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Tuesday, 19 Av, 5779
  |  August 20, 2019
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    Dear Heads of Seminaries

    From the COLlive inbox: A woman thanks the heads of the Chabad girls seminaries for giving her a good laugh. Full Story

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    joke
    Guest
    joke

    but somehow with all this writing about in the websites u will think the heads care. No they don’t. It just gets more ridiculous each year. Parent’s just remember: You don’t HAVE to send her. Its your choice.

    My friends didn’t go and they are doing very well.

    It is sad
    Guest
    It is sad

    and i could not have said it better!

    What a pity...
    Guest
    What a pity...

    Such bitterness

    Agree and Disagree
    Guest
    Agree and Disagree

    I agree that family divorce or marriages of siblings do not speak to the quality of the girl, but many of the questions (and the interview, and the discussion with the principal) help to narrow the field. There are not enough spots. There are too many applicants. There have to be some sort of criteria… a 10 minute interview is not sufficient to make a determination. I do not think every girl needs or wants seminary, and they should not feel they are 2nd class girls if they choose not to go. That said, I do not understand why this… Read more »

    Lol
    Guest
    Lol

    Ure awesome! Sem is a waste of money, go straight to college. Don’t waste your federal or state grants on them

    Cost
    Guest
    Cost

    Surprised you didn’t mention the $16-17,000 tuition fee !!

    agreeeddd
    Guest
    agreeeddd

    crazy!! i totally agree!!! if they only want girls with yichus, just tell schools before 22 shvat that and they’ll let them know. cuz otherwise ppl pay tickets and interviews and the results are 🙁

    u forgot one thing...
    Guest
    u forgot one thing...

    you forgot their passport numbers!! (not joking…my sem really asked)

    to 4
    Guest
    to 4

    if they are not accurate why do the seminary ask if the SIBLINGS are divorced on the applications?

    to 5
    Guest
    to 5

    well after all those questions, how exactly do you think she should feel?

    Who cares anyway?
    Guest
    Who cares anyway?

    It’s a different world. all my girls got in to the Seminary of their choice, one of my daughters in law didn’t go to Sem and they are all excellent wives, mothers, teachers, and successful. I don’t know if I would be so determined they all went to Sem today. it’s a business, a cattle market and the heads are hypocrites. Go work for a responsible, decent Shliach or get a job. You’ll achieve a lot more!

    makes it easier- surprisingly
    Guest
    makes it easier- surprisingly

    when they ask all of these seemingly crazy questions in the aplication paper, its so that once you get accepted you dont have to fill out all of the crazy government papers in a very short time limit.
    if you can go to sem- do it just to have the experience of leaving home for a year before having to be responsible for yourself.
    if you dont go- please dont spend the rest of your life rethinking your choices.
    hatzlacha to all 12th graders!

    hahahaha
    Guest
    hahahaha

    hillarious 🙂

    Great Piece
    Guest
    Great Piece

    I very rarely get through a whole op ed since they are usually waaaaay too long. This was short, funny, while bringing over a very valid point. THANK YOU!

    if you can, do it
    Guest
    if you can, do it

    I am so happy to have sent my daughters to 2 years of seminary. One away from home:good experience to be in an environment of learning and being in that mode and the 2nd year in Beis Rivkah:amazing experience. That your last chance to learn. You have a life time for college, work, etc..You won’t have another chance to learn and be imbued with chassidishkeit, torah.Good luck and if you can, make sure to go, here or elsewhere, but go and learn

    I agree
    Guest
    I agree

    everyone don’t go! then they’ll be forced to change! right now they have nothing to lose, so they simply don’t care!

    nicely said
    Guest
    nicely said

    i also had a hard time having my interview for sem. the first question was where the money and i didnt even get in -why? no clue. I dont think im that bad. i am very studious, tzniusdik responsible and respectfull..i dont know what theyr desition is based on

    Whatsapp?
    Guest
    Whatsapp?

    Whats a Whatsapp?

    Uhu
    Guest
    Uhu

    Sem is a total waste of time. Get moving on with ur life. Don’t waste ur money and time on Sem, think of ur futer. Ur marriage ur job ur friends etc. does not depend on the Sem. U went to.

    hhmmm totally not taslking about chitch.... :P
    Guest
    hhmmm totally not taslking about chitch.... :P

    right??
    lol!
    my sister had to do it to! it was hilarious! but at least she was accepted after all that 🙂

    to 12-yeah right
    Guest
    to 12-yeah right

    government documents do not inquire about such things

    To # 17
    Guest
    To # 17

    Maybe it was your spelling and writing skills?

    To #17
    Guest
    To #17

    Maybe “their decision” (note the correct spellings!) is based on grammatical & general academic ability. If you speak, behave & dress in the same way as you write, you won’t give even a half-way decent impression. Try taking some personal pride in how you present yourself, no matter the medium.

    Don't debunk seminary
    Guest
    Don't debunk seminary

    My daughter went for two years and it gave her direction to last a lifetime. Marriage, children, teaching, college all came later, in the right time.

    Correct again
    Guest
    Correct again

    Sem is just a holding ground. It is an expensive one year camp experience. we should all change the trend.

