targer shirt, For gosh sakes! buy an outfit thats 36.00!!!
2) Why should you spend 90.00 on thoes just for a date! Wear your old ones. (In fact most girls have at least one pair of shoes to match every outfit).
3) Common! You cant get makeup every time you go on a date. Say you go on 8 dates, thats a lot of money!!
Just wanted to make a shout out…Girls in their early dating stages, don’t really realize the cost of dating…any suggestions that they made, they dont know how costly diff hotel/cafe’s can be …so I apoligize on all thier behalfs!
G’luck finding all your other halfs:)
after over a decade of dating my parents agreed to my idea to stop paying for my flights. let the boy who’s anyway not planning on traveling for a date finally agree to pay for half the ticket. mr x agreed. i flew in. we met 4 times. we both knew that was the end, we really liked each other but were never gonna marry each other. the shadchan was contacted to get the money from the boy. he couldn’t get a single $ out of the boys pocket. the boy just made up that i had flown in for… Read more »
why do you people keep complaining about the cost of living in CH? Where else can you rent a basement with 3 other people for $1000 a month (and no utilities)? Where else is there such a great mass transit system that costs $2 a ride? Where else can you get dairy and meat at CH prices??? NOWHERE in the US, so stop complaining!!
U forgot the overhead Baggage fees 4 carry-on bag
if you don’t mind paying for flights stay out of town, don’t want to pay live in CH. People from amazing countries overseas (like australia) are giving up a lot to live in CH, you don’t have to live overseas just interstate, not so bad, overseas girls living in CH have guts, what about you?
You sound like a guy’s worst nightmare. A gold-digging self centered girl who dreams about some rich romantic prince charming surprising her with first class trips to Bermuda….. Its not gonna happen. You’d rather someone without the credit card bills a bankruptcy. But then again, with your expectations he probably WILL end up bankrupt. Id much rather a financially responsible spouse, who will ensure that we have what we need for ourselves and our kids.
Perhaps the problem isnt the system, maybe it’s that you’ve dated “plenty of girls”. I dont know whats in your mind but it seems from the article that you find the mitzvah of finding a wife more like shopping for the perfect car or house. kavod bnos yisroel is EXTREEMLY important, while you seem to be worrying about money the girl you spent $700 on dosnt appreciate the money. she is probebly eating herself up wondering what went on in the date and why she isn’t good enough. It’s irrelevent how many girls youve dated as long as you can… Read more »
A) is still cost him money to get there (if you read the article)
– Flight
– Taking off work
– basic car (not everyone has one they can borrow and you just don’t take a first date on the subway)
B) sometimes you can’t just take a stroll (like in the winter or in the rain)
i agree with 161,
and the best dates r day dates, cuz u have a clearer mind, u can think more clearly.
but, i do think the boy should provide decent car, drinks… but just not to overdo, cuz it makes u not think straight.
The only thing that’s imortant is that the guy and girl get to know eachother. There doesn’t need to be fancy cars, food, etc. What’s wrong with a nice stroll through a park or the likes?
you made my day! thats the funniest one i have read yet!!!!
The auther has a very good point. But in the business world and in life in general there are two types of investments you can make, long term and short term.Dating is the longest and by far the most meaningful and profitable investment you will ever make.It is worth it to invest everything you have financially for the possible out come of it. I flew twice to meet a girl and it didnt work out but I dont regret it since it could have been the one. I have to disagree and say it’s well worth the investment! A single… Read more »
When you are sitting at a key board and using words like c u b 4 ur URSELF etc. it can get really annoying.
TO NUMBER 3:
Why do you write that “you resisted moving to CH”. Like it is something bad or wrong. The Rebbe’s message is clear ” KAN TZIVAH HASHEM ES HABRACHA”
I will pick you up on the corner of Montgomery and Albany at 8pm. It will be a 1982 black crossover (did they have them in those days?), I will need your phone number as I regularly run ten minutes late and will need to call you beforehand to tell you. Please bring me a diet coke and a sprite as I usually have two drinks. I will also need you to print out directions to the Brooklyn Bridge on MapQuest (the circle by the Brooklyn Library can be confusing). By the end of the night, if I don’t marry… Read more »
haha…..nice sense of humor ………i wouldnt mind paying for ur drink :))
#148 walk out of Dolce & Gabbana and hit up old navy geez!
67 lolololololololol
The first date should be in a HOME. If there is a reason to continue then go to a place that does not empty your pocket.
