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Wednesday, 14 Tammuz, 5779
  |  July 17, 2019

    Investigating ‘Ahavas Yisroel Shul’

    Following the heated (and partially misinformed) discussion about Chevra Ahavas Yisroel in Crown Heights, COLlive sent blogger Mottel to speak with R' Chezzi Denebeim and write his impressions. Full Story, Photos

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    mechitza
    Guest
    mechitza

    i will state this. for all the criticism the shul has received regarding it’s mechitza, i must say, it is better and more “kosher” then 90% of the chabad house mechitza’s i have visited throughout the states and beyond. who amongst us have not seen those home depot tree’s spread 4 feet apart from each other not to mention the sparse leaves on their branches.
    live and let live.

    Wow!
    Guest
    Wow!

    Amazing! Much to think about.

    well written!
    Guest
    well written!

    Thank you! Hopefully that will put the “issue” to rest.

    I agree with Motel's analysis
    Guest
    I agree with Motel's analysis

    For whatever reason this shul felt a need to form, as long as they don’t separate themselves from the community and seek to be part of the overall community, but this holy space allows them to feel comfortable then I say go for it. Don’t criticize, if you don’t want to go there, then don’t no one is forcing you to go or not to go, you could even stay home if you want or need to.

    This controversy started...
    Guest
    This controversy started...

    with a hostile article by Yael.

    Every action gets a reaction.

    Stop crying for the hostility you receive, if you start the hostilities with an article mocking others, once you have done that, you cant cry anymore.

    If live in a glass house, in other words, dont throw stones.

    Like
    Guest
    Like

    I wonder if it could have been less condescending. Virtually calling the previous contributor an idiot. Not very “ahavas yisroel” stylez.

    kriah
    Guest
    kriah

    I know there are plenty of chabad houses that do it, but there are serious problems with having the amud and bimah in front of the shul where both men and women see it.

    Our Rabbe’s
    Guest
    Our Rabbe’s

    This article brings up vary valid and true points.

    There no new age Chabad. Chabad Lubavitch was crafted by our Rabbe’s with sweat and blood, its Minhogim, Nigunim and everything that goes along with it are part and parcel of who we are.

    go mottel
    Guest
    go mottel

    this is a great response. the shul is doing more for the disenfranchised than those criticizing it. more needs to be done within chabad to make sure all of the members of the community are feeling welcomed. members of our crown heights community do need to be better about ahavas yisroel and making their own children feel welcomed and apart of the community

    ....
    Guest
    ....

    Where there is smoke there’s fire.

    to #1 you dont get it
    Guest
    to #1 you dont get it

    CH is not the place for your typical “Chabad House”. A Chabad House is a special situation. Why do we have to bring and sanctify the tumah of the world to our neighbourhood ?? ps I have no problem w/ the mechitza

    To chezzy
    Guest
    To chezzy

    You know when I walked by the shul on shabbos day and seen all the pepole davening there yes some of The people look different yes you guys sing different but to see how many people men and woman in shul that would not be in shul because maybe they don’t feel in place there ………but now to see so many people in shul it’s all worth it keep up the good work

    The shul is not the issue
    Guest
    The shul is not the issue

    The issue is that people need this type of thing. This is like a Chabad House of CH. As long as its run al pi halocho [which depends on the people in charge: yerei shomayim, married and doing this for others and not for themselves ie they mustnt be too comfy in that shul] then I dont see the problem. As long as no unmarried people go there, obviously. And, even more importantly, no kids. And also nobody that would be going to another shul anyways.
    PS remember yarmulkas and shawls at the door.

    Finally
    Guest
    Finally

    Finally something worth reading.

    !!
    Guest
    !!

    Chezzzh Mine Tiere Gezh Brother
    I Love you

    anon
    Guest
    anon

    thank you for the explanations. never was a fire here to begin with.

    Pinchus Ben Elozer Ben Ahron Hakohen
    Guest
    Pinchus Ben Elozer Ben Ahron Hakohen

    Dear Mottel, Bravo! Although I disagreed with your last Op-Ed ( I am sure that your opinion of Basil has now changed due to the ny times article, in which Baisil’s owner clearly describes his goal as; “trying to influence the community”.) I cant praise you enough for this beautiful piece. You were right on target. If what you write about CAY is indeed correct, than I am in agreement with your conclusion there as well. I for one, am happy and encouraged to see the outcry from the community about the CAY “rumors”. Although the allegations were unfounded, It… Read more »

    Agree with # 1
    Guest
    Agree with # 1

    Almost every sliach’s shul I have ever visited would not meet the standard the “complainer” subjects the ahavas yisruel shul to. Further, outside of C.H., only in Argentina did I ever come across some form of mechitzah during kiddush (Kudos to Rabbi Shlomo Levy Shlit”a).

    To me the issue is simple. Some local rabbi is losing congregants to ahavas yisruel and to retaliate resorts to creating this machloikes.

    well said!
    Guest
    well said!

    wow! you can see this was written with sensitivity yet it was able to bring the main point out clearly without hurting people!

    change the LOCATION
    Guest
    change the LOCATION

    Yes, I think this shul is a great idea.

    However, the location (Albany & Union) is NOT the right location for a shul, especially Friday night/Motzei Shabbos.
    Please be sensitive to others.