    Don't say sem is a waste of time
    Guest
    Don't say sem is a waste of time

    This is not what this op ed was about. Everyone has the right to choose whether they want to go to seminary or not. It’s not right to say it is a waste of time

    I hope it isint true
    Guest
    I hope it isint true

    is the order: 1. money 2. family name/yichus 3.personal qualities ?

    father
    Guest
    father

    we have our daughter finishing bais rivka this year we offered if she stays home ill pay for her to goto to israel paid for 2 weeks with her friends….she loves the idea i hope her freinds sign on too…this seminary thing is way out of hand it does no good for anyone…we and other parents would like to see bais rivka locally become the norm with top notch chinuch with no need to send away….
    my wife and freinds are thinking of ways to make staying in town exciting and fun…perhaps mid year to have 2 week trip somewhere ect…..

    i find this article
    Guest
    i find this article

    to be quite cynical……..

    immature
    Guest
    immature

    whoever writes that sem is a waste of time was either rejected or did not enjoy the experience which is an unusual occurence. Seminary may be overrated but the good definitely weighs out the bad and to bash hanhala like that without knowing where they are coming from shows a degree of closedmindedness and biased opinions….everyone should do what;s best for them and stop expecting everyone to fit in the same mold, whether it’s the sem mold or the college or working mold. Get over it.

    to 18
    Guest
    to 18

    whatsapp is a group text thing most people use for their families

    WHATSAPP?!
    Guest
    WHATSAPP?!

    Whoever asked that must be in Tzfat themselves

    Cousin
    Guest
    Cousin

    I have a cousin whose father passed away a while before she went to seminary and wrote so on her form. The interviewee didn’t bother to read her application and started asking about her father….

    fee
    Guest
    fee

    Don’t forget that they charge 100 dollars for these interviews,,,,and they interview so many girls. It has become a fund raiser,while putting the girls through H—,not nice.

    I Sent................
    Guest
    I Sent................

    I sent two of my daughters to a seminary in Tzfat. They had a great year very exciting and all, they saw Israel from a vantage point they’d probably never see it. and they deserved it.
    Did it add ruchnious, not sure.
    Was it worth the 20 thousand dollars a piece, certainly not, but thank G-D for scholarships!

    Bais rivkah sem rock
    Guest
    Bais rivkah sem rock

    no need to waste mony on sem,when you have no mony to marry off your kids. Go on birthright enjoy life.dont waste your parwnt money. Last but not least don’t forget about the fiscal cliff??? Don’t put money in the garbage, and let israli sem take advantage of u

    generalize, like a good lubavitcher
    Guest
    generalize, like a good lubavitcher

    I’d like to know how many seminaries ask these questions. My guess? 1 or 2 in Israel. No other sane seminary would.
    So it is your sister’s (and another 300 hopeless girls) choice to apply to such seminary. They can go anywhere else, but they decided to apply to a place in which they find the process demeaning, and they are asking for more.
    What I find funny (and sad) is that your sister would like to go to a place that has been ridiculed by her emtire family. btw, if she gets in, how can she possibly take it seriously?

    a seminary alumni
    Guest
    a seminary alumni

    I think seminary is a very important year in a girls life. Kind of like a middle step between high school and the real world. They are independant while dependant. I personally wasnt really interested in going to sem but i figured, being a chabad girl, thats what i HAVE to do. but now that i’ve finished sem, i couldnt have been more happy with my decision to go but one thing i think all seminaries need to work on is actually CARING for the girls individually and ACTUALLY taking the time to attend to their needs. you would think… Read more »

    you have been the bane of our laughter yesterday
    Guest
    you have been the bane of our laughter yesterday

    Huh?

    It's not for everyone
    Guest
    It's not for everyone

    I went to seminary this year, it was fun, but a bit overrated and not for me, I left after a short while and don’t regret it at all. I realized I was brain washed and peer pressured to go, make sure YOU want to go, not society wanting you to go…

    concerned
    Guest
    concerned

    i have 2 daughters that went to sem abroad and 2 more that will one day iy”h. It was a very grueling experience, the pressure and anxiety was intense. although they both got in I feel deeply pained for the ones that did not, even if a sibling has a bad rap it is no excuse ever person needs to be looked at for their own merits.we do not live in a perfect world. I hope that more seminaries open to give girls more options and make sems less picky.

    Hahaha lol
    Guest
    Hahaha lol

    Wtvr, the point of this article is its funny. If they want to discuss the crazy prices, they’ll write a more serious article. This is just funny. Period.

    So funny.
    Guest
    So funny.

    Sounds just like my family chat;-)

    Don't understand
    Guest
    Don't understand

    Why do they ask those questions about siblings?

    hashgocho protis!
    Guest
    hashgocho protis!

    just give a look at the end of the video on collive http://collive.com/show_news.rtx?id=23382&alias=recording-of-yechidus-released

    BAIS CHANA TZFAS THAT IS THE PLACE FOR ME.......
    Guest
    BAIS CHANA TZFAS THAT IS THE PLACE FOR ME.......

    if you had the same expereince please sing along!!!!!!!