Make sure not to date too many times. This is not a dating game. THIS IS THE REAL THING: TO BUILD A HOME LESHAIM SHOMAYIM!!!!!
she already wore it, and will wear it again…
so ya, u can’t compare..;)
thats insane!!! Yes I know there are some girls that pay those prices but they are flat out crazy. I am a girl and I wear my $12 skirt from Burlington coat factory, my 10 dollar shirt from target and my 20 dollar shoes from payless. I do my own makeup and hair and I look beautiful and put together. The boys (or anyone for that matter) CANNOT tell the difference of the price of clothes you are wearing.
the girl is wearing a $150 dress, $90 shoes, 50 for belt 75 to get makeup done cuz all the boy cares about is what she looks like right??? and hey someone even suggested only go out after seeing a picture of her man get ur priorities straightttt
I am #111 and that was funny!
Thanks for a good laugh. And I think I’ll skip the slap. Not ladylike ya know.
HOW MUCH DO YOU THINK THE GIRLS SPEND ON THEIR CLOTHES FOR THAT DATE!?!?!?!!?!?!?! ur not the only one me being a girl, i shall stick up for us womens rights! girls (unlike boys) ask for just water-free. girls, (unlike boys) pay a lot of money on their dresses, blouses, shirts, skirts, its not cheap being a girl! girls, (unlike boys) are worth the money girls, (unlike boys) would GLADLY pay their share of money if the boy would only speak up-the boys think that if they speak up ‘oh no it wont be a shidduch anymore’ which is true,… Read more »
If you think dating is expensive.. wait till you get married!!!!!!!!!!!!
i dont think the girl should split the charges for the ticket only for the drinks the parking the car rental,etc.
who has all the free time in the world to read and write all this comments
don’t get me wrong the giy has a point
not everyone has a dollar tree in his back yard
I’m sorry, but as much as people claim the girls side pays for the wedding so the boy should pay for shidduch dates, if the girls family is in a tough financial situation and the boys side is doing alright financially, we all know whos going to end up paying for the wedding….
Didn’t have the patience to read through all the comments, but thank you to #139 for making me laugh!
I also wanted to add, that while i’m sure it’s definately annoying for a guy to have to fly over to see the girl & spend all that comes with it, if things go well, the girl will generally make the next trip up… i’ve done it myself.
And guys should just know that the girl always appreciates every dollar spent on her! 🙂
anyone can be a shadchan and redt a shidduch, but it takes emunah and bitochon in hashem to get married no one can set you up with someone you don’t want to go out with poor “checking out” is your own fault and there is no such thing as someone else’s responsibility or fault take responsibility for your own decisions find out what you want to know and make sure you are in agreement with the answers and they are clear don’t go out with everyone just to do it – it isn’t the way to do things don’t accept… Read more »
I told myself that I was not going to comment on this article, as I didn’t want to be number 137 (although it’s possible that by the time my comment is published I may be number 177), but I just felt that I have to comment. I am a single guy, who’s still trying to find his gal. Unfortunately, she still hasn’t made herself known. I do now however know how to find her. I will write an article on COLLIVE. Btw, the article will be titled, “Getting the girl to pay for the drinks, can it be done?” P.S.… Read more »
i agree with the author but you also hav to realise that the girl is the one who usually pays for the wedding!
hmmmm (I’ll admit, my wife helped me with this….) just assuming your average girl is doing her own makeup based on the price (for decent brands) divided by uses here’s about what it would cost Eye shadow $20 / 200 = .10 Eye Liner $20/ 200 = .10 Mascara $25/100 = .25 Foundation $25/50 = .50 Powder $20/ 200 = .10 Blush = $25/250 = .10 Lipstick = $20/100 = .20 Lipgloss = $15/150 = .10 Total $1.45 so maybe you can just bill the guy for the difference of .70 cents…..and call it even…then you can help the guy… Read more »
Hey all; just wanted to weigh in from my experience. I lived outside CH. And had a good job, car, apartment etc. I would do the flying thing…and spent thousands on dating. Then I decided to move. NOT to save money. It was a change in attitude. A different approach. It really depends on what your current focus in life is. What is the #1 priority. For most of my early adult life, my focus was on career. Working. I did date. But it was a side thing. Every few months, I’d fly to date. For me, flying on a… Read more »
You mentioned that there was also the worry of the cost of setting up the married couple in an apartment. It’s a new world out there! When I got married over 22 years ago my parents set me up with just the basics….blankets, dish sets, flatware, towels and the like. That’s all they could afford, especially with many other siblings at home. My husband and I took our wedding money and bought our own bedroom set, kitchen table, mattresses etc. If the new couple are mature enough to get married then they should be mature enough to have some financial… Read more »
Not everything in life has a humerous side to it. In fact not everything should! Life is not all about humor! Some things are meant to be serious! i.e. shiduchim
i am definitly seein the humorous side of life, that may be why i was laughing at your first post and feeling sorry for people who are actually that desperate, whether you really ARE, or were just pretending… ??
gnite 🙂
how do these boys expect to get married if they make deals that theyre only going to go if their dating more then one girl!like do they think their so popular that everyone wants to date them-their loosing out! personally i spent a lot of money on a flight, met one girl while there and now we are happily married-that is the way to go!