    Wishing you much succes!

    To #13, #18 and everyone who is concerned
    Guest
    To #13, #18 and everyone who is concerned

    Crown Heights is not necessarily the blame for all the problems in Chabad today. For all you now, many of those children walking in the streets and are not portraying how Lubavitch should look are actually “tzeirei hashluchim” The real problem is those modern and “cool” Shluchim who in the name of Chabad are doing whatever they want in the name of “outreach”… Yes they do it all to be mekarev yidden vechulu… however, our children who hang out by them for shlichus see the double standards and observe They see the double standards at home – the constant chase… Read more »

    Sholom is duch miner!!!!!!
    Guest
    Sholom is duch miner!!!!!!

    Chezzie,
    keep it up you are doing amazing work!

    One thing they have
    Guest
    One thing they have

    is that they are non judgmental whereas in other parts of CH you feel the judgmental-ness to quibble about their mechitza, whose has the right to get the measuring stick out. do you take one out when you go to a chabad house? of course not! their dress: some ppl come to 770 dressed kind of interesting…what should we do? i have been frum for a long time now, and am so tired of the lack of ahavas yisroel – i mean real AY, you know, the genuine stuff. The Rabbi seems to be attracting a genuine crowd. Leave ’em… Read more »

    no speaking in shul....
    Guest
    no speaking in shul....

    How many other shuls in CH can claim that?????

    to num 21
    Guest
    to num 21

    gut gezogt. couldnt have said it better. and yes, u should continue

    Chezzi!
    Guest
    Chezzi!

    If someone is against you, it means you are doing something good! so keep on!!!!

    Women singing ?
    Guest
    Women singing ?

    Beautifully well written but you have been hoodwinked.
    The good Rabbi failed to mention that his female congregants sing along to the Carlebach -and other- songs. That goes clearly aging normative orthodox practices.

    shul rebbetzen
    Guest
    shul rebbetzen

    Bronya Schaffer for Rebbetzen!

    shul rebbetzen
    Guest
    shul rebbetzen

    OH OOPS Rebbetzen is the shul’s rabbis wife so Bronya Schaffer for womens MASHPIA!

    to 27
    Guest
    to 27

    1. Did you ever visit the shul and you are comfertably stating what is going on there? because if you, you were just moitzi shem ra and loshon harah!

    2. Learn halacha. There is nothing wrong with women singing! Women are allowed to sing in davening to Avrohom Fried songs! The only issue is that men should not listen. If the men are singing Adon Olam they cannot hear the women singing it at the same time.

    change location
    Guest
    change location

    Where do you think most mikvahs around the world were and are still? Attached to the shul, or on shul grounds.

    To Number 18
    Guest
    To Number 18

    What are you talking about?!
    I’ve been to many Chabad House Shuls in England and they all have Mechitzas for Kiddush. Edgware, Golders Green, Bournemouth . . . to name a few

    to 21
    Guest
    to 21

    please continue

    my only issue with the shul
    Guest
    my only issue with the shul

    union and albany on friday nights and motzei shabboos has become a hang-out corner with friends waitng to meet up walkig to shul / home from havdallah..

    I doubt ppl realized it when opening a shul there, but iyh they should outgrow this spot and move for good reasons!

    Everyone - Get out of CH
    Guest
    Everyone - Get out of CH

    After living in CH for a few years I hesitantly moved to a different community – (a normal community, if I may add) – located less then two hours from CH. It has been six years and I do not regret one minute of being away. I highly suggest people considered doing the same – move! CH is really a screwed up place. I further suggest that the entire Ahavas Yisroel Shul consider doing the same: move to a new community where you will be warmly accepted and embraced – not ostracized and rejected by those who claim to follow… Read more »

    RE: Mrs. Shaffer
    Guest
    RE: Mrs. Shaffer

    Bronya has done so more to educate inspire and guide crown heights women and girls than the “rebbetzins” that are known for the expertise – pointing out how long my skirt or how not long my shirt sleeves are

    Yasher Koach
    Guest
    Yasher Koach

    Powerful answer. Woww.

    21 is right on the ball
    Guest
    21 is right on the ball

    a nice amount of shluchim today would be embarrassed if the rebbe walked into their chabad house
    as long as they can call us farmers and peasants and then come to fundraise by the same people they are busy criticizing and making fun of

    @ 30
    Guest
    @ 30

    Your first point seems to be claiming that the women are not singing, your second points seems to be saying that they are singing but that it is ok…
    I am sorry to tell you that it is NOT OK for women to be singing in Shul, even if the men are singing along at the same time, judging from the set up of the shul i find it very difficult that all the men sitting near the Mechitza wont hear the women singing.

    to number 20
    Guest
    to number 20

    find them a place to go and they would gladly do so. You don’t think Chezzy is trying to find a new place? Really? Come on, man.

