By Sruly
Learning never ends. Except, the school year at Yeshivos did practically end last week. It’s not because of a late winter weather storm, the outbreak of the Omicron variant, or some teacher’s strike.
It’s possible that the hanhala of the yeshivas don’t announce it and the parents don’t know it, but every bochur knows it – summer begins on Yud Shevat.
Why? because that is when the camps begin recruiting their staff members – counselors, learning teachers, kitchen staff, lifeguards, etc. – for the summer season.
And once that happens, you can feel the energy shifting in the Zal. All the chatter is about who was selected to go here, the plans of a particular head staffer, and possible changes to a program.
The gemara is there in front of us, yet our heads are elsewhere. The maggid shiur is explaining the opening Mishnah, and all we’re thinking about is opening day.
I understand why the camps rush to get it done – they want the best summer, and for that, they need the best staff before someone else snatches that bochur. Each camp wants to be competitive.
So the race begins on Yud Shevat (although some occasionally and secretly break that unwritten rule). Our parents pay tuition for the Elul to Tammuz school year. In reality, summer begins in Shevat.
What I don’t understand is how the hanhalah allows this mess to happen.
They don’t want it, our parents don’t want it (they pay tuition for Elul-Tammuz), and we the bochurim don’t want it either!
Before you dismiss this as an op-ed by a bochur who loves learning, let me tell you that I chat plenty with my chavrusa and enjoy the off days when we get them. I also enjoy my sanity and this race for the summer creates madness. Just like parents wanting to sign up their kids, we too worry about being accepted and rejected.
So I don’t know what the best solution is. Maybe hanhalas should agree upon a set date (Pesach Sheini? Lag Baomer?) when recruiting for camps will officially start. If everyone agrees to it, there won’t be snatching away staff members and we will be able to have another few quiet months of learning – and peace.
And if all hanhalahs can’t get together to agree on this, maybe just one of them will put their foot down and then everyone will follow.
Thank You for expressing your thoughts. You bring a valid point. Why are we burdening our young with who can get the better job, where , how.And then on top of then on top of that the ones who are selected to be head counselors need to be busy recruiting staff. What are we promoting here?
Lets band together to push the date later so the boys have some peace of mind.
#brunoy #chofadar
As many of the commenters have noted, the “camp phase” lasts only two weeks in yeshiva, after which the bachurim return to their yeshiva routine. It’s true, the head staff from the various mainstream camps are usually quick to select their group of staff. If so, one may ask, what’s the article saying? How does yeshiva “end” on yud shevat if it returns to normal very soon afterward? I think implicit in the article is a much larger issue. Granted many bachurim (and presumably girls) find their camps easily and quickly. But each year, more and more bachurim are unable… Read more »
It lasts more the 2 weeks and after that yeshiva is basically over
Are you seriously suggesting that camps just ceases to exist (at least in their current, two-month format) because some yeshiva kids are harmed by the anxiety caused by camps?
By the same token, because some people who want to become teachers but can’t find teaching positions, we should shut down schools. Do better buddy
It may be 2 weeks, but then the frenzy for Purim and then Pesach mivtzoim takes over. It’s very hard to focus on the present.
Im not sure who this article is speaking to The good bouchrim who learn all day get accepted to camps right away Most of them dont even apply they get asked to go and they take the job right away The bad bouchrim whos actions speak for themselves dont get in to camp right away or at all And yes they spend hours of seder speaking about camp But they dont learn anyway So no one loses out the ones that learn learn anyway and the ones that dont now have something to speak about I dont get the big… Read more »
There are some moderate bachurim
Girls camps started from the beginning of shvat, sometimes earlier. It’s hard to run a good camp and takes a lot of planning, it takes time, if you don’t want to be thinking about camp this early maybe go on merkos shluches or be fine with a subpar camp experience.
Schools start applications around purim, it’s logical that camps start 2 months earlier, especially considering the logistical challenges of hiring/running a camp are much more complex then accepting bachurim.