What do you have to lose? …Not $700, certainly…not even close!
Has anyone actually considered the feelings of all the people that are going to lose their jobs if people stopped spending money on dates. Do any of you have the courage to look into the car rental owner’s eyes and tell him that you want to save money and aren’t interested in renting. How about the hotel managers? or the captains of the planes? Until you are prepared to do that I don’t think that its appropriate to continue this discussion.
You have got to lighten up. I am number 3 and 111 and I posted all that as a semi-joke. Not poking fun at the author- really I do feel for him (and if he manages to get any dates out of my idea that he post a shadchans name I’d be happy for him) however, I was just trying to lighten up and see the humor in a situation that although seems unfair and we can post op eds to vent about, in the end wont really change as thats how society just is. I dont really intend to… Read more »
Lol I always wanted to be the last comment!
I definately agree with 33 , girls have to cook and clean and take care if the kids for life , the only time they might feel a bit pampered, u start complaining!!! Mayb don’t go to kollel after marriage and start working!
my dear husband an out of towner took me on dates using the good old fashion new york metro no parking no renting cars no traffic ….. sensibility /creativity and matched made in heaven
anger management anyone?
I’ve always been of the mind that girls should pay towards dates, or even for dates, so I’m def with the author on that one – and I’m a girl 🙂 However, I love how some of you are saying that if we want to get married, we should just move to CH for a couple of years….as if some of us don’t already have a lives in other countries – as if we can just pick up and leave. Just drop out of school, or leave our jobs, our commitments, e.t.c. I’ve seen it happen time and time again,… Read more »
Arranging a meeting on skype before dating is a great idea. I am also in favour of classes. Also, to avoid the whole out-of-town vs Crown Heights Ir Hakodesh issue, don’t even consider Crown Heights unitl you are absolutely positive there is nothing in your home town/city/country.
we should stop talking such shtusim, money comes and goes but marriage is for life!!!!!
why dont we all pray that moshiach should come right now and the dates will be held in isreal.
“c) the cost of the amount of make up u use probably comes out to .75 cents at most ” – quoted by #65
i personally dont agree with the whole plastering on make-up, but how dare one think that make-up must be so cheap. make-up could be up to $80-$100 for one small eye-shaddow. dont start me on the make-up artist…… and dont say to buy cheap ones. its as bad as applying paint to your face.
bachurim should buy a lottery ticket and hope for the best……
You are hilarious!!!!!
good comeback
..I was gonna tell the lady about the email idea so good that you told her..hey, it worked for me and it’s useful in many situations. Also, you and others were saying that you’re okay with guys not spending a lot on you and that they can save money. To me it sounds like most of the expenses will still be there like the ticket, taking off work and (most people will still need) the car (+gas & coverage etc). Also, if the guy is not a cheap guy he will not feel comfortable ruining a good night looking for… Read more »
you’re lucky you’re even getting offers, with such a sick attitude!!!! there are people out there who cant even find one shidduch, dont complain abt your issues on the whole line of girls you have waiting for you!!
This will probaly get the fireworks really going…. but here goes…Either you want to live in the Lubavitch which to a large extent was no different then any other Chassidhe Kreis… Just ask how your parents… I am talking in the 50’s 60’s 70’s and even 80’s.. how they got married…I was aq Bochur in 770 Reb Shloime Zarchi Reb Itche Springer ukedimeh spoke either to you directly if you were from out of town or to your parents… Mer Veinker.. you were et vos a Chasidshe Bochur.. ok if you werent the biggest learner You ran to the Rebbes… Read more »
if you really want you’ll find a way so you can aford it but don’t plan 3 shiduch dates at once!!!!!!!!!