    The Dark Side of Shlomo Carlebach
    Guest
    The Dark Side of Shlomo Carlebach

    Was Sholomo Carlebach really Orthodox? Everyone sins sometimes and it is stated that Ein Tzadik Beolam Asher Yaaseh Tov Veloy Yechta, so the fact that anyone ever sinned, is not enough to say that he does not qualify to call himslef and Orthodox Jew. However, if someone makes a Shitah out of doing sins belketently as a matter of a premeditated and consistant offical plan, I think we all agree that in such a case, such a person can’t call himslef Orthodox and neither can any Shul in C.H. if they follow his ways of even if they idolise his… Read more »

    A hangout...under
    Guest
    A hangout...under

    Mottel, i enjoyed reading your well written article, but you have not truly “investigated” CAY, you have taken the Rabbis claims as the real facts. The fact is the place has become a hangout. One told me he goes there to meet people. Now if this guy was interested in Shidduchim, i would sort of look the other way, G-D knows the current system isn’t working (different topic…). But this guy isn’t, he is going purely for the hangout, and that has no place in CH. @ 18, I cant begin to tell you how wrong you are. The concept… Read more »

    To # 17
    Guest
    To # 17

    Dear #17, A few small corrections: 1) “I for one, am happy and encouraged to see the outcry from the community about the CAY “rumors”. Correction; there is no community here. There’s just a bunch of squabbling half wits. Unfortunately no community at all. 2) “there are still people that care about a breach in our way of life” Correction; those speaking up don’t in fact care at all. f they did care they would do something about. Something real and concrete. Two good examples of the opposite would be picketing and writing comments on a website. 3) “are willing… Read more »

    hmmmmmmm
    Guest
    hmmmmmmm

    the location is a real issue though….

    go Chezy!
    Guest
    go Chezy!

    when the chassidim were starting out they heard a lot of this stuff as well, though not online…..

    sam
    Guest
    sam

    im sure chezzi is a great guy, but after reading comments from other related article etc, just bc ur parents are shluchim and ur gezhe etc doesnt make what u do right. oh ps, i know a guy named barry gurary

    Like it
    Guest
    Like it

    # 21 your comments about SOME shluchim are so to the point. Where I live, (big town, Lubavitch schools) the most modern girls in the school are the ones who travel in from surrounding Chabad houses! Very loose homes. Please explain this to me. Why are they out there sacrificing their kids who are allowed to pick up every goyishkeit from frei kids they’re supposed to be reaching out to! Article beautifully written. Excellent points. Slightly disturbe by reference to any non Chabad music… R’Aaharon of karlin was holy of holies and many karliner niggunim are his compositions. Your comment… Read more »

    # 23
    Guest
    # 23

    No one said the congregants weren’t nice…they might have been very caring and sweet but not necessarily Chassidish in Hanhaga. So while it’s important to be nice, our Chassidishe Hanhaga is of utmost importance. Don’t know the people attending but just a comment on yours.

    yasher koach #21
    Guest
    yasher koach #21

    Thank you #38 I believe today having a chabad house is not for hashem, torah, or jews anymore . it’s only for some people to do besiness.it becomes like mafia and it is not good only if rebbe was here. most of shluchim are loaded with money but when want to make a gym or a hall for their community they come to crown heights for money what a chutzpa. Our schools dont have enough money to pay to their teachers why shlucim dont pay our schools didnt they come out of these yeshivas after all?

    dear # 21
    Guest
    dear # 21

    you’re stepping on thin ice, man. “al tigu b’mshichoy”. the shluchim are anointed by the Rebbe. just because you’re eating your heart out for not heeding the Rebbe’s call to “conquer”, do not project your self hate on the the Shluchim or their children. They haven’t wronged you in any way. Instead, do this: go and help somebody in need. Shlichus doesn’t necessarily mean you have to live on another continent. You can do it right here in crown heights. Also, please refrain from using the term “our children”. You end up sounding like the following type of comments: “Oh,… Read more »

    #8
    Guest
    #8

    #8 very accurate and correct

    #21
    Guest
    #21

    I AGREE WITH YOU 100%.
    All concerned parents:
    Just like the Chabad Houses check pout your children if they are “good quality” so too, you MUST check put the shluchim.
    Ask basic questions, like do you always serve cholov yisroel and lubavitch shechita, will my children have to arranf\ge and sit in at mixed college student programs, does the shlucha cover elbows and knees, is there a TV in the house.
    I AM NOT EXAGGERATING, I AM TALKING FROM PAINFUL EXPERIENCES.

    We must know halacha
    Guest
    We must know halacha

    It’s nice to be strict and have separate seating for kiddushim and shiurim but this is clearly not halachicly required. This being the case, the original writers point of view that “if you are not comfortable here, don’t come” is valid. If you want to hear nussach they way it was sung in Nevel go to 770. The idea that Crown Heights is somehow holier then any other place is simply not true anymore. Time to wake up and face reality!

    Bais Shmuel member
    Guest
    Bais Shmuel member

    Chezzi.
    we support you 100% VER NISHT NISPOEL.

    #46
    Guest
    #46

    where and when did Chezzi ever mention anything about himself being “Gezhe” or “son of a Shliach”?

    why are there people still making these senseless comments? why?

    location
    Guest
    location

    I agree with # 20. The location is a real problem. The mikvah is right on that corner and that becomes a spot for people to hang out and wait for others before or after shul.
    I’m sure that Chezzy is looking for a new spot, but until something else should be done. I don’t think it is tznius.