    Boy
    Guest
    Boy

    I would be impressed by a girl who didn’t go to Sem overseas but goes to Beis Rivka CH or the like. Not just following the crowds…

    disappointment
    Guest
    disappointment

    everybody should know that some seminaries doesnt give there girls food

    BAIS CHANA TZFAS THAT IS THE PLACE FOR ME....
    Guest
    BAIS CHANA TZFAS THAT IS THE PLACE FOR ME....

    pls join along!!!!!!
    we can almost all agree that this is the #1 seminary for it really cares abt every single individual!!
    If only every yeshivah will learn from them!!

    just have to say this...
    Guest
    just have to say this...

    there are girls who had a good year. please do not think that the majority of girls feel the same way as most of these comments. I personally had a wonderful year of ruchnius and enjoyed a year of learning and growing, with a bonus of also having a good time. I’m always thankful to my seminary in Tzfas who gave me a backbone for life! The strength I got from that year and the connection to the Rebbe is still ingrained in my heart. I owe all my teachers and hanhalah more than I can express in words….

    while we at it...
    Guest
    while we at it...

    while were at it lets bash high schools. I think high schools are an even bigger waste if money than sem. 4 years = way more expensive. I didnt learn a thing. total waste of time.

    FUNNY FAMILY
    Guest
    FUNNY FAMILY

    u guys have a great sense of humor. couldnt get cornier.
    on a serious note, #49 i join along, “BAIS CHANA TZFAS THATS WHERE I WANNA BE! OH BABY!”

    Constructs
    Guest
    Constructs

    Seminary, like Bochurim Shlichus is a construct. Constructs can be changed and are changed by the winds of time. But change can be hastened if their is wide acceptance of the simple fact that these are fallible institutions and recent constructs. In the past (pre-1994 and earlier) it was accepted that not everyone went on bachurim shlichus as it was the purvey of those who fit the mold for it. Today in the search for a discipline driver in our Zal’s, the administration hangs the sad and tepid threat of a poor shlichus or no shlichus over the heads of… Read more »

    Brazil
    Guest
    Brazil

    I went to seminary in Porto Alegre, Brazil about 7 years ago and it was the best experience of my life. We were taken care of from beginning to end – all meals, yom tovs and shabbosim. Trips, gym and even art classes. But the learning was the best part of all. The emphasis was on independant and chavrusa learning. The amount of knowlege I amassed that year – as well as the skills to learn on my own forever – is incredible. It was also a lot cheaper than Israel – just $8,000 for the year. It’s all a… Read more »

    Whether she's right or wrong is irrelevant
    Guest
    Whether she's right or wrong is irrelevant

    The Besht teaches us to look at every Jew in a positive way. Sometimes we better at doing that with not frum people on the street, but have no problem bashing an institution run by Lubavitch. Basic Chinuch, anyone?

    LA seminary
    Guest
    LA seminary

    I hear good things about the new LA seminary opening up my daughter and her friends will definatly apply there!

    Grow up
    Guest
    Grow up

    My lord You can write an article like this about every application form. Are you paying full tuition? If not they prob have a right to know why profession your in. Have you ever applied for any type of grant? There are so many valid complaints about seminary and our school system in general yet you rather talk about a sensible app form? Smartphones are useful and a lot of people have them. But non kosher meat is cheaper and most Jews eat it should we change the bible? Seminary or not, this article def doesn’t influence the decision.

    camp? ATTENTION 25
    Guest
    camp? ATTENTION 25

    seminary is an important, valuable, enriching year of one’s life, for those that can make it so.
    those who cannot, say its camp…
    and say a person cannot afford seminary, why does he have to demonise the sem saying they take advantage of girls and steal your money?
    i don’t understand.
    I AM INDEBTED to my teachers in seminary who gave me some appreciation for chassidus; a drop in the ocean…

    CAS
    Guest
    CAS

    just saying this does not apply to chaya aydel seminary whatsoever. staff is amazing and caring and they definelty dont do an invasive family background check. if your daughter is looking for a place where she wants to be cared for and be able to be who she really is, CAS is the place to apply. & trust me, i know first hand

    to 57
    Guest
    to 57

    Did not get the point of your comment…. way off!
    Gluck next time though!

    Crown Heights and Melbourne: the top choices
    Guest
    Crown Heights and Melbourne: the top choices

    Crown Heights for good classes, low cost and no dorming necessary. Melbourne for gr8 teachers,hanhola who care and a sem that is actually a not-for-profit organization.
    I don’t understandwhy people choose to go to sems in Israel where there is a small pool from which to draw English-speaking teachers. Classes are often in Hebrew and/or via skype and normally have 50+ girls in each class. Contrast that to Melbourne: 2 classes of under 25 students in each, gr8 teachers pooled from the largest community out of CH.

    Excuse Me...
    Guest
    Excuse Me...