To the writer of the aricle: Welcome to the world! It ain’t an easy place. No one said it would be easy or cheap to meet your bashert. I agree with #17, #22,, #25, #40 and others that share the same sentiments. If this guy is cheap at this early stage of the game….what can a future wife expect down the line! One has to be frugal, yet smart. Use what’s available…like Skype, Facebook, Email and other means to exchange words and photos, to narrow your chances for your date adventure to be a positive experience. Being a woman, AND… Read more »
The bochur is saying its $700 for dating 1 girl . If he needs to date a few girls till he finds the right one then that’s alot of money. My friend dated an out of town girl and it cost him $400 dollars for the airline ticket. He stayed for a week to make it worthwhile and get in at least 3 dates. He had the cost of one weeks car rental, gas, the cost of each of the dates….luckily he was able to stay by a friends house…but some bochurim come to a city where they need a… Read more »
i never saw so many people arguing over an article, and to make this worse, GIRLS that are desperate obviously, fighting over a guy who wrote this stupid article. there is definitly something wrong with the shidduch scene as they say, and its because of people like YOU who make a scene online, begging the author to go out with you. geez. you know they have dating sites for sad cases like that. PLEASE PLEASE get off COL and go on sawyouatsinai.com ps. btw, author…number 3 is a DEFINITE catch, i mean come on! she said shed even bring her… Read more »
I am number 3 and someone suggested that the author and I go out, but then number 103 suggested that the author and number 58 go out. Well number 58 wait in line! I commented first! So I get first dibs. No seriously, it does sound like the author and I have some common ground and I am looking for an out of towner as well, so is there anyway to contact him? Not directly of course that would be too freaky but maybe the author can contact a reputable shadchan and then post the shadchan’s name so people who… Read more »
if some dirt rich sicko or miserly snob thinks this is unreasonable, dont marry into that family for the sake of a happy marriage.
I have been suggesting for months to host a “singles event” One night of fun (not in the wrong ways) with many options to choose from. I’m just about sure for all those “cheap” guys this would be a good idea.
I’m offering to sponsor the event with minimum to no door fee.
I welcome ideas and suggestions at: [email protected]
Must say I agree!
If you want to split the dating money, why not split the cost of the wedding as well? Do you know how much more that costs? Cant even compare!
Okay Ich geit machin dee shiduch….
#58 please post your name, phone#, email, skirt size, and eye color…
I personally know the author and I’ll definately pass it on!
Guys,
Please don’t feel you have to impress us with the money you don’t have. Park on the street, its less pressure for us. We don’t mind circling for half an hour, we don’t have any time we have to get to the destination. Also you don’t have to take us to ritzy hotels where water costs $8. We don’t mind starbucks or other casual non-conventional dating spots.
dating on skype, internet ,phone etc…is not INSTEAD of meeting the person face to face it’s something you should do before you hop on the plane.
lisen i think we should just have a bighall and were every body can meet once in a month and see date from there
#58 maybe you should just go for the guy whos the author of this article???
but this is society, nothings gonna change it, even logic cant.
stop dating as a profession. stay focused and marry. save the money for the rent. you will need it.
Let the guy pay for the plane for the girl to fly from to New York to his out of town city. Maybe this will reduce expenses such as food, car rental, etc…..
open a new account with a name like #[email protected] or what ever you want. then no one will know who you are. and also, dont think lowly of yourself. who ever you are, G-D created you with your unique qualities, and as i like to say “every pot has a cover” and so does yours! and about this whole issue… i agree with the author! i am a girl, and i personally feel uncomfortable when i c a guy is spending so much money on me. it puts extra pressure, and you’re not thinking about what is ikkar! just come… Read more »
what about the families that want the boy to come to to meet their daughters first in their respective cities and offer to pay for half the cost of the ticket…………….and then never do so…………… this is so not mentchlach………. keep your promises…………..
If your looking for your marriage partner and most of the girls happen to be in CH…why don’t u stay in Ch for a couple of years, like alot of ppl do?
Just constructive criticism here!! 😉
Yup….since you’re so smart you can figure out how to find out more….
I can’t leave my email address on COL. . it has my surname on it!! and then the world will know just who I am!!
On second thoughts, maybe I should. . who knows, I may just be bombarded with suggestions . . . as I said, “if only . . ”
but thanks for the advice anyway. , ,
i think the smoking issue should be addressed first.
First of all: http://www.shidduchvision.org. A few other good points have been raised, I think that all (mature) bochrim and girls pay quite enough on dates, if not with money then on an emotional level, so that is not where the problem is. I think the people setting up the date should have more invested in them. Here are people who stand to gain $1000 if it works out, but have nothing to lose if it does not! There is nothing quite as frustrating as being set up with someone who is completely not shaiach. Therefore I propose that a shadchin… Read more »
would you like to become alittle more broke and be the 1st guy to come out and meet me…….coz im broke from going out meeting guys………. its very often teh other way round too at least ur doing the right thing…..
37, I agree with you completely, you sound like your a great husband, as for #83, obviously guys know we can take care of ourselves, it’s just a show of being a gentleman, I personally think it says a lot about a guy who takes the time to open doors.
i got it!!!!!!!!!!!!!
