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Thursday, 15 Tammuz, 5779
  |  July 18, 2019

    Nanny Was Buying Non Kosher

    From the COLlive inbox: A Crown Heights woman saw a non-Jewish babysitter buying ice cream for 3 Jewish children. Full Story

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    Same story
    Guest
    Same story

    Posted a few years back. Non Jewish workers always pose a risk

    I wish ppl will care  more from now on..
    Guest
    I wish ppl will care more from now on..

    Stop trusting them!!!if you care about yourself its time to care about your children!!

    mix in!!!!!
    Guest
    mix in!!!!!

    taking care of our children is our business.

    goyishkeit.
    Guest
    goyishkeit.

    this is what happens when you leave your children with goyishe babysitters. you are putting your children at risk from the youngest and most tender age. how can you live with the thought that your children develop a connection to a shiktze. to allow your children to stare at goyishe face all day gives them a horrible grubkeit. save your children!

    Nonsense
    Guest
    Nonsense

    Which packaged ice creams don’t have a hekhsher?
    Not having a hekhsher also doesn’t mean not kosher. Contrary to what you might believe, there are actually observant Jews who just read the ingredients. Kashrut.org even assists people with doing that.
    Mind your own business and don’t humiliate people in public because you’re worried that some children might eat something which isn’t kosher enough for you

    Lol
    Guest
    Lol

    I saw it happened

    Go dini avichzer!!
    Guest
    Go dini avichzer!!

    This incident has inspired me to realise how careful we must be with our childrens CHINUCH!

    49 yr in the hood
    Guest
    49 yr in the hood

    i was once one of those kids ………
    by the way there are jewish woman who need to work .
    its worth it to pay a little more $ for yr kids they are yr future . its yr $ its yr kids

    Go dini avichzer!!
    Guest
    Go dini avichzer!!

    This incident has inspired me to realise how careful we must be with our childrens CHINUCH!

    To # 5
    Guest
    To # 5

    Obviously you didn’t read the story. Family Dollar does not sell Cholov Yisroel ice cream and she did not humiliate anyone.

    Response to 5
    Guest
    Response to 5

    I’m assuming the issue here is of cholov yisroel, which is kept by the overwhelming majority of members in this community.

    happens all the time
    Guest
    happens all the time

    don’t kid yourself
    don’t leave your kids with goyim

    What?
    Guest
    What?

    I’m sure the nanny read the ingredients and knows what’s good and not
    Right, #5?

    Thank you Dini for your courage
    Guest
    Thank you Dini for your courage

    It takes a lot to stand up for what’s right. It’s a good reminder for all of us to look at what we buy.

    um #5
    Guest
    um #5

    would you want your kids to eat non-kosher ice cream? I doubt that all ice creams out there are kosher, maybe some are but how can you assume that if you don’t check it?

    to #5
    Guest
    to #5

    In answer to your first question “Which packaged ice creams don’t have a hekhsher?” PLENTY just walk into any not kosher supermarket.

    Secondly the way you are writing gives off the impression of someone with lacks knowledge of kashrut and lacks a caring for yidishkeit in general.

    Thirdly I think its pretty clear that this babysitter and ill bet your children’s babysitter never heard of a website called Kashrut.org

    “not kosher enough for you” why do you assume that a non jewish babysitter is only gonna buy food that doesnt have the best hecksher maybe the food was and is totaly not kosher!!!

    lechaim 7
    Guest
    lechaim 7

    so happy! thank you so much for sharing!!!

    Not Chabad
    Guest
    Not Chabad

    I guess this is not a Chabad family, it’s a nusach Ari family

    To #5
    Guest
    To #5

    What story are you reading? There was no “observant Jew reading the ingredients,” but a non-Jewish nanny who simply didn’t know better. Furthermore, no one was “humiliated in public.”

    And yes, most packaged ice creams may have a hechsher, but they are not Cholov Yisroel, and as such are off-limits to us as Chabad chassidim.

    Cholov Yisroel
    Guest
    Cholov Yisroel

    Agree we mostly keep cholov yisroel, but let’s be realistic; if they Gd forbid consumed cholov stam by accident, technically it’s still kosher. Stop freaking out !

    CH resident
    Guest
    CH resident

    Kol hakovod to you, Mrs Avichzer
    Unfortunately we are told to mind our own business, but these children ARE our business, and it’s sad that too many moms need to work and rely on non Jewish nannies. It’s hard, but we cannot sacrifice our children for money!

    I went to church as a child
    Guest
    I went to church as a child

    My nanny took me to church daily and I ate non kosher food daily. It seriously never occurred to mention any of this growing up. I didn’t even bring it up to my parents late in adulthood because of my trust issues with babysitters. The funny things is my parents praised this woman for years on how amazing she was. I will not ever have a non Jew babysit my children, yes I wish I had a nanny, it would really help but the risk is too great. Parents really think about the person you are hiring to RAISE YOUR… Read more »

    OMG!!
    Guest
    OMG!!

    thank you for budding into someones business and saving those kids!! i wish there were more people like you around!!!

    Since when is cholov Stam not kosher?!
    Guest
    Since when is cholov Stam not kosher?!

    I’m Chabad and eat cholov stam from time to time. Does that mean I eat not kosher? Get a grip. Same goes for the Eruv. People here have to begin realizing that not everyone here in CH shares the same level of kashrus. I do commend the woman for looking out for someone’s kids. There’s no point in eating cholov stam when right up the block is a store that sells cholov Yisroel.

    Of course there are treif ice creams
    Guest
    Of course there are treif ice creams

    Rocky road usually has non kosher marshmallows

    to all of you who employ goyim
    Guest
    to all of you who employ goyim

    whats wrong with you?
    you employ goishe cleaners, and you pay them cheap, you employ goyim to lok after your kids, and you pay them cheap.
    u wont help and pay your fellow jews. ugh. when will you learn??????

    Working mothers
    Guest
    Working mothers

    Some mothers need to work full time and have no choice but to hire a nanny. I work because I need the money. For food. For tuition. For clothing. Not for luxuries. I resent being judged from my decision. It’s not an easy one to make btw I would rather this than live on welfare and hand outs and charity. My nanny is amazing and I trust her completely with my children. She knows what they can and can’t eat. This can happen with a Jewish babysitter too.

    Wake up call!!
    Guest
    Wake up call!!