    @ 45
    Guest
    @ 45

    When the reform started out they also got “lots of this stuff”, guess what, the critics were right then and they are right now. I am not trying to compare CAY to the reform, but when we allow one breach in our community’s standards there is no telling where it will end. Perhaps 15-20 years ago, if we would have all shouted and kicked up a storm when the first clean shaven, non tznius, jean wearing FFB Crown Heights’er first appeared on the scene, then we would be in a much better matzav now. Yes, we would have turned a… Read more »

    To # 35
    Guest
    To # 35

    Creedmoor is about 2 hours away. What’s YOUR definition of “normal”. A person is a mirror.

    move it!!!
    Guest
    move it!!!

    Albany & Union…right by the ladies’ mikvah. Not appropriate, most men know not to walk home from Shul that way if they can avoid it, & they should walk on the other side of the street.

    What do the Rabbonim say about this? It is potentially very embarrassing.

    shloime freundlich
    Guest
    shloime freundlich

    “In Germany they came first for the Communists, and I didn’t speak up because I wasn’t a Communist. Then they came for the Jews, and I didn’t speak up because I wasn’t a Jew. Then they came for the trade unionists, and I didn’t speak up because I wasn’t a trade unionist. Then they came for the Catholics, and I didn’t speak up because I was a Protestant. Then they came for me, and by that time no one was left to speak up.” — by Martin Niemöller, prominent German anti-Nazi theologian and Lutheran pastor, best known as the author… Read more »

    another example of salacious blogging
    Guest
    another example of salacious blogging

    sometimes confused with actual journalism. an important part of contemporary education is the basic understanding that because it is published does not make it true. the old dictum that the only honest statement in a newspaper is its price on the front. even this is no longer true.

    46 IS VERY RIGHT!
    Guest
    46 IS VERY RIGHT!

    JUST DO WHATS RIGHT ALREADY!!!! and move the bimah!!!

    Solomon Schechter vs Zalman Schechter
    Guest
    Solomon Schechter vs Zalman Schechter

    Dear writer, THIS PART, I BELIEVE, MAY BE INCORRECT: In any event, even if Carlebach had been a born Lubavitcher, his background would be meaningless – Solomon Schechter, a renowned scholar and theologian, whose theory of Catholic Israel has been the driving force of Conservative Judaism for over a century was indeed a “Chabad born” Jew – his Hebrew name was Schneur Zalman.]

    The famous Schneur Zalman Schechter now in Colorado is NOT the Solomon Schechter of Conservative Judaism Movement

    the  real shlomo
    Guest
    the real shlomo

    #41, you are right on
    and u dont have to google “the dark side of shlomo carlebach”, just googling “shlomo carlebach” will give ou the same results..

    I love CAY
    Guest
    I love CAY

    FINALLY!!! A shul more controversal then Bais Shmuel. I love CAY , I wait all week for Shabbos so I can join in on the beautiful davening. My life is so enhanced by this shul, a place where the lastest fashions and the highest heels make no difference. Lots and lots of luck to this beautiful little haven

    Women singing
    Guest
    Women singing

    In EVERY shul in CH, women sing along at certain points, including 770. Learn Halacha….

    TOTALLY AGREE WITH # 41
    Guest
    TOTALLY AGREE WITH # 41

    TOTALLY AGREE WITH #41

    still luvit
    Guest
    still luvit

    to anyone who suggests that the shul find another place – don’t break, build. if you have a place to offer fine. if not, your comment is less than worthless. the problem is in the design of the mikva not everyone around it. maybe I shouldn’t buy a house nearby? IF you think there must be privcay (on a public street corner of a street and avenue) make the entrace and exit in the alley. don’t cordon off the area. and as others have said, many shuls have mikvas. and on the general topic of the shul and its minhagim… Read more »

    To # 21
    Guest
    To # 21

    yasher koach, emes sounds like a shliach in la going after tv stars american idols

    Go sima!
    Guest
    Go sima!

    Your awesome!!!!

    #21
    Guest
    #21

    Please do not continue! You’ll only spread salt on our wounds…

    posts on the internet are proof?
    Guest
    posts on the internet are proof?

    Rebbe Shlomo Carlebach ZT”L was a tzadik. The lies told about him on the internet are completely unfounded. How can you take things posted on the internet as proof to anything? I and many people who knew him personally for many years have seen that he had no taivos at all, and never did any aveira.

    to 50
    Guest
    to 50

    seems to me like #21 is a shliach himself who is true to himself and is hurting of what is going on

    chevli moshiach
    Guest
    chevli moshiach

    the labor has started

    Mottel, kol hakovod....
    Guest
    Mottel, kol hakovod....

    Well written.
    Logical.
    Nicely toned.
    Smart.
    Informed.
    Addressing the real issue.
    The Rebbe is very proud of your response.
    “If people, born within, and currently associated with, the Chabad tradition do not treasure what the rebbeim have given us – then we must find a way to make it meaningful and relevant to their lives”.

    Perfectly stated. THAT is our issue, not CAY or beis shmuel.

    Love it.