    …but I applied to both Lod and Machon Shoshana, and neither of them asked such idiotic questions. I’m not sure which seminary you are applying to right now, but whatever it is – either the seminary is (has become?) psycho, or we are taking the idea of “good families” to an extreme. If a seminary asked that, I would either: 1) Fill out the application form and write that I don’t answer such questions (waste of application fee), or 2) just not go to that seminary – no reason for me to pay $12,000 to idiots. Maybe I would also… Read more »

    #38
    Guest
    #38

    You are a seminary alumnus, kid. Not an alumni. Alumni is the plural. Like fungus-fungi, you know what I mean? A mistake so obvious in the title makes your comment pretty much worthless to me. I didn’t even bother reading it – no reason to waste my time reading something written by an ignoramus. And for the rest of you, going to BR in CH is not necessarily “not going with the crowd”. It just means staying in CH – and for girls who live there, completely misses the point. Not going to seminary, or going to college (you want… Read more »

    Dear anonymous
    Guest
    Dear anonymous

    Hmmm 5-6 years older and you laugh and bash others without shame…maybe when they didn’t accept you…. they knew why….

    46
    Guest
    46

    women cant sing in front of men
    you should know that if you went to chitrik

    LA seminary
    Guest
    LA seminary

    I agree it does sound like agood placem but again its fees are exorbitant, how many of us could afford those prices?
    And, I hear there is no grants or allowances at all; Doesnt seem right that our daughters cant go to a good Sem, because of its prices? Is there no way out?

    One crucial question is missing
    Guest
    One crucial question is missing

    and that is dress size. Seminaries should not only request this, but they should require that all candidates be measured by a qualified tailor, who must then sign off on the size report. This must be accompanied by a medical report that includes the girl’s exact height, in inches for American sems and centimeters for sems abroad.

    This will help the seminary principals find shidduchim for their talmidois, and it will also alert them as to which of them need to be denied food except on Shabbos until they reach the ideal size for their height.

    Dear heads of Seminaries
    Guest
    Dear heads of Seminaries

    Reading all the comments here, I sense s huge amount of bitterness, anger, frustration, and confusion; as a mother of SIX girls, all we’re asking is the follows; could any of you take the time and sit down to write to all us mothers, worldwide, to explain, briefly, because you are very busy, just “Exactly what its all about??” The writer is 100% correct, in everything she wrote, and it is’nt even so funny actually because its all true; when she says that we are asked to fill in ALL the jobs of out various other children, that part too,… Read more »

    Not a fan of COL
    Guest
    Not a fan of COL

    I’m no COL fan, and I can’t stand it when you guys post op-eds written by “unknown” authors, BUT TODAY I AM PROUD OF YOU!!! Kudos to you COL and kudos to this author — whoever you are – you are 100% right. I could not have expressed this idea better.

    whatssap
    Guest
    whatssap

    whatssap? you do that shtus??
    now youre sister will NEVER get accepted…

    JUST DON`T GO
    Guest
    JUST DON`T GO

    YOU DON`T HAVE TO GO!!!!

    Israeli Seminaries
    Guest
    Israeli Seminaries

    We all know that the Staff and Administrators of the Seminaries are all laughing all the way to the bank! Parents are paying them $20,000 for a total of only 8 months a year. The Staff are BH now living comfortably with our money. This stupidity must come to an end!!

    Agree with 53
    Guest
    Agree with 53

    Couldn’t have said it better

    Seminary
    Guest
    Seminary

    Having sent all my daughters to Sem – some for one year and some for two – according to their personal needs; I am saddened by the rejection that many girls have to face. But life is like that.. Not everyone can get the job they apply for – or get into the College of their choice; or get the shidduch that they thought they wanted. Disappointments are part of life. There is the idea of hashgocha protis – maybe it just wasn’t right for you? . Seminary should give girls a concentrated year or 2 of Torah unput to… Read more »

    ...and the shidduch thing
    Guest
    ...and the shidduch thing

    And trying to convince the girls that if they don’t get into a top seminary, hey will ave a miserable time getting a good shidduch….. So not true, Baruch HaShem I know many girls who opted not to spend their parents dollars, or didn’t want to go to seminary, and Baruch HaShem are married to wonderful bicgurim and raising beautiful families Kah,,,

    TO ALL SEMINARY HEADS?????
    Guest
    TO ALL SEMINARY HEADS?????

    what you are reffering to is one or 2 seminaries. please dont put down the other seminaries that dont do this! I work for a seminary and we do not do this!
    im very happy for you that you got a good laugh out of your sisters application form but did you think of all the lashan hara and all that goes along with it??

    To number 62
    Guest
    To number 62

    Actually THERE IS A SEMINARY WHO IS ASKING THOSE VERY QUESTIONS TODAY. WE ALL RECEIVED A FORM FROM THEM! CHECK OUT THEIR FORM! MAYBE IN YOUR TIME IT WAS DIFFERENT!!

    Couldnt agree more
    Guest
    Couldnt agree more

    I completely agree with everything no.68. said, and I couldnt have put it better myself;
    If we could just understand how and what makes the system work, how, who and what is the deciding factor of where each one should be accepted/rejected, I think you may find a lot less of this yearly reaction as is the case right now

    What does age have to do with it?
    Guest
    What does age have to do with it?

    The author may well be 25 or 26 by now. Not sure why 64 is questioning and commenting on her age? Surely its about feelings, and emotions, rather than ”age”, and we are entitled to both of those, regardless if how ‘old’ or ‘young’ we are?

    to 67
    Guest
    to 67

    are you SERIOUS?! size and height to know who can eat extra on shabbos?!?