    Sickening!! I can’t stand to see little kids coming off the bus to see their nannys or cleaning ladies there to greet them !!! It’s so wrong! You bring children into this world . Be a mother be there when going on and off the school bus! The hours in between you can work or do whatever you want but it’s a disgrace to see this! There’s no excuse for a mother not to be at the bus stop !!! A woman is not meant to be the breadwinner of the home . She can help out but needs to… Read more »

    To 22
    Guest
    To 22

    Best comment. I had a girl live in (Jewish!!) because I needed help & she had nowhere to go.She was with me for about 5 years. I thought it was working well…. until years later when my son told me she used to pinch the kids and yell and scream. I asked them why they never told me & they just shrugged. I am sure she reads this, so I hope it gets through. To this day she babysits – I haven’t seen her in 25 years, she is no longer in CH. The point is…. even JEWISH babysitters/nannies can… Read more »

    Cholov Stam...Chabad?
    Guest
    Cholov Stam...Chabad?

    While cholov Stam is kosher it is certainly not Chabad standard. So if you eat cholov Stam it means you don’t adhere to Chabad standards. So while you may identify and consider yourself Chabad this is not the standard the Rebbe expected of Chassidim.

    cholov stam
    Guest
    cholov stam

    It’s scary what we’ve come to. People belittleing the importance of cholov yisroel. The rabbeim of chabad made very serious statements about the negative effects of non cholov yisroel.

    Nanny
    Guest
    Nanny

    No one quoted the Rebbe’s instruction on a) non Jewish nannies/bsbysitters & b) chalav akum..it is very clear

    Well done
    Guest
    Well done

    There are many kashrus issues with ice cream
    And cholov akum is not the only issue
    A) gelatin from an animal (not kosher or triefa animal)
    Than there is problem with the diffrent flavors
    And of course there is the problem of the equipment which was used to make the ice cream
    Today factories use their equipment for various reasons
    So you cannot just buy ice cream in the store and not worry
    Thank you for caring about these children

    To #24
    Guest
    To #24

    Any diary not Cholov Yisrael is making it hard for a yid to learn Torah and to keep Mitzvos why would someone want to do that? as it is there are plenty of Menios V’ikuvim? Zachin L’adam Shelo Bfanav.

    for you to be aware
    Guest
    for you to be aware

    there is NO SUCH THING HALACHICALLY AS CHOLOV STAM111 IF IT IS NOT CHOLOV YISROEL WHO ARE YOU FOOLING BY USING TH PSEUDONYM CHOLOV STAM. IT IS CHOLO V AKUM AVDAI KOCHOVIM UMAZOLS THAT SPECIFICALLY IS METAMTAIM E M U N A H……

    Citizen Berel
    Guest
    Citizen Berel

    Wait what…nannies, I guess I live on the other side of town…

    Wow
    Guest
    Wow

    Thank you Dini for handling this sensitive issue.You were respectful & correct!
    I heard many years ago of a local nanny taking her charges to church with her but never met anyone who had encountered that. Thank you #22 for Sharing your horrible experience. B h sounds like you were not Chas v affected and are careful not to expose your children to such spiritually dangerous possibilities. Also thank you for bringing it to the publics attention. You are a brave woman who sacrifices not having a nanny bec of the dangers!

    To #24
    Guest
    To #24

    Refuah shleimah I hope you recover from your confused state of mind

    Number 24
    Guest
    Number 24

    I’m totally with you, and this relates to the eruv controversy. Read my comment above (number 20). This closed minded dogmatic thinking that exists in CH is a serious problem. People need to relax !

    i hang out at the park
    Guest
    i hang out at the park

    …and its extremely painful to see so many precious yiddishe kids being ‘supervised’ by these uncaring, totally disinterested women….yes ur child may look ok by the time u get home but i guarantee you, they have been neglected…maybe not in front of you, but they def deserve a lot more love and care than what theyre getting.
    kids need a parents care.
    if you are unable for whatever reason…at least try to replace yourself with someone you would b happy to compare yourself to- cuz thats what ur kid deserves ‘a good subsitute”..at the very least

    TO #5
    Guest
    TO #5

    Maybe your ignorance is not your fault . But to call it nonsense, that’s chutzpah. Yes a nanny must observe the Kashruth standards required by her employer especially when the children are too small to know the difference.
    Its a matter of life….

    to 24 according to the rebbe cholov stam is an issur
    Guest
    to 24 according to the rebbe cholov stam is an issur

    I asked the rebbe if cholov stam was traife and an issur. The rebbe answered that cholov akum mitamtaim es hamoach v’es ha lev. Meaning it stuffs up the mind and heart. I asked rabbi hadakov if that meant cholov akum is an issur and he said yes cholov akum is an issur. So it is an issue of kashrus

    Relax
    Guest
    Relax

    Come and make a bracha a bracha the kosher ice cream truck is here

    blame
    Guest
    blame

    the schools that cost a bomb , camps the same , kosher food insanely expensive , tznius clothes , shaitals etc that’s why mother have to go to work today!

    @24
    Guest
    @24

    “get a grip” you can’t be chabad and eat chalav stam. Just doesn’t work. Use our name- follow our rules. If it’s so tempting, then join the Modern Orthodox crowd. They’ll be glad to have you.

    to #20 and #24
    Guest
    to #20 and #24

    cholov stam/akum affects your yiras shomayim among other things

    Cholov stam
    Guest
    Cholov stam

    I know from my LOR that if you accidentally use cholov stam on your dishes, you need to kasher them.
    I had a family member who once needed it, and we had to get separate dishes for it.
    We also don’t eat DE for that reason.
    Yasher koach for looking out for someone else’s kids.

    #24 Two sides to the coin!
    Guest
    #24 Two sides to the coin!

    Just as some people here in CH may need to realize “that not everyone here in CH shares the same level of kashrus” those people have to realize that some are on that level, and just because you do something in a ‘none chabad moments’ does not mean that this is Chabad kashrus standard. Same goes for the Eruv, I would love an Eruv in CH just as much as I may want to eat a Snicker Bar, but if Chabad rabonim say no to the Eruv, then that ain’t Chabad, in your own word “get a grip”.

    To number four
    Guest
    To number four

    You need help ASAP. A goyishe face all day cmon. I’m not saying that a Jewish babysitter isn’t preferable but you are something else Gd help you.