Bochurim literally spend more time thinking about their summer plans then who they are going to marry and spend the rest of their life with
Reality is, their mother decided for them who they’ll marry so why should they think about it? Make them more insane? More sanity in summer plans then marriage
Don’t think anyone has EVER said it more real than you.
Nough said
Ye, that’s true.
I went out with a Bochur for a while, and he kept on pushing off the proposal, and after a while I confronted him about it and he said it’s because he was busy with camp.
That baffled me.
I once had to turn down a guy because he was to obsessed with his camp, and I thought if this what he prioritize then he is not for me.
Must say I dodged a bullet there
Sad but in some cases true
Right after pesach this was going on. Like 10 – 15 years ago. Then it backed up to purim. Now it’s yud shevat… good luck where its heading next if someone doesnt do something to stop this. Now for the sake of your sanity: you do your hishtadlus and let Hashem take care of the rest. Where you are meant to be, you will be there regardless. To drive your mind insane “to be the first” might even become a miserable summer. where as being “the last minute job acceptance”, might be a memorable summer that you’ll always remember. remember… Read more »
stop kvetching and go back to learning
Figure out which camp you are going to and move on
why does it have to be an ongoing kerfuffle?
Can you try to understand what some one else is saying ? maybe try asking around if this is a real problem before just dismissing.
There’s someone who can’t get out of their own head.
I was I. Yeshiva 20 years ago when this all started after pesach. The pressure was on. That’s all you thought about all day. Moving it back to yud shevat is criminal.
I guess the camp directors think that yeshiva is just a place where bochrim go to wait between camps becuase camps can’t run all year.
The full time learning schedule doesn’t work for all bochurim, many thrive off this kind of healthy, chassidish fun and excitement.
For some in fact, it’s exactly this that keeps their sanity intact through months of 15 hr days of learning.
Then there are the camps who need time to prepare a good program.
Like others said, you can always do something else with your summer, but try to keep other people’s reality in mind.
He’s not talking about the planning of programs trips activities teams themes and other fun exciting stuff.
He’s talking about the hopes dashed as kids battle to get a position that accords them the desired social status, all while making, breaking, and shaking groups -switching that guy for the other character and keeping it a secret from him who we don’t want in our group…
All of this is exacerbated and stretched to painful lengths when the topic is brought up irresponsibly early.
Now reread the article.
I also want to add the following. The night of yud shvat I asked my Shiur Daled brother what their program was for the following day. He told me they didn’t have to be in school until late afternoon. How ridiculous is that? Of all days, on yud shvat, the bochurim shouldn’t be together? (They were supposed to daven in 770 and find a ride to the ohel)
School?!?! ok?!?! I’m in Shiur Daled and I think we’re old enough to understand that yud shvat is a very holy day I mean I think 🤔
You’re in Shiur daled aye?
I wouldn’t advertise the possession of a non yeshiva compliant device, If I were you…
Why is that your business
Believe it or not @Mr. S, collive is accessible via a computer…
Thanks mom
It’s a lost battle
Btw not all Shiur daled bochrim dorm
Some of them sleep at home now if you have a problem with them having a computer in their home that’s one thing but in general plz think before u talk thx
It sounds like someone doesn’t have what to do for the summer
Oh, I’m sorry “mr evrething was handed to me on a gold platter” maybe try to understand that not everyone is able to get a summer job with the limited space that there is! There is only so meny shlichus and overnight/day camp job opportunities, and thats being filled up by MULTIPLE grades of boys! Let me make the most plain and simple breakdown i can for your insensitive not understand brain: the usual boys grade has approximately 700+ people, for staff and and shlichus opportunities, now we are talking about 6 grades here!!! (From masivta till shiur daled zal,… Read more »
Allow me to start off by saying that what happens every year is a complete and total catastrophe, and every Bochur knows it. But with that said, there’s some points to consider. 1) Facts is, Bochurim are nervous to get into camps, and for good reason. Every year there are a bunch of good bochurim who don’t get into camp because they either weren’t invited to a group or didn’t take initiative early enough to get themselves in. Don’t make it sound like there’s nothing to run for, the reality is that mathematically there are just not enough spots for… Read more »
This is so true, smartest comment I’ve read so far, the only point I’ll add, is that there for to be more achdus between bachurim and camps in order for things to be less distracting
At least like this bachurim who didn’t get accepted to a larger camp have time to figure something else out and not be stuck last minute. As well as smaller camps get a chance to find bachurim as well.