    Happy mom
    Guest
    Happy mom

    My daughter is one of the girls that bh ended up in br seminary in ny. She is having an amazing year…learning with top notch educators and enjoying quality time old friends and new friends she met this year. Its about time we all ome together and show the over rated seminaries in isreal, thatvwe r not desp for their acceptance…..what a waste of time and money!!!!

    So many
    Guest
    So many

    Whoa! What a deluge of reactions!
    Obviously an extremely sensitive point over here, that touched an very raw nerve by many
    Sad

    before moshiach
    Guest
    before moshiach

    there is quarrel and confusion……

    moshe der g
    Guest
    moshe der g

    well it is sad that we are all brainwashed into thinking that these sems(the 2 or 3 that are in israel) where all 300 or so girls want to go to and apply. and on the day that the acceptance and rejections come is tisha bav for most girls… such a system that puts our young neshomas through somuch stess and anxiety is wrong. and we allneed to blame not on the sem heads but our current schools that work with themandallow then to do what they do. they are all private buisnesses that make loads of money each year… Read more »

    moshe der g
    Guest
    moshe der g

    “I paid all in cash (and then some to bribe the right people!!!??”
    excuse me? am I seeing right! You BRIBED your daughters way into Sem? Is that what its come to now? is that what works? is that the hidden agenda here? OMG!

    Believe it
    Guest
    Believe it

    Actually, 62, there are actually Sems , well one sem that I know of, that are actually asking those questions, that you’re finding so unbelievable

    Funny
    Guest
    Funny

    Love this is what we all do

    ...
    Guest
    ...

    No self respecting parent should send their daughter’s to a specfic seminary due to peer pressure. I’m sick of parents telling me they send to sem xyz that cost 50% above the average b/c “how could I tell my daughter no”? Embarrassing.

    That father that posted about taking his daughter to Israel during the year on a family trip has it right.

    Yerushalayim
    Guest
    Yerushalayim

    I have a few daughters, some went to Tzfas and some to Yerushalayim, Although Tzfas was fine, the was in Yerushalayim felt that the learning was great, care of hanholo very good and in general very happy with everything.

    not true
    Guest
    not true

    im actually in a”big seminary”, no hichus, name, divorce in my family and baal tchouva>

    confused
    Guest
    confused

    What is the point of this op-ed?

    $20,000 plus !!!
    Guest
    $20,000 plus !!!

    That’s right . did anyone pay attention to #72. That $20,000 price may be even more by now…It”s purchasing 2 round trip tickets +cost of tuition+off Shabbos traveling expenses+ cell phones+ spending money. I made the Cheshbon, and with Seminary in Israel having one month off for Pesach and minus Tishrei Yomim Toivim and Shabbosim off where you have to fend for yourself….that adds up to only 8 months of seminary. This averages about $2,5000 or more a month! My daughter went a few years ago to Israel and she said that overall it was more like a camp with… Read more »

    67 is not serious
    Guest
    67 is not serious

    Read the post – it is clear satire of this issue and of the shidduch system.

    Happy Mammy
    Guest
    Happy Mammy

    Number 28 GREAT IDEA please let us know what exactly you and Friend plan to do is it trips ,workshop.ETC ETC.
    Please post IT ON COL its a real mitzvah.
    MOSHIACH NOW

    hello?!
    Guest
    hello?!

    i know someone who only got accepted because the interviewer requested the parents to give a ‘donation’ to the sem. they basically paid full for their kid and two others. not right.
    its all about money these days.open your eyes.

    Bais chana Tzfas is a good sem!!
    Guest
    Bais chana Tzfas is a good sem!!

    and dont care if they like yichus and money! I really gained a lot overthere!! and we have no yichus at all.
    B C Tzfas THAT IS THE PLACE FOR ME!!

    why the negativity?
    Guest
    why the negativity?

    We have no name nor anything and my daughter went to msy and I’m so grateful for the “best year of her life”.She loved the learning and close relationships formed.So she is in a Jewish college and did get credit for the year.So only gained from the experience. I am shocked by the negativity and bitterness.If you had better options, good for u but stop calling the rest of us fools for sending our daughter.

    to 96
    Guest
    to 96

    of course you gained a lot there, u did not pay for it. your parents did. I dont think its right to ask your parents to pay (minimum) 17 grand for a year abroad. its not right. and its def not right for people to ask it. its how much i paid for four years of college.
    -C

    What about us
    Guest
    What about us

    Please post the application on collive let us all really laugh

    CRAZY!
    Guest
    CRAZY!