    Thank you for taking the time to write it, and thank you collive for posting it.

    to #13
    Guest
    to #13

    Whats wrong with single people going to shul??
    Are we supposed to sit at home until we get married Why cant
    we have a place to belong to

    Mottel
    Guest
    Mottel

    -Pinchus: I’m glad we see eye to eye on something -47: I don’t have a problem with other niggunim – in fact I find Kah Echsof of the Karliner to be particularly geshmak. That being said, it is a bit of a problem if our own are not drawn in by our own paths of spiritual enlightenment. -63: You’re confusing Solomon Schechter – born in 1847 to a Chabad family in Romania and the future president of the Jewish Theological Seminary – with Zalman M. Schachter-Shalomi – Born to a non-Chabad family, a student of R’ Zalmen Schneerson in Vichy,… Read more »

    to 72- Shlomo Carlebach was a WHAT?!
    Guest
    to 72- Shlomo Carlebach was a WHAT?!

    Shlomo Carlebach was a Tzaddik to you, and he was a molester to so many others. You can’t deny facts. A woman commented on the last article, testifying to his being… uh.. overly friendly to her when she was a 14 yr old in LA, becoming frum. People have turned his image into a god, especially posthumously, awed by his charisma, afraid to FACE THE FACTS. And what kind of tzaddik is the first “Orthodox” Rabbi to give smicha to women, lets them lein from the Torah, sings chazzanus with them, and hugs the ladies very affectionately? Why would the… Read more »

    @74
    Guest
    @74

    I sure hope that the labor is long underway.. and that we are at the birth!

    A cutting corners Shul!!
    Guest
    A cutting corners Shul!!

    This Shul started off with cutting a number of corners.
    To mention a few:

    Women singing.
    Bima half way on women’s side.
    No Mechitzah at kiddushim and shiurim.
    Just to mention a few. Im happy to hear the Rabbonim got mixed in before its to late.

    Teshuvah is always accepted.

    to my dear bro Chezzi...
    Guest
    to my dear bro Chezzi...

    You are an inspiration to us all.
    If this ain’t nachas, I don’t know what is.
    We will support you forever and I think you’re doing the people of crown heights a true chesed. This is something they all need there, BADLY!!

    To the people who make nasty comments about shluchim, you should be ashamed of yourselves. You’re just jealous. You wouldn’t have a clue what kind of privilege it is.

    Chezzi is a warm, intelligent, chassidishe and amazing guy who’s extremely talented.

    I wish him much success with this shul and it should only grow by leaps and bounds.

    kol hakavod!

    to # 13
    Guest
    to # 13

    no kids? 🙁
    wa wa kids r fun! 🙂 we like shul!!

    GO DenebeimS!!!
    Guest
    GO DenebeimS!!!

    GO DenebeimS!!!
    YOIUR FANS FROM THE NORTH LEFT COAST

    Beautiful!
    Guest
    Beautiful!

    Beautiful! Now move the shul to williamsburgh!! I’m sure it would fit right into the village!

    SHLOIME FREUNDLICH
    Guest
    SHLOIME FREUNDLICH

    To 65 if KAY can do for single girls what Bais Shmuel did for Yungerlight and guys my self included, it will be amazing .Bais Shmuel changed the paradigm made going to Shul cool go to a chassidishe farbrengen as hip as going to a night club

    to 21 38 47
    Guest
    to 21 38 47

    it seems like you have no idea what shlichus is.
    just b/c some shluchims act like many many ch kids it doesnt mean there is anything wrong with shlichus. granted, we have issues in this community. it is not caused by shluchim being “bad examples” most shluchim are on shlichus, not chasing money and fame (even the most well connected shluchim have trouble putting bread on the table, the money goes to peulos, not themselves)

    To #63
    Guest
    To #63

    Both Solomen and Zalman Schecter were born to a Chabad Family.

    shulcha
    Guest
    shulcha

    Rabbi shlomo carlebach was a great teacher and friend > he opened the door to chassisdus to me> my husband , a shliach had to sign a contract that he could never associate with shlomo or else he would be fired. the person who had him sign the contract is a person revered in lubavitch who himself engaged in criminal activites, but no one cared to stop him..We in lubavitch have ,beautiful niggunim,but the shuls dont sing them. I live out of town and would daven in chabad shuls here if there was any singing or spirit but there is… Read more »

    to # 35
    Guest
    to # 35

    Kan Tziva Hashem es Habrocha, that’s what the Rebbe said about Crown Heights. Your descriptions just reflect your dark side…

    Mottel- Read this!
    Guest
    Mottel- Read this!

    You have talent! Well written!

    One comment:

    You focus on what Chabad is. Its not a Chabad issue, or a Hiskashrus one. Its a Halacha issue. It just happens to be plp who are officially Lubavitchers. However the issues at hand Shulchan Aruch ones.

    INSIDE INFO
    Guest
    INSIDE INFO

    I happen to know inside info on story, which I heard from one of the Mashpiyim: The Rabbanim did not just believe the rumors. They actually sent respectable residents to Daven at CAY. They acted as Shluchei Beis Din to give over Eidus (testimony) on what is takeh going on there. Both Rabbonim worked together on it. They did not put out (to date) an Issur on Shul. Instead they called in the members and voiced their concerns to them directly. Boruch Hashem, it seems that CAY is trying to work together with the Rabbonim (at this point). The first… Read more »

    anyone know where one can donate?
    Guest
    anyone know where one can donate?

    I would like to make a donation to further the mission of this shul -any website or paypal?

    HUH!!!!!!
    Guest
    HUH!!!!!!