a bochur’s focus should be on yeshiva, regardless of the situation.
so starting later will help both the bochur, that cant figure his group out, or that bochur that can.
I am a parent that has a few children in the camp age . I agree , the entire January and February are consumed with camp . It take a toll on parents and kids . This year some girls camp decided to change that but other camps did not follow . It can only work if all camps together make a later date for sign up .
It would bring a lot of peace into many homes .
And will bring blessing to your camps .
The funny thing is, that creating a later start date to the recruiting is not just better for Yeshivos and bochurim, it’s better for the camp directors. Speak to any staff director and they will tell you that they will gladly start registration later if they only can, why can’t they? Because other camps start so they can’t be the last to join the hunt. But it is possible to change this equation, if all camp directors jointly agree to a later start date then the boys can have a few more days of sanity. The girls camps did it… Read more »
The Rebbe spoke over and over about the stupidity of the 2 months summer vacation
Yeshivahs should just keep their school year over the summer
There has been many mesivtas that have done this, and you can ask every hanola member aa well as the bouchrim and they will all agree that this is the best decision they have made in there yeshiva.
Not true at all
#bait shemesh
You mis the whole vort
That’s the kavana
Really you should speak about it the whole year
Preparations for the shlichus
If others agree, I will agree
Which camp are you?
Yeshivas kayitz Mississippi
What age group is that for
same here
My high school daughter has already been working on camp for over a month. Our group has five girls, they only need four. Another group applied there already, where else can we try? She’s very stressed over it. I know summer plans will be finalized soon…..just in time for production practice to start!
School? What’s that?
and what about when the camp directors string the girls along for weeks and then say sorry we took last years counsellor.
A hundred percent. Hanhala could stop this madness
Every year Yeshivos request and push that hiring of staff wait till after pesach or later, yet each year head counselors receive calls and messages from Hanholla member at the beginning of Shevat begging them to start accepting staff! The reason is simple, the head counselors need to be hired in Teves so they can start planning and working on camp, once head staff are confirmed and word spreads (as it always somehow does) Bochurim already fully immerse themselves in camp talk, at that point the quickest way to finish it and allow Bochurim to learn again is by accepting… Read more »
I was the a head Counsler last year, and I 100 percent agree, it took over my job in yeshiva way too early. I hope this actually makes a difference, and stops the madness
Bochurim are always looking for distractions. It’s just a part of life in yeshiva. If an interesting guy walks into zal or something out of the norm happens during seder at least 50% of heads will look up (and that’s being generous). Saying that camps should start hiring and prep for the summer at pesach sheini is like saying that Sunday lag baomer parades should start being prepared on Friday afternoon. It’s just not practical. Overnight camps (especially the big ones) are a huge operation that require months of prep not only by the head staff. Besides, even if an… Read more »
The reality as it is…
“Why is it that we have all of these interesting JLI courses for people who are not yet frum but for bochurim in Yeshiva, we are still teaching the same way as we were 100 years ago?! I believe that if learning was being taught in a more interactive and interesting manner, this problem – along with many others – would be easily solved.”
In brunya we didn’t have this issue.
That’s because they have yeshiva through the summer. The only zals that do that are in brunoy, LA, and the new zal in Nyack. Everywhere else still has the problem.
we had the issue for 1 of the 2 years…
The kids need something to look forward to.
Maybe rabbi bistritzky , rabbi Gershon Avtzon and other inspiring , young that understand can help with this ? Please hear the pain in the letter ! Let’s act !