    I think everyone should boycott all the expensive ridiculous seminaries and go to bais rivka sem in NY. its a great sem, with great teachers and classes. plus its cheap. and maybe if people stop putting up with the expensive snobby sem’s demands, they will realize the error of their ways and modify the way they run things. it won’t help to kick and scream and cry about it all. seminaries dont care what a few people are saying, because the fact is they stilll get many applicants every year, willing to pay the ridiculous expenses. so the only way… Read more »

    Please post the photo
    Guest
    Please post the photo

    I’d love to see the application 🙂

    No 44
    Guest
    No 44

    We all want to know the answer to that question ( about the siblings), but no ones answering it unfortunately

    To # 63
    Guest
    To # 63

    Actually, she’s a seminary alumna, kid. Not an alumnus. You know what i mean? A mistake so obvious makes your comment pretty much worthless to me. I didn’t even bother reading it – no reason to waste my time reading something written by an ignoramus. Actually, unfortunately for you, I did read it. Before you put someone down in such a nasty way, be certain that you are perfect. Like the Ba’al Shem Tov says, you see faults in others because they’re actually your own. Let this be a lesson in life for you, that you should treat people nicely,… Read more »

    Sour Grapes???
    Guest
    Sour Grapes???

    Stop and think! It’s impossible to measure how much harm is being done to our community and especially to our kids when generalized sweeping statements are made mocking all sems. Do all of you, including the original writer, think that you can get away with saying whatever you want, because you aren’t signing your name?? Believe me whatever you write will come home to roost one day! There are better ways to deal with problems than to badmouth all sems in a public forum. Unfortunately, the newsites may have a greater impact on the chinuch of our girls than the… Read more »

    talking from experience.....
    Guest
    talking from experience.....

    Seminary does not determine if youre going to be succeessful later on in life. Its your own spiritual growth. Some ppl need it and some dont. Personally i went to seminary and i had an amazing experience. Some ppl go and they dont like it.
    I agree that the tuition is expensive but if you gain and grow from seminary, then its all worth it.
    GO OC MELBOURNE!

    Dont understand
    Guest
    Dont understand

    Why has this turned into a ”bashing arena?” Everyone is bashing everyone else 🙁 Whats all this about? I think the whole point and tachlis of this Op-ed was to point out the absurdity of the caliber of the forms that one is being made to fill in; its about trying to understand how and why the system works the way it does, its about seeking reasons and solutions. So why all the derogatory comments and remarks. why all the negative feedback’ From what I can see is she just wants clarity and explanations. Why does that warrant the replies… Read more »

    Mother
    Guest
    Mother

    Obviously the author is bitter that she was not accepted where she wanted to go. It is very immature to bash a place that you were dying to go and did not want you. Seminary is a great experience but not for everyone, just like any higher education is not for everyone. And yes, they do have to narrow down the choices so they do it according to who you are so they know at least who they are dealing with. And yes they want to deal with families known to them. And yes all my daughters got into the… Read more »

    Melbourne
    Guest
    Melbourne

    Ohel Chana in Melbourne is the best. The staff truly cares, treat the girls fairly, and ii is just an amazing experience. It is run professionally and all girls who go love it.

    to #38
    Guest
    to #38

    Believe it or not there actually are seminaries that care for each girl.
    Ohel Chana of Melbourne, Australia is a great seminary. The hanhallah is amazing and they really want the best for each girl

    Parents DOB
    Guest
    Parents DOB

    Why do they want the Girl to give parent date of birth ITS NOT A SHIDDUCH does age matter??

    it's not only up to the parents...
    Guest
    it's not only up to the parents...

    I actually wanted to go to seminary for myself…not because everyone else was going but because i thought i would gain a lot from the experience. So because of the big expense, i helped my parents pay for it and i can say that it was all worth my money too 🙂

    to 105
    Guest
    to 105

    please tell me honestly who are they supposed to go to to discuss this matter.
    a. the seminary hanahla ?
    b the girls school principals?
    c. the mashpiam of crown heights?
    d. the rebbe?

    To Mother
    Guest
    To Mother

    Of course you can say that its immature on the part of the writer , as you yourself say, ALL your girls were accepted in the seminary of their choice! How very easy it is for you to say that; I wonder what your feelings and reaction would have been, had they NOT been accepted, and you would have tasted the bitter taste of rejection! Dont judge your neighbour until you’re in his place.. Somehow I dont think you would have written along the same lines. its so easy to pass judgement when one has everything one wants!

    why go overseas?
    Guest
    why go overseas?

    they have montreal, new york, pretty good seminaries! went to montreal last year and the teachers there are the top!

    Beis Chana Tzfas
    Guest
    Beis Chana Tzfas

    I was rejected the first year, because I applied “too late”. The second year I was accepted only after they cashed my fathers’s check in full months before I even stepped in the seminary.
    I was about to walk into Chitrik’s office and ask him: “how much is it for a smile???”
    What I learnt in seminary??? Money rules the world, but that’s not new!!!!!!

    father of four daughters
    Guest
    father of four daughters

    i wanted to send my daughters to sem, I just did not have the money.
    I have nine children I earn 70,000, it was impossible.
    the real cost is about 20,000 per year.
    no one has the answer accept borrow.
    one problem so i borrow how do i pay back?.
    It is very sad
    having a large family means destitution if you try to live an honest life

    to number 70
    Guest
    to number 70

    What’s wrong with whatsapp…. oh you have internet? You do that shtus??

    to 116
    Guest
    to 116

    the same Hashem that gave you the gift of children, will see to it to give you money to support them, where is your emunah and simcha????????