    #4 you
    Guest
    #4 you

    Staring at Goshia faces all day!!! You are what’s wrong with the world … Coz I’m sure Hashem created her as well… Just the way you speak shows that you think you are better then another of Hashem creation!!! Which is what’s wrong with the world today!! Slow down, thanks to the women who got involved and made a different.

    no such thing as cholov stam
    Guest
    no such thing as cholov stam

    in the gemara there is cholov akum
    there is yayin nesech, and there is stam yenam, cholov stam is a fabricated name to make you feel better when drinking cholov akum.
    #24 Yes cholov akum is a kosher issue, not everyone accepts the heter of Rabbi Feinstein, who BTW wrote that it is still preferable to drink cholov yisroel, and if it is a matter of cost it should be cholov yisroel. Chabad is makpid especially for children at the time that they are growing to feed the kids Cholov Yisroel davka

    mike kane
    Guest
    mike kane

    if it is ou-d, it is kosher — family dollar is jewish owned

    marg
    Guest
    marg

    when Jewish help organisations employ not yet frum ladies to aid new mothers it can also cause problems.One such lovely lady gave my kids her cheese sandwiches,certainly not the bread or cheese we bought.

    20 & 24
    Guest
    20 & 24

    Cholov Stam is Kosher?

    LOL!

    This is a invention of 1 Rov. No other Poskim agreed with him.

    to #5
    Guest
    to #5

    Some reasons why reading the ingredient list is not a reliable method for determining kashrus are: 1. FDA rules only require stating ingredients comprising at least 2% of the product. 2% is more than botul bashishim (which equals a little under 1.7%) but anyway botul bashishim only applies a) in cases where the forbidden substance dissolves into the food and b) after the fact, NOT when the forbidden substance is added on purpose. 2. FDA rules permit a certain percentage of items like insects, rat hair, etc, in various foods depending on the food item. 3. FDA rules do not… Read more »

    To 24
    Guest
    To 24

    You may be Chabad but certainly not Lubavitch. As Lubavitchers we believe the ‘chalav Stam’ is metamtem the lev and impedes our pure relationship to G-d. If you ‘from time to time’ eat spiritual poison without seeing it as a big deal, it’s obvious that you don’t subscribe to Lubavitch philosophy and values. Doesn’t make you a bad person. I’m not judge. It just makes you somebody who so obviously doesn’t subscribe to Chabad-Lubavitch philosophy.

    to number 24
    Guest
    to number 24

    While I’m not here to interfere with your personal actions, you say and i quote “I’m chabad and eat cholov stam from time to time”. I would like to ask you what does being chabad mean if you aren’t keeping or striving to keep to the observance or minhagim of the chabad movement?
    To answer your question as a Chabad chosid on a personal level cholov stam should be regarded as not Kosher.

    Cholov stam
    Guest
    Cholov stam

    Is like not kosher for a chabad chossid. We dont even eat fron dishes used for non cholov yisroel.

    To all of you saying to "take it easy" about "just" cholov stam!!
    Guest
    To all of you saying to "take it easy" about "just" cholov stam!!

    The fact that she was buying ice cream for the kids isn’t even the point!! Who knows what else she’s for buying them!!!! One thing I’ve seen all too often is the nanny sharing her treif (not “just” cholov stam) lunch with the kids! Is that also not so bad?!?! Thank you Dini Avichzar for saying something to her (of course it was done in a nice way) and for bringing the issue to us!

    cholov stam
    Guest
    cholov stam

    The term cholov stam is a made up term. The shulchan aruch calls it “chalav akum” which is an issur derabanan. Therefore, according to an overwhelming majority of poskim this is NOT KOSHER! Its an isur derabanan like any other!

    Everything matters
    Guest
    Everything matters

    The Rebbe was adamant about non kosher animals on our children’s CLOTHING, how everything around them affects their neshomos and development, even before conception. How Kashrus should be mehudar for their physical and spiritual well being! There is nothing more important. At the end of the day you would not give a goyeh your diamond ring to watch, so why give them your diamonds???

    Hello
    Guest
    Hello

    Please stop judging! First of all it is impossible to find a Frum jewish housekeeper/babysitter. If they do exist they should post an ad and in two seconds someone will hire them. Second – the Rebbe has spoken many times of the dangers of cholav stam. Third – sometimes a mother needs the kids to have exercise so that she can work more one on one with other kids. Fourth- tuition = people have to work Fifth- crown heights needs subsidized after school programs …..

    We can't judge!
    Guest
    We can't judge!

    Someone brave enough to put her name out there, did so in the most sensitive way. No one but hopefully the family she was taking about knows who she’s talking about. Their going to read this and either be thankful, or upset. EITHER WAY DONT JUDGE ANYONE FOR CARING OR FOR NOT REALIZING THEIR CHILDREN WERE IN THIS SITUATION!

    Market place
    Guest
    Market place

    Market place doesn’t have good ice cream!

    @43
    Guest
    @43

    to continue your song
    There’s ice’cream and ices you cant afford the prices…
    I only eat and give my kids cholov yisroel but the ice cream truck is ridiculously expensive.
    That said I totally agree that Mrs Avichzer did the right thing,

    Bestwatchman
    Guest
    Bestwatchman

    Moral of the story: Invest time training in your goyish cleaner/nanny/babysitter. They are much more respectful and willing to listen but they need to be taught the rules.

    overreacting
    Guest
    overreacting

    The way this was written it sounds like you saved these kids life CV from being hit by a car a gun, or about to be abused
    Maybe the parents of these children don’t care if they eat OUD, you can always ask for a phone number and call the mom. It’s not the worse thing for kids to eat this. They will live just fine as it’s not their fault.

    nannies
    Guest
    nannies

    Please don’t use this stories to put down mom’s with nannies. Some homes would not survive without. I know my kids have a warm happy home with a good chinuch because we have a nanny/housekeeper. This story is a wake-up call that you can’t be to careful and make sure your nanny respects your lifestyle. And please don’t judge when you see nannies with kids in the park. I know when I need a sanity break I will send them to the park with her. Everyone has a different situation that will entail full time help – ie. Child with… Read more »

    Babysitter and housekeeping
    Guest
    Babysitter and housekeeping

    Yes it cost me a fortune, I pay a Jewish babysitter that I trust her VALUES as well as capabilities and a housekeeper!
    Cuz my kids are my future!!
    GO DINI AVICHZER! !!!