    THAT TINY PLACE HOUSED 80 PEOPLE…. WHERE IS ROOM FOR A BIMAH? i dont think anyone in the couple hundred opinions on this matter even once mentioned that SC clearly stayed away from calling himself chabad! much like the matisyahu of today, SC distanced himself from lubavitch so as not to make “a lubavitcher in a santa costume”. singing his sons however is a different matter. I’ll leave it up to the rest of u to argue about!

    Well written
    Guest
    Well written

    So nice to see the English language used the way it aught to be!

    This synagogue sounds fantastic!
    Guest
    This synagogue sounds fantastic!

    This synagogue is just what the youth and adults of today need. A special Rabbi who is taking an interest in them and not lumping them together with everyone else. This synagogue will probably give the people who go a breath of fresh air and a new lease of life.

    A Shaliach
    Guest
    A Shaliach

    I am so fed up of hearing about how much money shluchim have. A *few* shluchim and a *few* mosdos have the big bucks but the vast majority – and I write this a shaliach and speaking fo rother shluchim I know in my area – struggle financially. They have the added cost of sending kids abroad, higher cost of simchas where kosher catering is hard to come by, importing everything judaica, cost of online school, you name it. Believe me it is NOT easy. Neither is CH but it’s a bit like saying everyone in CH has a late-model… Read more »

    Zalman Shechter
    Guest
    Zalman Shechter

    Still goes by the name Reb Zalman. No relation to solomo schachter.

    Kol Hakavod
    Guest
    Kol Hakavod

    Mottel has written an excellent op ed here. Both his English and his content are terrific. Let us give credit to Chezzi and Sima for reaching out to the young people in our community who need inspiration.

    shloime freundlich
    Guest
    shloime freundlich

    May be the Rabbanim can send Shluchei Beis Din to Crown Heghts houses of ill repute

    To Mottel
    Guest
    To Mottel

    I’m a little confused by your op-ed. Is your intention that the shul be respectful of the Rabbonim’s opinion regarding chassidishkeit and chabad (respecting the sanctity of our community as a whole?) Or that CAY remain a community unto themselves, enfranchising a segment of our community, and respect only halachik opinions of the Rabbonim?

    Please clarify.

    to 88 - shlucha?
    Guest
    to 88 - shlucha?

    First of all, I do hope you don’t write with that English on your Shlichus… Secondly, no one is denying that Shlomo Carlebach opened your husband’s eyes to the beauty of Chassidus… he definitely gets credit for that. But don’t whitewash a known PREDATOR and MOLESTER! That his Niggunim touch the heart.. Lehavdil there are some beautiful Catholic hymns that are also very “feel-good” , spiritual and touch the heart… do you really want to connect your Neshama with someone who, as a previous commenter posted : And what kind of tzaddik is the first “Orthodox” Rabbi to give smicha… Read more »

    kshot atzmecha
    Guest
    kshot atzmecha

    after a lengthy piece on upholding traditions, etc. I noticed that the author begins by addressing a woman using her first name! Quite shocked – pretty sure that earlier gens would never do such a thing and certainly not in public.

    Everyone is invited
    Guest
    Everyone is invited

    Anyone using the Mikvah at night may have missed Maariv so they are all invited to daven at our shull either before or after the Mikvah.

    Hangouts are good for CH security
    Guest
    Hangouts are good for CH security

    Instead of criticizing the shul for being in that location, think about how great it is to have such a big hangout on this corner.

    The added attention also ads security which is better than being on such a dead corner that it requires a police car all the time.

    Point
    Guest
    Point

    Is this arrogant?
    If people feel detached from chassidus and the Anash community, the lacking is on us, not on them!

    To #42
    Guest
    To #42

    You’re too funny…Every shul has people whose sole purpose of coming to shul is to meet people. Nothing new here. That’s not a reason to close a shul.

    IS IT A CHICKEN ...OR IS IT A FISH..?
    Guest
    IS IT A CHICKEN ...OR IS IT A FISH..?

    The way of Chochma(intellect), means it rules over the heart.(love,desire) Call it Chabad, but it sounds like the desire is to to be bittul ( submit to) to another path . Not to criticize another path, only to clarify .

    respectfuly disagrees
    Guest
    respectfuly disagrees

    The Op-Ed was very well written. However, I believe your missing the point. Most people I’ve spoken with who have issues with the Shul are not necessarily aware of the specifics as to where the bima is, how high the mechitza is or exactly which song they sing. Nor do they claim to be experts on Halacha. If that were the case than your clarification that it complies with Halacha would suffice. I think the main issue (with many other new shuls as well) is that it facilitates the lowering of standards for the whole neighborhood and that’s why it… Read more »

    #88 "shlucha" quote unquote.
    Guest
    #88 "shlucha" quote unquote.

    .you mean halacha doesn’t touch their souls? I don’t know what kind of a shlucha you are, if you think there’s something wrong with halachic Judaism. Chassidus isn’t an alternative to halacha.

    Too flowery
    Guest
    Too flowery

    The article was well-intetioned and made a good point- to those who actually took the time to analyze the above ‘tome’. However, it would have been much more likely to get the attention of the average reader of it was less wordy and more concise.

    #108 100% Correct!!!
    Guest
    #108 100% Correct!!!

    #108 COULD NOT SAY IT BETTER!!!!

    YASHER KOACH!