SKYPE SHIDDUCHIM….YOU CAN EVEN TURN OFF THE SCREEN INSTANTLY IF YOUR NOT COMPATIBLE..
rabbonim have got to start issung guidelines on this. its absurd that bochurim and de facto their parents have to fork out endlessly for speculative shidduchim. whats the difference between that and gambling on a roulette wheel. even worse..many girls apparently are not remotely interetsed in the shidduchim their parents have lined up for them and just curious so they go along with the whoe chardade which in itself is gnaivas daas. the halcah is clear.. one is not permitted to go into a store and ask how much is this or that when you have no intention of buying.… Read more »
We spent many thousands of dollars during the dating stages. Girls who want a working boy, or career oriented one ( and many girls do), can’t expect the boy to pick up and move to Crown Heights for a year just to date. The author is correct, in that when my sons flew to cities where we did not know anyone, we were expected to house, feed and provide transportation for our sons, without ANY help from the girl’s side. Even when they went to Corwn Heights, we had to find housing (not so simple if yo don’t have family/friends… Read more »
I am 24 and never really dated.. who needs the headache ?
To #63, your name is number79… let me guess, you got married to comment 31?? If you did, that is amazing. See, a shidduch was made here. If I may ask, how did it happen? I’m a single girl, I could use some tips.
at the end i think ur wife side will pay more that all the shiduchim u had……..
DATING GMACH- GREAT IDEA!
I totally agree with the author.
it also depends on the type of girl your are. Im the type of girl to get things done on my own and think that when the boy opens the door for the girl, its soooo dorky. get a life, its real like here , your an adult and take care of yourself!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
the whole thing is one big business
i dont think u need to live in ny just to get married!
why is that a right thing to say???????
That was addressed to High Maintenance #33 (not you 36)
hehe Yaakov Avinu..if we’re comparing to that maybe he should just get a camel instead of a car and get water from the well so he’ll have no $ problems…
70: They do have “facilities’ to exchange email addresses” just leave you email address in your comment….
67: that was funny..(the 2nd half)
Lots of comments here, some are really rediculious. As a girl, I’ve flown twice to meet a guy, not only in ch. sometimes these things can be shared and sometimes not. take the subway. be a cheap dater, no biggie. go to starbuks and talk, walk around, sodas in the park. its not about WHAT YOU DO, ITS WHO YOUR DOING IT WITH. if you feel she has potential, dont be as cheap. girls are not dumb we all get the economy issues. inlaws should not be paying potential soninlaws to fly. ask your own parents, its their investment too.… Read more »
The writer makes some very valid points. I also was living outside of CH when I was dating and found that a trip to NY plus a few dates over a weekend was costing me close to $1000. I am a little bit of an old schooler and believe that the cost of dates should be the guys responsibility. However, I believe today, there is a bad trend taking place within the dating circles. When a guy agrees to date a girl, he has a large investment going into it and takes his decision seriously. He does not want to… Read more »
Yes, I’m a girl, but I come from a family made up of girls AND boys. Yes, my brothers have spent quite a bit on dating, but so have I and my sisters. There have been times where the boy (okay, his mother) says that he has just missed too much work, please come to him and us girls do. Now, you can say that we had the choice and didn’t have to go to the boy, except that we know how they feel, we are in the same boat so we compromise. My issue with most of these comments… Read more »
Everybody’s worried about the cost of dating. How about the cost of a wedding (both sides) and setting them up in an apt? that’s killing me!
LIKE SOMEONE SAID BEFORE THE PROBLEM IS WITH THE SHADCHUNIM THEY JUST SEND OUT A BOY AND GIRL WITH OUT DOING ANY HOMEWORK ITS JUST A NUMBER GAME FOR THE SHADCHUNIM THEY KEEP SENDIND THEM OUT EVENTUALLY SOMEONE WILL GET ENGAGED AND THEN THEY WILL MAKE MONEY.ITS ABOUT MONET .UNFORTUNALLY BECAUSE OF THIS THERE HAVE BEEN BROKEN ENGAGEMENTS . FIRE THE SHADCHUNIM!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
I dont understand. Wouldnt someone rather get married than get bankrupt? I would do anything just to get married.
Actually, I have a daughter of 27, what youre writing is making so much sense: Personally, we would definitely agree to pay half towards tickets etc. . its only right and fair. . its a shame COL does’nt have ‘facilities’ to exchange email addresses, who knows , . . we could have both made enquiries to see if its an idea and then something may have come from this!! What a way to make a Shidduch!
If only . . .
I saw that in Lakewood certain Shadchonim have now organised for young men and women to talk and see each other in private houses through special video screens if they live in different cities. Certainly, this is a good alternative to the costs involved in travelling to meet a prospective match. At least this way you know before you travel if you both are interested in each other and if there is a good chance of a successful shidduch occuring. Just a thought.