    read almost all of the 116 comments
    Guest
    read almost all of the 116 comments

    The type of application described by the op-ed writer is deplorable. There is absolutely no reason for seminaries to pry into the lives of the siblings of the applicant. Absolutely none. Those who get rejected should write a letter to the hanhalla of that sem outlining just how inappropriate such questions are. They might even be able to put together a group of rejected girls to compose and sign the letter. Who needs such small minded thinking such as asking the marital status of siblings? Maybe their students will graduate to be yentas that need to know everything about everyone.… Read more »

    only sem applications?
    Guest
    only sem applications?

    what about shidduch registration forms that ask about sibilings and their occupations?? is that the business of who knows how many boys?

    financial aid
    Guest
    financial aid

    if you qualify, you can get roughly 15000$ from the combined grants of Pell, Masa, and touro college.

    to 116
    Guest
    to 116

    chazak v’ametz
    may hashem give you strength
    He will lead your daughters to where they are meant to go
    There are some excellent seminaries in America/Canada, much more affordable

    hold on !@!!
    Guest

    What is funny is that everyone thinks their sem was the best and that’s bec they all had good experiences and obviously only know their own sem.To all the cynics out there and all those with acid-drip comments do yourself and everyone a huge favor BY NOT APPLYING to any sem. Do your own thing and be happy. BUT HUSH UP ALREADY!!!!!!

    to #20
    Guest
    to #20

    I excuse that behavior for shidduchim because the forms ask both male and female singles to list family members. When a person marries into a family, he or she will form relationships with his or her spouse’s siblings. The seminary however, has no need to know anything about the siblings.

    what about yeshivos?
    Guest
    what about yeshivos?

    everyone is kvetching about the 20,000 cost for sending your daughter for ONE year. I sent 4 boys to mesivta and zal the same year. the average cost per child was 12,500, and it went on for at least SIX years each.
    maybe we should start putting an end to this as well. and don’t tell me to send my boys to local yeshivos, I leave out of town.

    good news!
    Guest
    good news!

    my 11th grade daughter, top student, exemplary middos kah, fun , extremely popular with loads of friends , ffb gezer ( not that that makes her more special at all , but might make a difference to seminary heads) WANTS to stay here in crown heights for sem, saying she wants to sleep at home, not waste money and laughs at the notion that her choice of seminary determines her shidduch!
    I am so proud! Thank you Abishter for this special girl!

    LA Seminary
    Guest
    LA Seminary

    I spoke to someone at the LA Sem. The cost of living with good food and amazing teachers, great shluchos organizing programs, trips etc. the only way to make it happen is with these prices. However they are working hard fundraising to be able to offer individual scholarships to families that need it.

    we need help
    Guest
    we need help

    The ans is MOSHIACH i agee with most of these comments
    Not the ones that say Sem is a waste of time and money.
    We have the SAME PROMBLEM WITH SHIDDUCH CRISIS
    The QUESTION that are asked and the order that they are asked is UNFAIR to put it mildly you must pass 200 ques to even get a good look at your Profile.
    If anyone has any ideas WE ARE ALL YOUR PLEASE POST ON COL.
    Meanwhile daven for MOSHIACH

    Shidduchim doesnt have to do with seminary
    Guest
    Shidduchim doesnt have to do with seminary

    I Have 2 relatives…and heres their story, the older one got “rejected” from seminary, just because people in power can do tha t. She ended up working for a shliach and getting married @20 to an amazing boy bh. The next relative didnt even as bother with all the sem application process , and went to work for a shliach. She also marri ed @20 to a great guy, who didnt give 2 flying hoots if she went to sem in isreal or not. Now let me tell u about my friend who’s daughter went through the whole system….valedictorian…honor student…got… Read more »

    Whoever wrote this letter
    Guest
    Whoever wrote this letter

    Plzzzz dont become a victim to this rediculous crown heights stigma, it s not worth it. I went to sem in israel not the greatest name ,but still had the time of my life. never cared about the crown heights stigma never did and never will… i ve really come to see and learn over the years how some girls “nebach” walk around the streets of crown heights worrying about who s watching them> will they get into the best seminary , will they get the best shidduch, will they walk to impress every shaddchan ….. it s a mental… Read more »

    Still waiting
    Guest
    Still waiting

    Still not a word from the Heads of Seminary??
    Shame . . . . .

    TIME TO BOYCOTT THE WHOLE SEMINARY MACHINE
    Guest
    TIME TO BOYCOTT THE WHOLE SEMINARY MACHINE

    Clearly, Seminary has become ridiculous beyond ridiculous. Filling out a form about siblings? It is high time people stopped being sheep and stopped shelling out money that THEY DO NOT HAVE for an expensive year long camp experience that your DAUGHTERS DO NO NEED. Better take that money and put it away for a downpayment on a house. It is high time we end this insane cycle of doing that which is NOT in our best interest because of social pressures. Just SAY no! End of story. This situation has become beyond ridiculous. The Seminary heads have become demi-gods with… Read more »

    OMG!
    Guest
    OMG!