    Working mothers
    Guest
    Working mothers

    I really hope the posters opining in working mothers understand that B”h most women in our community are mothers and many of them want to work. Many stay at home mothers have told me they wish they had skills and education to get respectful jobs. The belief that women should not work is ancient. Working fulfills a woman in many ways. If you are blessed enough not to have to work when your kids are young you are very lucky. But once they get older you may start to feel like you want something more and at that point it… Read more »

    a great wakeup call!
    Guest
    a great wakeup call!

    Stop trusting your none Jewish babysitter, cleaning ladies,always respect and suspect! Please mothers the chinuch of your children is the future! !!!hiring a Jewish babysitter for another couple of bucks is worth it! Hashemi will give you all the brachos!!!!!!

    @67
    Guest
    @67

    Why are you assuming that it was OU D? Did it say so in the article? Who says it was even kosher according to any standard? And yes, it would have a huge affect on them precisely because they’re children. She saved them from a spiritual car accident. Kudos to her!

    Only Jewish Babysitters
    Guest
    Only Jewish Babysitters

    What is more precious and treasured than our children? Why would an orthodox Jew leave his/her child with goyim? I can only see ignorance or ‘kosher negligence’ as an answer.

    It's not just kashrus issues to watch out for
    Guest
    It's not just kashrus issues to watch out for

    My mother (a”h) told me that she once fired a maid (that’s what we called them in those days) who was watching me as a baby or toddler, because the maid frequently gave me baby aspirin so that I would nap more. And I remember as a four-and-five year old, that the time to go out and wait for the school bus was right after a certain “rhythm and blues” song was played each morning on the radio station our maid liked to listen to in our home. Food for thought. . . . PS: There ARE Jewish places to… Read more »

    Don't judge
    Guest
    Don't judge

    Don’t judge the woman that saw it important enough to do something for these children. And publicize it, with her name, to bring awareness to the mother that does care. If you don’t care, we’ll, that’s sad for your kids

    kosher
    Guest
    kosher

    Isn’t it fine if she fed it to the children within the eruv?

    To #28
    Guest
    To #28

    Yes, you are right that mothers should be able to take care of their own children and be stay-at-home mothers if they so desire. However, some families need the incomes of both parents just to get by. Additionally, single mothers, whether that is because they are divorced or widowed must work full time in order to provide for their children, part-time won’t bring in enough money. Furthermore, there are plenty of cases where the woman is the only one who is able to work. For example, the husband is ill, or he has another disability, be that physical or mental… Read more »

    to 49 and 50
    Guest
    to 49 and 50

    I wouldnt want my children loooking lovingly into goyishe faces and later as adults being attracted to goyim. That is a serious breach

    Shocked
    Guest
    Shocked

    Amazing how many people slandered the Posek Hador Hagaon HaRav Moshe Feinstein ZATZAL in the above comments. Check Igros Moshe about Chalav Stam. The comments here are way worse than 3 kids eating Chalav Stam one time. And that’s an understatement. What a bunch of buffoons and ignoramuses, And no, I do not eat Chalav Stam. But lets all agree with Rav Moshes Teshuva. It is literally impossible with today’s laws to even sneak anything other than cow milk into a plant. And if you think otherwise, your even a bigger Tipish then we though. Oh, and one day the… Read more »

    "Jewish Children"
    Guest
    "Jewish Children"

    The author doesn’t seem remotely distraught—let alone “shaken”—over the multitude of *Jewish parents* who buy this exact ice cream from the “nonkosher store” and then give it to their own children to eat. She claims to have seen a babysitter buying nonkosher ice cream for “Jewish kids,” and as such she intervened. The truth is she couldn’t give a hoot about “Jewish kids.” She intervened because they were Orthodox Jewish kids. To heck with klal yisroel?! She didn’t intervene because they were Jewish, *as she says*, but because they were Orthodox Jews. By calling *them* “Jewish kids” she’s effectively writing… Read more »

    Why?  #28
    Guest
    Why? #28

    You’re sick because I’m not at the bus stop waiting for my kids? That’s because I’m still at school seeing to it that your kids are safely put on the correct bus. I love women who say we should be home with our kids but expect to send their own kids to school and shul. Well who do you think is teaching them? Mothers. So home school your kids, toivel yourself in the ocean and I’ll stay home. Oh and no shul or community programs so those organizers can stay home with their kids too

    To no: 22
    Guest
    To no: 22

    You are 100% correct.
    My mother told me about how when she was younger one of the Jewish families on her street had a non Jewish baby sitter who regularly took the children to church and gave them non kosher food too. My mother came from a totally non frum home so she did not realize how terrible this was. Now, she has tears in her eyes when she talks about it; she wishes she had known enough to speak out.
    I know as mothers we have to work but please be careful who you entrust your children with.

    To #79
    Guest
    To #79

    Rav Moshe Feinstein was a great scholar, but not the ultimate Halachik decision maker. I would rely on Rav Moshe in a time of need, but not under regular circumstances.

    Ikea was serving people horse meat. Remember that. Never assume anything is “impossible”.

    Dear "Why? #28" (currently #81)
    Guest
    Dear "Why? #28" (currently #81)

    If you are putting your own kids in a situation where they’re being watched by a goya — even if it’s in order to teach at one of our chassidishe schools — then (my apologies, but) I for one would rather my kids have a different morah than you. Forgive me, but your choices in this matter — given that there ARE Jewish alternatives for child care (see what “74 It’s not just kashrus issues to watch out for” wrote at the end) — make me hope that my kids don’t have you as a morah. Why? Because if this… Read more »

    Quit with the Pointless Stuff Already
    Guest
    Quit with the Pointless Stuff Already

    I know, I know, it’s the internet, so we all get to judge some mom we’ve never met and judge every nanny we’ve never met and maybe even write some vile and racist thing about staring into the eyes of a goy and losing your soul, as though we’re not all G-d’s creations… Contrary to what I’m reading between the lines, it is not impossible for a childcare professional of any background to learn enough about a family’s dietary requirements to get the right ice cream when no one is fleishig. What if one of the children had (CV) food… Read more »

    To #79
    Guest
    To #79

    Thank you for sharing your ignorance. Reb Moshes Tsuva on cholov Stam is, not because “it’s nearly impossible to put anything in.” It’s because we are witnesses anan sahdi, that they won’t, because the price if they get caught is too steep. (at that time it was a fine of about $100 🙂 , now it might be jail time). And therfore it’s as if A yisroel sees it, hence the standard of cholov yisroel. But he himself writes that personally he doesn’t rely on this heter. It’s heart warming to see a yidishe mamesh who cares not only for… Read more »

    #80
    Guest
    #80

    Many Jewish parents all over USA are not interested in giving their children kosher food – this woman assumed that the parent’s of these children living in Crown Height’s would want them to eat kosher food – that’s why she intervened not because they are orthodox or not

    Wow so judgemental!!
    Guest
    Wow so judgemental!!