I 100% agree.
Very hard for me to focus on my learning after getting offered so many jobs.
What you are saying is true.
instead of trying to fix the system, figure out a way to make it work for you, yes there is an issue, but practically it’s not going to get fixed.
There is no reason That you need it to occupy half your year, you can decide what you’re doing and go back to learning.
Hatzlach
Hey Sruly don’t worry, I have a great opening for you with a great group, just speak to me during lunch break and I’ll give you all the details.
Hey *Sruly’s* friend,
I wanted to come over during lunch break but you somehow always seemed distracted and busy.
When I finally cornered you during breakfast the next day you just mumbled something vague and didn’t really tell me all the details.
It’s ok, I understand when I’m not wanted. Maybe I’ll just go to some sub-par day camp or somewhere. Maybe I’ll go visit my uncle in Montreal. Or maybe I’ll just stay home for two long months of Camp Gan Netflix.
Twas nice knowing you.
Your classmate, Sam (formerly Shmuly)
You’re smart, self aware and have a great sense of humor. I hope this system doesn’t chew you up and spit you out. Would be a terrible waste.
Signed, former reject
There are bigger problems with the yeshiva system then this tiny little issue of camps. The yeshiva system needs many many fixes.
Fix #1 – giving out unreasonable knasim isn’t going to encourage bochurim to be happy and involved in Yeshiva
How big was your kenas and what was it for lol
$200 for missing seder
….spoke out against financial knasim. There was an excellent article in the Nshei Journal quoting the F’R about this topic. Somehow the hanhalos and Rebbeim missed this directive – or are selective in following our Rebbe’s advice.
Y’know the Rebbe, more than once, encouraged hanhalla to give kenasim.
The Frierdiker Rebbe was against giving bachurim non-sefarim prizes for excelling in Yeshiva. Regarding that, i’ve never heard, “Somehow the hanhalos and Rebbeim missed this directive – or are selective in following our Rebbe’s advice.” (Btw, yeshivos do give prizes because, again, the rebbe recommended it.)
And making ridiculous rules to favor 1 bocher and not another
This goes on by Chitrik as well, but even earlier. Chanukah time the head counselors of the elite camps are secretly picked. Then head staff are secretly picked. The stress and anxiety of the entire drama is so unfair!
Giiiiiiirrl you so right we also have that problem. Bochurim think they have all the problems, we have problems to. You think it’s easy trying to get into chitrik. I answered that I was a knife when they asked if you were a kitchen utensil what would you be, and they said I am really sharp. Like I get the joke but accept me. So to all the bochurs out there thinking, oy all these camp problems you should really remember the shidduch crisis.
I rest my case
Ya girl
Liba
Thank you so much for your beautiful comment I really think your making a really important point here, we go in as knifes and come out as spoons I really appreciate your support. I’m thinking about making a support group to discuss these issues I really think boys are out of touch with realty with all these camps m
This is just a result of the bigger issue. The real issue is the Bochurim are not involved in yeshiva and therefore whenever there’s anything exciting It occupies a bochers day, If you were actually interested in learning you can stop for a little bit to figure out your summer and once it’s figured out go back to learning there is no reason why after people are excepted they need to spend the next six months thinking about it.
THERE IS NO PRESSURE FROM CAMP.
Yes there pressure.
I am a head counselor, and if you try to push me off, we will find someone else.
These tiny Bochurim don’t scare me.
I am also a head counselor and THERE IS NO PRESSURE FROM CAMP
You are confused. There is very good pressure. You’re probably just head counselor of some dinky camp…
the Rebbe’s counselors!!!
2 issues wont make the first not an issue.
I couldn’t agree more about the fact that yeshivas every year get destroyed by the “camp talk.” Parents pay thousands for there sons to go to yeshiva, and the entire system must change. When a boucher reaches shuir daled as soon as the camp talk pauses the shlichus conversation starts. It goes the entire year without prevail. Even the best kids the ones who learn all day get dragged into these conversations. There mind isn’t set because they are worried about next year and the future. On behave of bouchrim that have been through this its time to change this.… Read more »
I applaud the writer of this article for attempting to stop camp talk in yeshiva by having everyone talk about whether we should be talking about camp or not.