Wake up and smell the rosses…
I do like #18. Great idea!
I feel for you but there is no way that the girls side paying will work out, because her dad won’t wanna pay since the wedding is gonna cost him an arm n’ a leg, and asking the girl to chip in is straight out emasculating and kind of a buzz kill, Instead we need to talk about moving to ch or a dating car gmach in ch. And #33 are you for real?! Do you need new clothes for every date?! What would you be wearing if you were not dating?? And are you that bad looking that you… Read more »
I see many ppl calling the author “cheep” or “if you don’t want to spend hundreds on a stranger you won’t want spen money on your wife” ….
Dating is NOT marriage and also not as closely related as people think. Once you’re on the second or third date they have a point but not for the first.
That comment shreeks pessimistic high maintanence I’m glad I don’t have to date her. Okay, sorry that was harsh but:
a) I’m u can find some other “perks” to being a girl then the fact that a stranger (who in shidduchim case might not want to) buys u a drink.
b) You don’t HAVE to buy a new dating dress each time and if u do (cause you can) you’re not going to throw it out after.
c) the cost of the amount of make up u use probably comes out to .75 cents at most
why doesn’t #3 and the author of the article go out
they seem to have a strong common ground that is very fundamental, and of course although i dont know either ofthem personally the guy wears pants and te girl a skirt
To #36
I can tell you from experience, good thinking. There was an article here (still up on the sidebar) last year……….. and now we’re married.
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It is time that all this nonesense ceased. Where does the expression dating come from. There was a time when the boy found out as much as possible about the girl and then met just to make sure that the chemistry was right,and that was it. To-day you want three girls lined up just in case. In other words you really do not have the intention to get engaged. Where is your faith in HaSh-em who is mezaveg zivugim ? How ever long you “date” you cannot really know the girl until you are married for some time. So pray… Read more »
At the cost of sounding rude, you ought to really give thought to moving to Crown Hts. You would of course move for a promising job opportunity and this is more important, by far. Also, the clock is ticking, perhaps not as much as her’s, but ticking nevertheless. Before you know it, it is another Pesach another Tishrei, nothing happens in the summer etc. I am out of town, and told my daughters that they really have no choice, it is just the way it is. If your being out-of-town is shlichus, this is MORE IMPORTANT THAN SHLICHUS at this… Read more »
That’s what’s good about the Internet (and telephone). You
can find out if there’s a good chance before you incur such expenses.
no such thing anymore the girl pays for the wedding –
most times whoever has more money pays for the wedding or its split 50/50 and een if you go to the old style where the guys pays for music pictures and so on its just about 50/50 as well
I’m a girl and I actually agree with him. I have not started dating yet and will imy”h begin soon but this guy has a point. I don’t understand why guys have to pay so much money to go out. I read all the comments thus far, some were ridiculous, some were attacking, and some were close-minded (this is what is done women: we like it men: suck it up and be a man) and some were actually intellectual and enlightening. I dont like the picture or skype ideas, but I did like the money saver sensitive ideas. You dont… Read more »
its unbelievable to c how everyones minds work!!!
im a girl so really i shoud not be paying for my dates but i do and it is to much so i think we should make a gamach
i THINK YOU SHOULD GO FOR EACH OTHER. . LOOKS LIKE A GOOD SHIDUCH!!!!
Yackov Avinu worked 7 years for his first wife(he didn’t love) another 7 years for the next. 700$ is maybe 1-2 weeks wages for a low income earner. I would symphasize more with you if you were not earning anything just learning. And to conclude Yackov avinu didn’t even come with any possesions, money, his own shirt on his back he got it from a dead drown man(look in the midrash) he had to work 14 years for the wife he loved Rochel(which nowadays would translate into approximatly 700 grand for 14 years work. which is about 1000 times your… Read more »
i totally agree with the author. I would like to clarify, for those who think he is cheap, that my impression is that he is not complaining that he spent once 700$ for a date, but that it is happening again and again and again. That’s where the rpoblem is. And still, this bochur works, so he is lucky. I remember my brother, learning in 770, telling me how he doesn’t understand why bochurim, who clearly don’t work, as they are lamdanim, have to pay good money for each date, money that they don’t have. While the girls works, gets… Read more »
Most bochurim cannot get a ‘real’ job.
amazing
I agree that it’s not fair that the boys should shell out all the money for dates. I believe most girls are ok with making changes so the system can work better.. “In exchange” boys should also make some changes ie consider going out with a girl who is say older or doesnt reach the exact physical specs as you would like and give more girls a fair chance. Like you said “It takes two to tango” in the dating world…things have got to change, so give a little and get a little… Other than that, I agree with whoever… Read more »
1. In those days, people weren’t at ALL caring of their private dates as people are nowadays.
2. If a guy wanted to keep his cash rather than spend it on risky shidduchim, he would’nt go to Prime Grill.
i personally love this. Thats what makes shidduchim something you can laugh at after you finally get married. Some things in life just have to be done, and you can either do it with a smile as you shell out those dollars, or be a grouch and make your date feel like she’s wasting your money when you order water because its “cheaper”. girls, and guys- you spend money on different things, shouldnt the girl be complaining that its too expensive to pay for the majority of the wedding? nevertheless, they do it. (unless an arrangement is worked out prior… Read more »
This OP is really funny
Your spouse is going to cost you millions and you are complaining for 700 box?