    Here we go again, is this what Chabad is all about ?
    Quit butting into people’s business! Why does everyone think they have to save everyone around them? Is this what the Rene wanted?!

    What is wrong with people?
    Guest
    What is wrong with people?

    You can’t trust a piece of meat with a Goy! Would you trust your own child??

    One day we will all be together
    Guest
    One day we will all be together

    Does everything always have to become a raging feud, with corrections and criticism? Please people, just live and let others live.

    On a side note, I do commend the woman, who decided to help out the ignorant nanny.

    chalav akum is a made up term
    Guest
    chalav akum is a made up term

    It was made up by the censor to replace “chalav nochri.” “Chalav nochri” is also a made up term. It was invented by chazal who discerned a kashrus issue involving certain milk processing practices. “Chalav yisroel” was also “made up” at the same time. Later, “chalav stam” was also made up by gedolei doros kodmim—though more recently—to describe a category of dairy processing that fell neither into the first category or the second. No one disputes the kashrus of chalav stam, only the remaining significance of chalav yisroel — save for Blumenkrantz z”l, who pointed out serious questions regarding the… Read more »

    This is what happens...
    Guest
    This is what happens...

    When woman take on the punishments of thier husband. Only a man was punished with the need to work to have food not the woman. Stop punishing woman and let them be full time mothers and care for their kids all day. Chalov Akum is a problem for the soul of a jewish child and is usually the first step to a kid going fry. (even if called by another name aka stam) A goy is a goy is a goy. I respect all of g-ds creations but i don’t fool myself in thinking i should let them teach my… Read more »

    Mimi
    Guest
    Mimi

    Nothing new seen it a few times in the park and other places i work in People’s homes and I see the babysitter feeding the kids yogurt with chicken seen everything already Not news

    Moshe
    Guest
    Moshe

    Then you have the cleaning ladies who mix up meat and dairy stuff all the time you’re not home you don’t know what they’re putting in the microwave I came home one time My luck to see the cleaning lady making hot dogs in my Dariy toaster who knows what she put in the microwave

    larry
    Guest
    larry

    To#5 first we have to know that the nanny could read English second if she could read the type of ingredients that are in the product most people can’t even pronounce and read all the chemicals that are put in to any products so if you think she read the ingredients haha. and besides the lady who posted is a religious woman if you know what it means to be religious

    Response to #80
    Guest
    Response to #80

    Once again, many of us are assuming that while the icecream was likely kosher, it was OU-D. Any Orthodox person can feel fine eating that, but not Chassidim of any sort.

    I'm #22
    Guest
    I'm #22

    Mind you I used to work outside the home. I CHOOSE to work from home. Yes, its not as exciting and it gets lonely sometimes, but that is how strongly I feel about having other people watch my children. Yes its 1000X harder to work from home then it is to work outside of the home. I often stay up extra late just to catch up, but again the sacrifice is well worth it. I know when my children are older I will eventually get back out into the work force. Yes I may not be utilizing my talents in… Read more »

    Be carefull
    Guest
    Be carefull

    One of our non Jewish baby sitters (she was 20 y) played inappropriately dressed with my brother
    He told us many years after this happened
    I remember that she was threatening us and hit us with a cable

    To 78
    Guest
    To 78

    Your stupidity is A serious breach

    to 24 cholov akum may very well be from a traife cow
    Guest
    to 24 cholov akum may very well be from a traife cow

    There is an issue of kashrus with cholov akum. Now many milk cows get a displaced stomach (abomastum)from gas from improper diet. To save the cow and prevent it happening again the stomach is stitched to the abdominal wall during surgery. This renders the cow not kosher. Cholov yisroel is from cows who didn’t have this surgery. I read about this in another post concerning cholov yisroel under Rabbi butman’s lecture on it.

    Dear 84
    Guest
    Dear 84

    28/81 is a working mother who is responding emotionally to feeling judged for working outside the home. I think we can all agree that being a stay at home mother isn’t an option for a lot of women for a variety of reasons, and without working women, many institutions upon which we depend would fall apart. Respond to someone who feels harshly criticized by piling on more contempt just continues to engender hurt and anger and doesn’t get us anywhere. So why not simply post a list of Jewish alternatives or create a website for Jewish playgroups, etc. and focus… Read more »

    Thank You for Speaking up
    Guest
    Thank You for Speaking up

    Its not easy to stand up for what is right especially when many dont want to face the truth.
    At one point I needed a full time nurse in my house after giving birth to help me w the kids. I never ever left the kids alone w her. Im glad I didnt.

    my nanny brought me to yiddishkeit
    Guest
    my nanny brought me to yiddishkeit

    My mother was not religious and hired a frum babysitter to watch me. This babysitter brought me to her home as she babysat me on Friday night where I experienced my first shabbos. I was so impressed. So then she brought me to her niece who took me to shul. Her niece took me to bnei akiva and I became frum, later I went to lubavitch. The opposite can happen with a non jewish or non religious babysitter! My mother was very upset I was brought to yiddishkeit by the way.

    92 This is what happens...
    Guest
    92 This is what happens...

    Dude….really?

    Kosher
    Guest
    Kosher

    guys the ice cream was Kosher. Game over.

    Get a grip
    Guest
    Get a grip

    I thought the “community” of Crown heights changed. We’re in the 21st century, not olden day Russia.

    help
    Guest
    help

    I’ve heard of worse. I’ve heard of babysitters bringing their charges to church

    Babysitter and housekeeping
    Guest
    Babysitter and housekeeping

    Yes it cost me a fortune, I pay a Jewish babysitter that I trust her VALUES as well as capabilities and a housekeeper!
    Cuz my kids are my future!!
    GO DINI AVICHZER! !!!

    Do your kids a favor and find them a yiddishe babysitter.
    Guest
    Do your kids a favor and find them a yiddishe babysitter.