Tomorrow morning Zal is assured to be talking about this article instead of camp
thats one day of talking not from yud shvat till the end of yeshiva.
Seems like there are many underlying (or overlying) points involved. Maybe this can be a learning and growing experience too. There’s responsibility to do one thing now and there’s another thing competitive and exciting (or disappointing) upcoming. How to have the two co-exist? That’s a life skill to be learned. That’s part of growing into a mature adult It’s certainly not impossible or unrealistic to learn diligently, keep seder, while planning for and being excited about something ahead. Time management. Organizational skill. Discipline. Being present… C’mon. Dig a little deeper. Your mind can straddle lots. It’s going to have to… Read more »
BE PRESENT.
Camps should pay staff more
what else?
The reason why we think so early about camp is because yeshiva is boring
And long
All I’m saying is that when I called up Brunoy to speak to staff, they were more than happy to agree to come. Yes it’s true this is the best camp in the world, but still.. I thought I was getting Chassidishe Bochurim. From the fact that they agreed so fast shows that in truth it can’t be that bad what they did.
I rest my case.
Last year when I called brunoy they did not want to talk about camp till purim!
They decided to be chasidish on other people’s cheshbon.
Every year the directors are putting in months of work to ensure the kids have a fun and chasidishe summer and there’s no reason a few bochorim who think they know better have to give them a hard time!
I’ve personally been rejected from a camp this I can tell you that the stress that it’s putting on my learning is terrible its not easy to learn under these circumstances
As a half mom I would like to kol hakavod
As the other half I agree
Well then kol hakavod, we will all understand and support you
Bochrim have to get them self together or they will frie out
U should become a Rosh yeshiva
U confirm and u forget about. I think this bochur doesn’t have friends
Sorry
I think you should work on your self before telling others what to do and it sounds like you don’t like your hanhala
It’s crazy that there is so much politics regarding camp. What is this, a seminary?!?
Obviously you were that type of person who stayed home for the whole summer…..
I’m was general in BOG War for 3 summers in a row. I’ve been head counselor for 3 years now. Don’t mess with me…
I’m unstoppable
Thanks for the article, love the entertainment, really sparked a conversation keep these articles going 🙂
You guys should stop trying to be super cool and go to a real yeshiva
the entire year of yeshiva consists of after tishrei to rosh chodesh kislev after thay there is always a farbrengen, program or yom tov coming up
Why are so many bouchrim on col?
You need a better job
Legendary Mashgiach!!!! I am coming to your yeshiva
I am a bochur currently, and it is disgusting what the camps do to us. They make us fight to get in, and once you actually get in and waste half your year, they treat you like garbage. I think all Bochurim should go on a strike against all camps and demand that they treat us better. Also all camp recruiting should be in Elul, so by Tishrei everyone is done with the camp conversation, and can start actually learning.
The bochrim are bored they will talk about camp all year anyways,bochrim! Do u think there where camps back in stalengrad???!!!! What kind of stupidity is this?!
To be honest though learning never started😬😬
Maybe for you. If you were a little serious about yeshivah you would learn Gemara for once!
Rabbi yosef klein has made fighting the summer craziness his life’s work. He began with opening a real LEARNING PROGRAM for kids (see tzeireihatmimim.com), and now in his own yeshiva he is not sending his call bochrim to any camp!!! This guy has guts and his head screwed on straight. Listen here, REB YOSEF is the solution!!!
Most kids don’t speak yidish today. So it’s not really addressing the issue For regular lubavitch kid’s.
Is his yeshiva in Nyack also in Yiddish? I would be surprised, since yidish is basically obsolete, and he wouldn’t get registration.