    To #41
    Guest
    To #41

    It’s amazing how you’re able to write a lengthy and seemingly coherent comment, while completely and utterly missing the point. To quote: “But when a new congregation in C.H. seeks to idolise or emulate or somehow “look up to” someone like Shlomo Carlebach, then they are forcing all of C.H. to bring up the inevitable (what we would have prefered not to talk about), the Dark Side and the Shamefull side, of the Non-Frum part of him. ” CAY does not in any way “emulate” “idolize” or “look up” to Shlomo Carlebach. They chose to sing a few choice Niggunim… Read more »

    Very well written!
    Guest
    Very well written!

    Where did you learn to write?
    (I don’t mean to be Choished you Ch’v but did you perhaps go to collage)?

    TO #85, SHLOIME F
    Guest
    TO #85, SHLOIME F

    I AM A BAAL TESHUVA AND I AM SHOCKED!!!!!!!!!!! Going to shul is NOT supposed to be “cool” or like “going to a night club!” I wanted to get away from that stuff because it’s a great feeling that lasted only some nights when I went out..and the rest of me felt so empty. If you feel that way then when you leave shul you will take nothing home! I actually ate at your house before and I am know being cool is fun..but it is not the greatset thing!

    to 112
    Guest
    to 112

    I am not #41, but you do know when you are singing Shlomo’s songs, you are connecting your souls- during Davening (!) to the soul of a molester, among other things.
    Enjoy.

    The Dark Side of Shlomo Carlebach
    Guest
    The Dark Side of Shlomo Carlebach

    Answer to #112 Technically speaking you could be right, in that the shull doesn’t OFFICIALY call it’s self by the name “The Shlomo Carlebach Shull” but in reality, it is the real SPIRIT of this shull which speaks far louder than any words. What the shull represents and means needs no OpEd. It’s loud and clear to anyone who walks inside and sees for themselves. As for the Singing the songs of a known non-frum person, never mind songs of a molester: What singing Carlebach songs means and what it does not mean, #112 defends it as being innocent and… Read more »

    to number 68
    Guest
    to number 68

    you are my hero in this commentary section. THANK YOU!

    To #108
    Guest
    To #108

    Your comment was great. It’s a shame that it was #108 and not an earlier number.

    Please send it to the editor as an Op-ed – you have a Gleiche Kop and your opinion needs to be heard.

    You sound like someone I know from a certain family that Daven’s in Empire Shteible – Please tell me if I’m correct.

    #116
    Guest
    #116

    How did you type so much and say NOTHING??! Talent

    mottel
    Guest
    mottel

    ביסט דו ר מאָטטעל בייַאַווער?

    put the hangout in the shul
    Guest
    put the hangout in the shul

    i am a single girl who grew up and shlichus and i am afraid of CH. I dont plan on moving there for shidduchim and visit from time to time, but never on shabbos- b/c I LIKE GOING TO SHUL. but not the ones in CH, i had recently mentioned this to a friend and she said to check out this amazing new shul. Its sounds amazing and I am really excited to attend the davaning there. to me it would be a dream to be able to feel at home in CH, maybe I would be able to understand… Read more »

    To respectfuly disagrees #108
    Guest
    To respectfuly disagrees #108

    Wow! I am so happy that I reached your comment. I have been saying this ever since Beis Shmuel opened their doors.

    There is no longer any peer pressure to conform to Chasidishe standards and like you said these new Shul’s only facilitate in pushing the lower standards in to the mainstream and therefore making it harder to raise proper Chasidishe children.

    May Hashem have Rachmonus and help us stop this madness.

    how reform started
    Guest
    how reform started

    i once heard from Rabbi Levitanksy a”h (i may be off on some of the details, perhaps someoen from his family can clarify) but certain of the toichen: when he was in the beginning of shlichus, there was a request by women to form their own minian, without men. there was no attempt to break halocho such as women leining from the torah etc. they contacted rabbi hodakov, there were different pauses in the conversation which made it clear that Rabbi Hodakov was being guided by the Rebbe as to what to say. he told them what to answer these… Read more »

    shloime freundlich
    Guest
    shloime freundlich

    to 114 hi if you ate in my home let me know who you are [email protected] dont hide your name.I did say torah and sing jewiish songs etc .I did not mean Shul needs to be like a club with same adrenaline strobe lights etc ,but to some populations Shul was out not cool for nebs etc Beis Shmulel made it cool for folk who think they are hip to be seen in shul and some of these population still think a club is cool and nevertheless still go to shul and mens ans womens events at our shul and… Read more »

    The Rebbe's tolerance being used the wrong way!!!
    Guest
    The Rebbe's tolerance being used the wrong way!!!

    The Rebbe’s tolerance is being used against him.

    In other words the Rebbe had tolerance to bring people in and closer to Yiddishkeit, now this tolerance is being used by people to get further from Yiddishkeit and lower standards. How sad.