    Better a yiddishe who is not yet shomer shabbos, then a goy. Do not place your child’s well being into the hands of a goy if you can help it

    off-the-wall comments
    Guest
    off-the-wall comments

    Rav Moshe allowed chalav stam. In fact, I personally know someone who went to camp with one of his grandsons. They went to visit Rav Moshe in his bungalow and when the rabbanit brought chalav Yisrael he said “They have to grow. Give them milk”. This business of it causing a kid to OTD has no source. Only non-kosher meat is metamtem the lev . As for treif cows, in Halacha we go by the majority. #78, what are goyish faces as opposed to Jewish faces? You write like the anti-Semites. If a goy converts does he get a new… Read more »

    Judging!!!
    Guest
    Judging!!!

    I hate that word, it becomes the excuse for everything
    Anyway, the original person, Mrs. Avichzer, did NOT say a word about having a nanny being a bad thing, she did NOT say don’t hire a non-Jew.
    She calmy described the situation, and leaves it for the reader/listener to understand what must be done (hire a Jew, or train the non-Jewish worker, etc, etc)
    “oif dem ganif brent dus hitl”

    Lactose and Intolerance
    Guest
    Lactose and Intolerance

    Shame

    Mom
    Guest
    Mom

    I have a cleaning lady to clean and a babysitter(Jew) to watch the kids. It’s more $$, more complicated, but worth the hassles

    eruv and cholov stam
    Guest
    eruv and cholov stam

    The same rav- R’ Moshe Feinstein who gave the heter for cholov stam also said that one cannot build an erev in the five boroughs of NYC. If you follow his psak and you trust his opinion, then you need to follow everything he said.

    I'm the Mom!!!
    Guest
    I'm the Mom!!!

    I am the mother of those 3 children, and I recognize enough of the details to know it was us. Thank you, thank you Dini Avichzer for noticing and preventing my kids from having non-kosher, or EVEN non-cholov yisroel food! I have a nanny for various reasons (for another post), and I try to teach her about our standards, etc. I realize now that she was not capable of making those distinctions and need to rethink how I do things. For all of you that rely on others to care for your kids, for whatever reason: know that there is… Read more »

    mothers working
    Guest
    mothers working

    i remember a farbrengan where the rebbe spoke positively about mothers working

    develop a connection to a shiktze. to allow your children to stare at goyishe face all day gives them a horrible grubkeit. save your children!
    Guest
    develop a connection to a shiktze. to allow your children to stare at goyishe face all day gives them a horrible grubkeit. save your children!

    NUMBER FOUR I find your use of derogatory names when describing non Jews ‘offensive. We all came from one shiksa and one shagaitz ADOM AND CHAVA. If you choose to use a jewish baby sitter – good for you – it doesn’t necessarily make them a better caretaker. But in regard to watching what your child eats you should be more careful. Kashrus isn’t as meaningful to anyone who doesn’t take it seriously both jew and non jew. The term shiksa / shagaitz is not a nice or respectful way to talk about non jews. As many Jewish people are… Read more »

    79 91 110
    Guest
    79 91 110

    First of all if we pasken like REb moshe in regards to Cholov Stam let us Pasken like him in regards to the Eruv which he was against. oh, sorry, we love to pick and chose and go from rov to rov and collect all the Kulois. great good to hear. in any event: Reb moshe was A lone voice, and most POSkim disagreed with him. this included all LUbavitch Rabbonim. in Addition, many do not realize all the points of difference. it is not only if we are afraid that non kosher milk would get mixed in. rather: did… Read more »

    Mimi
    Guest
    Mimi

    Chabad is not the only people that read this site, so please be careful what you say, there are goyim that go to this site to

    To #117
    Guest
    To #117

    THANK YOU.

    To #110
    Guest
    To #110

    The Frierdiker Rebbe write in Sefer Maamarim Yiddish page 57:

    “A person came to the Alter Rebbe, saying that his son-in-law all of a sudden developed doubts in Emunah. The Alter Rebbe replied, he must have unknowingly consumed Cholov Akum.

    Cholov Akum, etc., is the weapon of the Yetzer Hara, who throws his weapons far, and who kill R”L, or causes the person to be a baal Mum, beruchnius. ”

    Cholov Akum, and whatever other names are associated with it, DO AFFECT us, EVEN when consumed UNKOWINGLY.

    Reb Moshe
    Guest
    Reb Moshe

    From what I learned, he was only maikel on having non-cholov Yisroel at times and places where Cholov Yisroel was impossible to get. That is not the case in Crown Heights.

    Jewish Babysitter
    Guest
    Jewish Babysitter

    I did this for over a dozen years. I’m still in touch with the families I helped raise, and am enjoying nachas from their next generations! If you are serious, hang a sign in the Shuls. State that you want an orthodox, legal (on the books) babysitter who will love your children and raise them as she would her own. You can deduct the child care expenses from your taxes. She can qualify for reduced cost insurance and tax benefits for low income wage earners, and possibly qualify for affordable housing. There are MANY Jewish women who are trying desperately… Read more »

    Incredibly Sad
    Guest
    Incredibly Sad

    So many of these comments are incredibly sad. What a chillul Hashem to speak about fellow human beings this way. Talking about ‘goyim’ in the way many do in these comments is no better than the anti-Semitic comments people make about Jews. They are both speaking about the ‘other’ is suspicious, wary or even hateful terms simply because they seem foreign or unfamiliar. A nanny watching children being raised in a religion different than her own may have made a simple mistake. These are not grounds for speaking about those who nanny Jewish children but are not Jewish themselves with… Read more »

    comment to goyishkeit post
    Guest
    comment to goyishkeit post

    your “staring at a goy” comment is disturbing. What if the goyim are decent and caring humans.This does not make them coarse, thinking like you may though.

    children buying for themselves
    Guest
    children buying for themselves

    was in the same Family Dollar on Lag B’Omer and saw 3 lubavitcher boys around 11 or 12 yrs old buying hershey’s white chocolate. i did not have the gumption to question them – i rationalized that perhaps it is with their parent’s blessing. i regret that i didn’t speak up. 11-year-olds are children and should be told specifically what they may and may not do by their parents

    to 124
    Guest
    to 124

    I agree on principle about speaking to and about everyone with respect, regardless of religion, level of observance, etc, etc Children do pick up everything. The fact that children pick up everything is a double edged sword. My own children, now adults, have told me many things that they observed and internalized without my telling them. Some examples are: that I always treat help (Jewish and non-Jewish) with respect, offer a drink, pay an extra dollar, etc Also, that their chinuch was important, and noticed when I would try to work with a teacher or situation that needed attention. It… Read more »

    No, what's incredibly sad...
    Guest
    No, what's incredibly sad...