Last year a bochur in zal started a petition and got everyone to sign, that they wouldn’t talk about camp until after Purim at least
Col keep it coming!!!! Thx for giving us bochrim the time of our lives!!!! On such a boring night
The Bochurim who learn are still going to learn, and the bochurim who bullshove are just coming up with excuses to justify their bull shoving. Camp discussions only happen at the bein on Friday and during the breaks throughout the day. Grow up. Learn during Seder, and move on. Stop with all the drama and excuses that it’s hard to learn while everyone discusses camp. Believe in G-d, wrote to the Rebbe, and maybe you’ll end up where you’re supposed to be this summer.
Tell me you’ve never been a yeshiva Bochur without telling me you’ve never been a yeshiva Bochur
This is a very stupid article. Bachurim that are serious and want to learn will learn either way, and bachurim that will talk stupidity during seder will just be talking about camp now this doesn’t affect anyone I can say this from firsthand experience.
So true thank you!
My question is that if you think you are standing with all other bochrim your wrong we love to shmuz and your that guy that sits in the back with your books and is like wait one second I didn’t apply to camp you need to stop putting words in to other bochrims mouth
One point I would like to add: The problem is real everyone knows, and those that ignore it just comes back to haunt them, now pushing off the staff recruiting date is not gonna fix the problem, instead of this happening now it will happen in 1/2 months we have to find a permanent solution, for example: The camp directors speak to the hanhola and THEY choose which Bochur should be able to go to that camp and the group will not be made by bochurim but by hanhola, the advantage is clear 1) the bochurim would get more involved… Read more »
It should be like bochur shlichus (and in fact that’s what it really is).
Sirusly “sruly'”?
You known that’s not the problem,
No one that actually wants to learn talks about camp, (besides the week of yud shvat)
The problem is that your looking for an excuse to tell the mashgiach why you’re not learning, there’s no problem if you’re having a hard time focusing during seder, it’s normal, but don’t blame it on camps, and there’s definitely no need to share this with the entire lubavitch.
shiur daled thanks you very much for the entertainment
I really think it’s important for me to put it out there I’m not in shuir daled I’m in semicha thank you
The first year Rabbi Moshe Lazar wanted to open camp he came with the idea to the Rebbe and the Rebbe told him “now is the time of learning, after Pesach we’ll talk” (obviously paraphrasing).
The above was about opening camp how much more so for hiring staff there is absolutely no need to hire staff before Pesach! Nothing about planning camp revolves around the counselors and learning teachers.
And to all those unsmart comments that you get hired and move on we both know that camp is going to be on your head for the next 4 moths.
Wow so to whichever bochur that said THC is the reason why camps are interrupting learning at mainstream yeshivas rather then more relaxed yeshivas, then they can’t come with complaints why some people are accepted as counselors whilst others only as canteen staff, so if you would spend time during zman learning rather then affiliating yourselves with higher positions, you will have a higher chance of succeeding with yeshiva.
Why are there so many comments from bochurim? Do they have access to smart phones in yeshiva? If yes, that’s a disgrace to what tomchei temimim is all about. A bocher should be totally involved in learning. Have a 5 minute conversation about where you going for camp and then MOVE ON. If this comments is too much for bocherim to handle maybe you should look into going to a more suitable yeshiva for your standards like the half day learning programs instead of sitting there a full day claiming to be a “good” mainstream bocher who literally can’t open… Read more »
Agreed this whole camp thing should start later don’t tell me that camp needs time to figure out who their staff are if it literally takes 2 weeks from when it open until it closes it just makes more sense if it would open during pesach break that why there no distraction at all because buchrim are anyways sitting at home bored spacing out on whatapp so then would be a perfect time for them to do something. And even if head staff are picked by Teves people won’t start thinking about it if they know they can’t get in… Read more »
I have been out of yeshiva for several years now. However this was happening in my days talking 8+ years ago.