Imagine that you got married last year,now think, how much money did you save now that you are still single?
But ,it looks that you are not getting maried b/c you are affraid about your future expenses
Take a break. Spend some time with a married mentor/someone who knows you, and who you look up to, to better know yourself. ALSO, work and consult with a shadchan/matchmaker to help guide you along – it’s not a good idea to be able to make sense out of everything all by yourself, clouded by your emotions and yetzer hara. Discover what core values/goals you want for your FUTURE home. Don’t worry about where you are NOW in your life, as ALL of that will change as you create a new entity between you, your basheret, and Hashem. Who do… Read more »
Im an out of towner, and ive dated a few times myself, and this guy has to think more in to his dates whether he should fly in for somone or not, the first thing to do if you are going to fly in for a date is, you have to see a picture of who you would go in to meet, and second thing is to have at least 1 phone conversating with the girl before you do anything if your going to fly in to meet with someone, and if the conversation works out good, than you would… Read more »
to the point! i like it!
its true the girls side pays for the wedding
http://www.shidduchvision.org
I think we should ban people from dating outside their cities, or, instead of drinking at high end bars, go to a place like the Kretchma.
if you think going out is getting you broke,wait till you get married!!!
a guy who is looking to save money on dating a girl, will be looking to save his money throughout the entire marriage. why should i surprise her with a first class ticket, when i can buy one for the economy fare? my advice to the writer, is start to think big. go get a real job. and then you won’t have to be writing articles like this.
maybe you should consider wearing your clothes more than once? or perhaps you go out with some many people that your clothes get worn out from all that dating, and you really do need some new clothing…either way, you aren’t being fair.
The aibeshter didn’t create females thinking that “ahhh so the maalos of being a woman are that they’ll have the extra special mitzvah of lighting shabbos candles, making kugels and not having to pay for dates!” women are no more entitled than men in having to pay.
please get real.
living and working out of CH has lots of great benefits, whether it be that you live near family, make good money, or are going to a great school, but yeah, not everything can be perfect…
why do you think so many shidduch-age people MOVE to CH, the great weather, beautiful apartments, or high paying jobs? not likely…
that is the consequence.
I’m a guy and I really have to say that although I do see the authors point to an extent because dating is pricey, but at the same time I have dated many girls from out of town and never spent as much as he claims. Also, there is something nice about being the one to take care of things. I’m not saying you should refuse if a girl offers to pay (within reason), but dating is an investment that will soon pay off and will be worth every penny. I recently got married and every penny I paid for… Read more »
It seems like the author might have at least 2 or 3 potential shidduchim from all the comments “I am a girl…” who think alike him…
Shidduchim in this website?
dating is a lifelong investment, all of it must be done in person. i dont think any of the rebbeim would give the okay on a skype date, sorry.
pre arranged marriages, save everyone tons of money and heart ache!
One of the only perks of being a girl! yes- we dont have to pay and we dont have to plan the date. Sorry not going to pay half. Maybe guys should pay for the cost of new dating clothes and makeup?!
I am shocked that no one is commenting on the fact that he mentions that “I even know of some who won’t fly in unless there are 2 or 3 girls lined up, just in case the first girl doesn’t work out.”
What is up with that??
is that really fair to girl number one?
dont you think he is dating her with the thought – “I cant commit now, I may miss out on something even better”
that seems pretty unfair to me…
Im a girl and I agree! why should boys have to pay so much for every potential shidduch. Besides these shadchanim dont even use their heads when they set two ppl up together. how many times does a boy or girl go out with someone who is completely out of their leaugue! its not right to set ppl up just bc he wears pants and she wears a skirt & u might make some cash! no one likes wasting their time, money or energy. So shadchanim use a bit of seichel when suggesting a name! and since this is the… Read more »
ouch get a job in c.h. bro save your soul every other guy and girl does it for at least a year which i hope uve done but maybe its time to give it another go.
even if it doesnt work out, the cost of all dates,airfare,taxi,parking etc.etc. should be split 50/50.