    Donate to CAY
    Guest
    Donate to CAY

    For those who asked how they can donate to CAY, it can be done in 2 easy ways:

    1) Send a check to
    Chevra Ahavas Yisroel
    c/o Rabbi Chezzi Denebeim
    1516 Union Street 3b
    Brooklyn, NY 11213

    2) Use this link to donate via paypal:
    https://www.paypal.com/cgi-bin/webscr?cmd=_s-xclick&hosted_button_id=36HNKZFWUA6TY

    #108 WOW Unbeleivable
    Guest
    #108 WOW Unbeleivable

    #108 GOOD FOR YOU, AT LEAST SOMEONE HAS IT CLEAR.

    shloime freundlich
    Guest
    shloime freundlich

    to 122 who are you to judge standards who are you to define lower or higher who are you to say that when Beis Shmul has a farbergen on each Chadshia yomtov that is not a higer standards even if some guys round the table have jeans on some with kapote and jeans who are you to judge the heart in Cong BS guys strive t be better the dont think they are holyer then thou how mant “Chasidshe shuls” had a tank go out all hannkha we gave out hunndeds of hannkha kits in below 000 cold I had… Read more »

    donations
    Guest
    donations

    i think you can donate on their facebook page.
    search chevra ahavas yisroel.

    to 118
    Guest
    to 118

    Yes. I’m glad you understsand my point whether you agree with me or not.

    THE PICTURES ARE REVEALING
    Guest
    THE PICTURES ARE REVEALING

    Take a good look at the above pictures of Shul.
    You will notice that the Amud for the chazan is half way in the women’s side.
    It even looks like the Bima is as well.

    Even in a Young Israel there are higher standards.

    Can the members of CAY please comment as to which real Rov they consult with on Shul issues.

    shloime freundlich
    Guest
    shloime freundlich

    most of the memers of CAY are women ,they where not given the right to vote for a Rov

    Melbourne
    Guest
    Melbourne

    Melbourne has a similar minyan called “DaMinyan” which is hosted by the main Chabad moisad & indeed is moving to a new building on the grounds of the Chabad school, Yeshivah College.

    We need this Shul
    Guest
    We need this Shul

    Concerning the location: Even though I live around the corner, this is the first I have heard about that block being a hangout. That is surprising, given the proximity to the mikvah. It’d important that women walking to and from the mikvah have the necessary privacy. Perhaps the addition of a shul to the block will bring an atmosphere of kedusha and discourage purposeless loitering. To the person who left Crown Heights and suggested that we all leave, and that the shul relocate: There are more and more Carlebach-inspired shuls opening worldwide every day. Not all of us who live… Read more »

    cay is great
    Guest
    cay is great

    to all of the people that are writing mean, rude, nasty, or negative comments: before you start with correcting other people, why dont you work on yourselves? did you ever think that writing stuff like that about other jews is a much bigger aveira than mixed seating at a kiddush?(which they dont even have) before you try “fixing up” other people, why dont you work on yourself. work on not speaking lashon harah, or making false accusations, or just writing plain mean things. and not only that, but there is nothing to “fix up”. chevra ahavas yisrael is a wonderful… Read more »

    #94 spelling
    Guest
    #94 spelling

    You are hilarious – you write about English usage meanwhile the spelling is OUGHT!!

    136 Spelling
    Guest
    136 Spelling

    The word can be spelled both ways; aught and ought are both correct.

    Everyone Chill Out
    Guest
    Everyone Chill Out

    So they said they were expecting 30 and 80 people showed up? What is this telling us where were those ppl going before? I know a lot of the girls who don’t go to shul just because there is either no womans section and 770 really isnt the place to go daven – socializing is more the goal of the womans section there. I know since the minute i moved to crown heights i have been wanting to go shul but my options were extremely sparse. As a young single girl its uncomfortable to walk into a shul full of… Read more »

    To #133 - Correction
    Guest
    To #133 - Correction

    DaMinyan in Melbourne is very, very different to the way in which CAY has been portrayed. I believe that there is an alternative, new shule in CH that is a closer resemblance to DaMinyan. The Shule in Melbourne which most resembles the description of CAY is actually Hamayan which has a Chabad Rabbi who has the utmost respect of his mispallelim as well as the broader Chabad and Jewish community, although not under the auspices of Chabad. Hamayan has filled a void in Melbourne. It has brought people (back) to shule and is inclusive of men and women whilst adhering… Read more »

    Shmutzi
    Guest
    Shmutzi

    Chezzi, I’m sure this will get lost in the thread but I had to… After saving the chullent, saving the minyin will be nothing! This shul, simply based on the name is meant to be open and inviting, it implements a level of ahavas chessed that can not be distracted from the views of someone who was simply not comfortable with change or Carlbach. that is the type of thing causing this wedge that you are working so hard to bind! Change keeps the world going round, not that i believe there was ever intention of a lax mechitzah. Aside… Read more »

    gr8 shul
    Guest
    gr8 shul

    i was at this shul one shabbas and i have to say its amazing how they actually sing every parapgraph rather than just rushing thru it becuase everyone wants to get home to eat. it was beatiful to see that davning actually had meaning and added joy to people. gr8 job!

    Amazing shull
    Guest
    Amazing shull

    I just spent shabbat in this shull and love it.

    Perfect example of how a shull should be. Full of simcha, song and love.

    I was so looking forward to seeing positive feedback when I searched on here but in typical Jewish/frum fashion – people are having a dig and a poke.

    There is NO mechitza issue. GROW UP. STICK TO YOUR BASELESS SHULLS and let this young dynamic rabbi duet get on with it and hey – even realise that ‘ahavat Yisrael’ is more important than the alleged issues people are raising. PERSPECTIVISE!!!

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