    …is to realize from these comments that there are people already at level 3. What do I mean? See Rashi in today’s Chitas, Vayikra 26:15: “[First, a person] does not learn [the Torah]; then, he [subsequently] does not fulfill [the commandments]; he then despises others who do [fulfill them]…” So here we have commenters who (1) haven’t learned about the importance of Cholov Yisroel (or even the details of when Reb Moshe did and didn’t say that there is a heter); (2) don’t keep this halachah themselves; and now (3) mock and despise those who do (“get over yourselves” and… Read more »

    Only Cholov Yisrael
    Guest
    Only Cholov Yisrael

    We grew up on ONLY CHOLOV YISRAEL.
    When there was non we lived on water and kool-aid.
    Today my parents are shepping full Nachas from all their children.
    Watch what your kids eat, It has a huge effect on their bodies and soul.
    You are what you eat!!!

    oyy gevalt
    Guest
    oyy gevalt

    I’ve seen this so many times

    cold winter
    Guest
    cold winter

    You a hundred percent right but I personally would ignore this and tell the parent go dini you did this the right way I hope that others learn how to talk to other people but the sad reality is that other people won’t learn how to

    bottom line
    Guest
    bottom line

    If a person in my community sees something that MIGHT matter to me, I hope they would not be afraid, and they would say something. It is my choice to act on it, or ignore it

    To all
    Guest
    To all

    I agree this story was hashgacha pratis but on the other hand ( not this story) maybe the eleven year old kids (to number 126) parents let them eat that so maybe don’t but in there business I eat only Cholov Yisroel but a bunch of people don’t so how about you take care of ur children’s babysitters and Nannys or whatever and other people will take care of there’s ( no pun intended to anyone) thank you

    Again and again
    Guest
    Again and again

    Again and again the same problem: it’s time to make clear and diference between chasidim Chabad, (ליובאוויטשער חסידים) and “chabadnikim” that want to be part of a ‘Chabad community’ of friends and family, davenen Tehilas Hashem Siddur, appreciate the Rebbe, and that’s it.(not opening a seifer the all week, goishe hanochos, and light frumkait). The נפקא מינה: obviously in subjects like this: tznius(not needed to explanations…) , kashrus (cholov isroel, chasidishe Shechito, hashgochos), chinuch of your childrens and differences in the Schools, and so on. Our job is to be a דוגמא of what the Rebbe want from us, and… Read more »

    @119
    Guest
    @119

    Lol. Don’t complain about others when you yourself just used the term”goyim”. In case you are not aware, the real issue is not the other person’s race. This is a matter of religious obligation. We are obligated to feed our children only the highest quality kosher food (Nathan’s kosher anyone?). To teach them to say Brachos. To protect them from fraternizing with people they are not allowed to, but may end up wanting, to marry! Yes, Even if they are only 6. We are not permitted to marry a non-Jew, no matter how upright and honorable s/he may be. So… Read more »

    suggestion - treat non-kosher food as an allergy
    Guest
    suggestion - treat non-kosher food as an allergy

    Unfortunately, not all mothers can stay at home and must work. As a suggestion, treat non kosher food as you would a severe food allergy. Tell the nanny that the children can only eat food from your home and have food prepared for them for the nanny to give them. It may be a little more work on the mothers part, but then you can be assured your children are only eating kosher food, or in terms of a mother who prepares food for her allergic child, your child is only eating his or her “safe” food.

    #124
    Guest
    #124

    I agree with you it is sad how a lot of these people on these boards are talking about other people because they are of a different race, and if someone does something to a Yid in Crown heights people say he is Antisemit, And I am not talking about the lady that seen the nanny give the kids some ice cream

    To 64
    Guest
    To 64

    Agree a 100 percent!!!!!

    Let it go.
    Guest
    Let it go.

    Good grief. Mistakes happen. No one is going to die from an accidental mistake. It’s not like she went out and bought bacon cheeseburgers. She was taking them for a treat. Come on.

    @119
    Guest
    @119

    Lol. Don’t complain about others when you yourself just used the term”goyim”. In case you are not aware, the real issue is not the other person’s race. This is a matter of religious obligation. We are obligated to feed our children only the highest quality kosher food (Nathan’s kosher anyone?). To teach them to say Brachos. To protect them from fraternizing with people they are not allowed to, but may end up wanting, to marry! Yes, Even if they are only 6. We are not permitted to marry a non-Jew, no matter how upright and honorable s/he may be. So… Read more »

    Chalav stam is not treif
    Guest
    Chalav stam is not treif

    We will never know from this story if it was treif or chalav stam or if the parents cared either way. Whether they were CH parents or just visiting. Whatever the case the writer saw a problem and politely fixed it and everyone was happy. The baby sitter seemed like a kind woman too. Alls well that ends well.

    Oh please
    Guest
    Oh please

    Raised a family with chalav Yisrael,no TV, Lubavitch schita, only kosher books and animals and love for the Rebbe.
    No one is Chabad now.
    Only two are observant.
    Maybe you people need to stop being so judgemental.
    And start actually living with true Ahavas Yisrael.

    What goes around
    Guest
    What goes around

    One thing to consider is that the children will feel entitled to entrust you to the tender mercies of a “caregiver”. Without my zadie’s wife’s eagle eye this smiling woman would have “taken care” of zadie permanently. Maaseh bechol yom.

    #139 it is exactly like a bacon cheeseburger
    Guest
    #139 it is exactly like a bacon cheeseburger

    And one day the child may shmad because he once ate treif, or even “just” cholov akum (which IS treif).