Why do camps pay 100 dollars month to staff I still don’t get it
Sounds like you look at camp as a job. the rebbes employees don’t need a paycheck. It’s there as a little tip from the director.
your right you dont need a paycheck but the rebbe never asked the directors to treat there staff like garbage
Bc your doing Shlichus and you don’t really need money at this age they say…
While this discussion may be fun, I would like to put one thing out there. The shlichus of buchrim, especially those too young for merkoz shlichus, is to inspire the rebbes children in (affiliated) Gan Yisroels. To write an op-Ed bashing the hanhala and buchrim for not getting in the way of the excitement of fulfilling this holy task is mind blowing. The only reason buchrim are in yeshiva is in order to prepare to give yourself over to the rebbes initiatives and in turn to the rebbe himself. To imply that discussing the ultimate goal of why we are… Read more »
Would just like to put it out there- that this is a universal issue!
But a point I would like to make that may not be the focus but is important- a chassidishe yom tov!?!?
What would the Alter Rebbe say had he heard that his yartzheit was a day spent in stress and strife. Yud shvat is a day celebrating ahavas yisroel- wait till yud beis.
Thank you for listening:)
The Rabbonim she make a Psak that camp registration can only open after Pesach.
Any camp that negates this psak will not be approved by the Rabbonim. Sorted.
These days the problem is as bad as it gets with camps in yeshiva we think it will be better but when we get to camp the mikvah is worst
Every bochur must learn the Sicha about Hatzlocho in Zman (Chof Shvat 5730 – Toras Menachem volume 59 page 186). The mashpiim should farbreng about it, since it is very much applicable to each bochur on a very practical level in many areas. After Yud Shvat Hagodol (Moshiach Sefer Torah), a large group of orchim from Eretz Yisroel, who were leaving back home on 20 Shvat, came to daven Mincha with the Rebbe before they went to the airport. Unexpectedly the Rebbe announced that there will be a Farbrengen right after Mincha. The Rebbe said a Maamar (with a nigun)… Read more »
There’s a reason ספר המאמרים קיץ ת”ש begins with a מאמר in אדר.
I feel you. It’s certainly a challenge. I have no idea whether it makes sense to change things or not because a lot depends on what this early planning means to camps, and then it become a values judgement, but as a yeshiva alumnus I think I can say the following: Learning doesn’t actually end in the yeshiva after shvat or nissan. There are bochurim who still learn and learn until the final bell. Sure it becomes harder as the year goes on, and no doubt the increasing distractions play a role in that, but also the reality is that… Read more »
I’m a massive masmid but my friends are a bunch of ammei haratzim, so when they all got positions in camp while I was forced to be an assistant waiter…. Whatever is an assistant waiter?!?!?!?? Hashem yerachaim!!!!
This was absolutely an issue when I was in Yeshiva, and while there is a minority of bochurim who desperately need something to cling to out of yeshiva (because yeshiva doesn’t actually work for them and they are unhappy, but that’s a separate issue) This puts pressure on even the most focused bochurim. It’s not a 2-week phase as some commentators suggested, it’s more like 2 months. When I was in Yeshiva in London which stays open until tisha b’av and bochurim only do local day camps for 2 weeks, the fact is there was no disruption in the winter… Read more »
Camp talk is saving all those bochurim (that are having a hard time) from talking about what they usually talk about so I belive camp should start cheshvan time
High school girls have been planning since Rosh chodesh Kislev. Shvat is pretty good tbh
Amazed of the superb bochorim vacbulery!!
(especially the comments:))
I think camp should just start right after pesach and that would solve everything.
Genius!!!
Like say following sports.
between baseball and football it covers a whole year and many bochorim at least when I was in zal waisted away their year talking about sports and not learning jack didly squat.
I think this is a bigger issue but it seems I’m outnumbered here so I could be wrong
I think we need more travel programs in Israel for both bochurim and girls this way people won’t be so excited about going to work in the summer in camp and instead will be going to do something holy in the summer like touring Israel
Just because we know Hebrew better doesn’t mean we can’t work in an American camp #unjustice #helpnow #gan Yisroel montreal