Its not a matter of ‘well this is what the boys have been doing forever so i dont have to split all the costs with him’, rather its a matter of mentchlichkeyt. comeon girls.. lets do the right thing.
may it be anyone in search of their zivug should find one b’shaah tovah, and live happily together for 180 healthy joyous years. moshiach now.
very well put, hope all those potential shvers understand you
wow. i remember an article someone once wrote about the bochurim who won’t fly out unless there is more than one girl lined up. the comments on that one were staggering. all the bochurim started protesting the other side-how much of a cost is incurred, etc.
this is sheer genius! it makes so much sense! a bit unconventional, but aren’t all the best ideas unconventional?
i dont agree
Yikes, hope this isnt the guy thats flying in to go out with my daughter. If it is, aint gonna work buddy, get a job in New York!!!
as a bochur that might be in the same situation as you soon iy”H, i am scared that my money will run out and prevent me from going on shidduchim, this is a good point you bring out.
Looks like we’re getting back into these op-eds…kewl…. I agree with your very well articulated concern and I’ll explain why. If shidduch dating were standard dating you would not be completely correct since a girl (in most cases) feels like she should be taken out and for her it show that the guy cares about her. Shidduch dating however is very different, I like to call the first date (maybe even the second one) a meeting. It is most definitely NOT a date (with the exception of cases where guy and girl know each other from elsewhere) since at the… Read more »
How cheap would you be with your wife? Marriage costs money! Raising a family costs more money. Stay single, cheapskate.
I happen to agree with you. I am married many years, but I remember when I was in the “dating game” my father offered to pay for the boys ticket if the shidduch didn’t work out. Some took the money and some didn’t, but the offer was there.
It is a lot of money and people should try to be understanding.
I think dating should be done in houses just as it always used to be. My grandparents in the shtetel went to his cousins house to date, not to prime grill.
I hear where this guy is coming from, BUT>>>>is this a business transaction or is this men having to fulfill a mitzvah that has been placed on their shoulders?
In todays day and age there is no reason not to meet intially through phone dates or even a skype date. if after a few such dates things seem to be going well and there is an interest from both parties to continue then an investment of money is justified.
Darkoi shel ish lachzor acharei hoisha.
u kidding me?
it does take two to tango 😉
I always feel so terrible for the guy and all the time/money that’s wasted when it doesn’t work out (which it hasn’t…yet). My parents always insist on paying for half of the bochur’s ticket. I think its the decent thing to do.
intresting!!! why are you posting this on colllive?? Post this is on a dating website!!!
what about the 20 hours a girl puts in to prepare for the date. and today lots of girls drive for the date and will offer to pay for a drink but as long as the guy opens the car door:)
its a investment
Go girls
1)dont fly for a date unless you are 80% sure this is for you. otherwise wait a bit and everyone ends up in CH sometime during the year and you can go out then 2) you dont always have to rent a car. most people borrow a car or take a taxi it might be cheaper 3) if you take a taxi you dont need to park and if you drive there is parking all around the city and if its cold you can park at your hotel just pay for the meter. 4) most girls buy cheap drinks and… Read more »
I feel for you–I’ve flown around to roughly a dozen cities in 3 countries–it’s a real shame there’s no shidduch insurance to pay for that! You can try asking them to split the cost of the flight, but anything more (car, drink, etc) is really the guy’s territory. Also, don’t forget that some may consider NY to be the dating “hub”, so they’ll be reluctant to pay for an out-of-towner’s ticket when they can go out with someone already here for free. One last piece of advice, since you’re flying in and investing so much $$ in each shidduch, why… Read more »
and to stay in a hotel for the night another $400 and dinner another $50
Not from 770 reb dovid says: when their 90 all are alike any way
i think u are right – unconventional – but then again, these are hard times & i think its a good idea – and i’m a girl!
Um, doesn’t the girl’s side pay for the whole wedding?
i can say i agree to it all but amen brother amen
I am an out of town girl who has dated for quite a bit too, and while I really feel for you, I do, I dont think its fair for a father in law to shell out money on his daughters behalf. Why should he spend money on a guy who wont even become his son in law?! The girl should pay out of her own money, she is the one dating not her father! Knowing what you are going thru, I hate it when boys spend a ton of money on me on dates. It makes me feel so… Read more »
im glad to finally hear a guy who doesnt want to pay for everything. The girls just dont know, and think that he doesnt want her to chip in.
If not for the seriousness of the issue at hand, this could actually be a pretty funny article. Don’t get me wrong – I’m not laughing AT it, it’s just that it’s written in such a good, humorous style.
Being that I’m a girl – I could on principle disagree, but that wouldn’t be a very nice principle. Author has a point – and a well made one at that.