    Am horatzus
    Guest
    Am horatzus

    1. There is no basis for supposing the ice cream was kosher, according to any opinion. 2. If you rely on reading ingredients, and sites like kashrut.org, you are eating treif. 3. Cholov akum IS treif. Even if we are certain the milk came from a cow, it is just as treif as chicken parmesan. 4. There is no such thing as “cholov stam”. It is a made up term, and contrary to #91 it was not make up by any “gedolei doros kodmim”. It doesn’t exist. There is only cholov yisroel and cholov akum. 5. There are various poskim… Read more »

    cold winter
    Guest
    cold winter

    Let’s make sure that what comes out of our mouth is as kosher as what we eat I would not trust my kids life with some of the people here stop being frum on someone else dime put your money where your frumkeit is stop making us pay for it live and let others live

    Get a grip
    Guest
    Get a grip

    There is nothing treif about Pizza Hut. If you see nanny with a few lubavitch kids being fed at Pizza Hut, don’t butt in because flour, tomato sauce and cheese arent treif. So long as no pepperoni, pizza is kosher b’dieved (only steam of issur) so don’t butt in and embarrass nanny. (Sarcasm intended). We’re not talking about measuring how big issue is. We’re talking about when you see a child being tainted spiritually by a non parent, you intervene. Let’s assume the neshomo of every Lubavitch child is allergic to anything that goes against their rebbes standards.

    haoros
    Guest
    haoros

    no 5 – kashrut.org is not a reliable site. And people have standards which are higher re cholov ysiroel etc.
    no 18 – it may well have been a geze family
    no 24 – it’s not kosher in our community
    no 145 no 6 – not entirely true, I asked a rov who gives a hechsher to non-CY and even though they hold of Reb Moshe’s heter he said we keep CY as issur not chumra so need to kasher

    Description of Babysitter, please
    Guest
    Description of Babysitter, please

    Hi Dini,
    Could you please email me a description of this babysitter and children? I would just like confirmation that this wasn’t my nanny. How many children was she with? My email address is: [email protected].

    Thank you very much.
    Bluma Dukesz

    SOME USEFULL ADVICE
    Guest
    SOME USEFULL ADVICE

    There are a lot of comments on this page so I doubt anyone will read this… Anyways everyone bashing #5 will not do much good for the world, even though what 5 said was wrong Rather it would be much more use to ask #5 as well as anyone else out there who (no offence) dosnt know very much about kashrus to please not state “facts” about kashrus because it could lead to people acting on these “facts” and inadvertently eating traif. Perhaps leave this duty to kashrus authority’s or at least people with simcha. Everyone has cursed you out… Read more »

    Chill out
    Guest
    Chill out

    People, calm down. The nanny made an honest mistake, and the woman did the right thing by pointing out the mistake to her. There was no negative consequence whatsoever. Really no need to bash goyim and debate the evils of Chalav Akum.

    And while we’re promoting chalav yisroel and not using an eruv, let’s also work on not talking during davening, not davening obscenely late, not speaking lashon hara, and being more accepting of other sects of Orthodox Judaism. Even if they are ! not Chabad.

    114!!! SPOT ON!!!!
    Guest
    114!!! SPOT ON!!!!

    Unbelievable how people will shop around for the psak that suits them best in each area! HILARIOUS- I GOT SUCH A GOOD LAUGH THERE!!!! There’s a whole crowd of people who don’t actually want to be frum but I guess feel they have to because of pressure from others? (From who though- they have each other for support!) So instead they find ways to lighten the frum “burden” in every way they can. Cholov stam because Rav Moshe allowed it, Eruv because they have it in other places. LOL!!!!!

    My Heart Hurts
    Guest
    My Heart Hurts

    As the comments have poured in over the past two days, I have found myself unable to turn away. This is a grisly trainwreck, the unleashing of a collective id that makes me cry for Crown Heights. From one kind lady’s reminder to make sure we’re on the same page as our nannies, we’ve devolved into every possible squabble and worse… Working vs. stay at home mothers, as though everyone has a choice… A kashrus discussion that immediately devolved into who’s frum enough to live here, as though giving the matter thought in the first place doesn’t set us all… Read more »

    #148, yes true.
    Guest
    #148, yes true.

    I *said* we keep CY as issur not chumra. We don’t hold like R Moshe, or the Pri Chodosh, so we consider OU-D to be treif. And if it is inadvertently cooked in our keilim we have to kasher them. Nevertheless, when eating at the home of a Jew who does follow those opinions, his keilim do NOT need kashering. We may lechatchila eat pareve or cholov yisroel food cooked in his milchike keilim, in which he cooked OU-D that we consider treif. That is the halocho in Shulchon Oruch. As I said, a lot of Lubavitchers seem not to… Read more »

    #150, the Alter Rebbe's shulchon oruch is not relevant here
    Guest
    #150, the Alter Rebbe's shulchon oruch is not relevant here

    The Alter Rebbe’s shulchon oruch does not deal with this subject at all. “If you open up the alter rebbes shulchon oruch and learn what he writes about cholov akum” it will take you no time at all, because he doens’t write anything about it.

    #146, are you aware whom you're quoting?
    Guest
    #146, are you aware whom you're quoting?

    “It is not what goes into the mouth that defiles a person, but what comes out.”

    This does not come from a kosher source.

    to #150
    Guest
    to #150

    I am #55 and I posted several clearly-stated reasons why relying on the ingredient list is not an acceptable method of determining kashrus of a product. No, I am not a rov, but if any rov reading my post wishes to correct me I am all ears.

    158
    Guest
    158

    What’s the big deal? If you hiring non Jewish babysitters, to save some extra money you have to pay the consequences. This is America not Israel. They are kids I don’t think God would punish the kids or babysitter. I prefer my babysitter giving my kids non kosher ice cream as a treat, Then finding out she has beaten my child. Like so many cases I’ve seen on the news.

    You should all be ashamed
    Guest
    You should all be ashamed

    I’m sad to say my non-Jewish nanny was a better person than most of you sound like. The way you speak about other humans is disgusting. And FYI, having a Jewish nanny doesn’t automatically mean your kids are better off. You have good and bad people in all cultures and religions. And further FYI, a Jewish nanny wouldn’t “just” be a couple dollars more, it would be almost double the price! I looked into this. And any Jew you hire would also be too high and mighty to help around the house, so you’re basically paying double for half the… Read more »

    Chalav Akum
    Guest
    Chalav Akum

    I just do not understand, how Jews could behave this way. Where is your אהבת ישראל? you speak this “holier than thou” language and you think you’re frum??!! Have you spoken any Lashon Hora lately? Why don’t you look at yourselves before judging others? Who are you to decide which actions are “Lubavitch” and which aren’t? You speak as if cholov stam/Akum is not kosher, have a little respect! Most RELIGIOUS Jews eat and drink חלב סתם. So look at yourself and ask, am I living up to how I’m judging others?

    Sincerely,
    A caring Jew

    X