    OMG!! No 32! You put it so well! So many are in debt because of the Seminary ‘parsha’; and like you say, life in Sem, is anything BUT a preparation for life ahead; theyre insulated from the outside world, in all ways, the cooking is done for them, the lessons are prepared for them, they have their rooms, and its the PARENTS who are paying their ”rent”, food, trips and Shabbosim etc! Its all about the cost and fees that the parents have to make themselves ill over! Tell me , in which way are they being taught to be… Read more »

    TO #89
    Guest
    TO #89

    With all due respect you only say that because your embarassed to say that it was a waste of money.

    SUCH BITTERNESS, BUT THE TRUTH
    Guest
    SUCH BITTERNESS, BUT THE TRUTH

    WHY YOU CAN’T YOU LOOK PAST THE BITTERNESS AND SEE IT FOR WHAT IT IS. CROWN HEIGHTS EXCELS IN THIS “YICHUS” AND “GESHE” BUSINESS. GO TO A NSHEI GATHERING AND ITS ALWAYS THE SAME BORING BUT “GESHE” PERSON WHO IS THE ENTERTAINMENT FOR THE EVENING. TE FACT THAT THERE ARE COUNTLESS UPON COUNTLESS AMAZINGLY TALENTED PEOPLE ABLE TO DO A MUCH BETTER JOB DOESN’T ENTER THE PICTURE A T A L L!!!!! IF SHE IS NOT “YICHUS” OR “GESHE” OR “SHPITS” SHE MAY AS WELL FORGET ABOUT THE FACT THAT SHE HAS TALENTS. THIS GIRL MAY BE BITTER BUT IT… Read more »

    to #128
    Guest
    to #128

    the Chicago shidduch group just sent out a list of 109 shadchanum and that was not even a complete list of shadchanum. You do not have to fill out forms to get your child married like you must do to get your child into seminary. Any friend who knows your child can act as a shadchan. You can attend a shidduch meeting and make friends to network with. All kinds of people get married, not only the rich, beautiful, or well connected. Seeing the good in possibilities that come your way is the best advice that I can give anyone… Read more »

    heck
    Guest
    heck

    heck with this all do what ever you want!!! Crown heights is crazyyyyy! everyone stares looks at u glad i dont live there!!!!

    SEMINARY
    Guest
    SEMINARY

    in two words : Cash Cows I come home from work after a long hard day of work. Let me tell you supprting a family is NOT a fairytale. ESPECIALLY with tution gas prices and food reduction. Just looking at THE COMMUNITY. i can’t believe what people do just because EVERYONE ELS Does. WHO is everyone els? MOST people dont have this PROBLEM. SO who may i ask who started this? It’s not a matter of intelligence its a matter of VALUES AND MATURITY. Do you n think that just because your father has a grocery store ( or a… Read more »

    i am shocked!
    Guest
    i am shocked!

    i havent gone to sem yet but from every single girl ive met, seminary (a good one not these trashy ones that open up every yr) was extremely affected by sem. it is disgusting to put down sem.

    SO SAD
    Guest
    SO SAD

    It’s so sad that it’s come to this. BH we have listened to the Rebbe and have large families. It’s not financially possible for the average parents to pay this kind of money to enable their daughters to attend the ‘popular’ sems, as well as pay yeshiva fees for the boys. ‘Ein somchim al hanes’.’ That’s besides the fact that it would appear the Israeli sems are often not much more than a glorified camp – trips & fun and a smattering of learning. It’s an unfortunate reality that the girls might be better off spending a year on shlichus,… Read more »

    Can of worms
    Guest
    Can of worms

    What a ‘can of worms’ this Op-ed has produced. I cannot believe the amount of bitter, angry, sarcastic people there are out there; We’ve already ‘turned the page’ on COL website, and still the comments are pouring in.Why is no one coming forward from those sems,to calm down the masses? I knew that all this always was an issue, but I had no idea how many people were so strongly incensed, by it all; You’re right 140, it is , SO SAD

    RIDICULous
    Guest
    RIDICULous

    This is a ridiculous article. If a sem is accepting a student. they want to know about her and where she comes from, what kinds family she has. its not determining if they will accept her. it is important to know once they DO accept her. If you never when to seminary, and you do not know any seminary hanhala, then you CAN”T JUDGE!!
    I worked in a seminary… The more the sem knows about a student the better they can cater to her needs in Semindary.

    to 142
    Guest
    to 142

    How does someone cater to a girl’s needs in seminary by knowing who her brother is married to? I realize that if the sem girl left a sick mother or a new baby is born or a sibling gets engaged, it will affect her year at sem but just clue me in as to how it helps to know who the family’s mechutanim are.

    Bochur
    Guest
    Bochur

    If you can’t afford it, don’t go. As long as you do something productive meanwhile, like helping a friendship circle, shliach etc., bochurim don’t really care if you went to seminary. We have sisters, and we know it’s just a year to relax, have fun, and learn a bit. If you can’t afford it, don’t go into debt for it. Just don’t sit around for an extra year or go to college, and you” be fine for shidduchim. See how many people here don’t care? There are plenty more out there. And they all have sons that won’t care. Nothing… Read more »

    Great idea
    Guest
    Great idea

    I sense a lot of Bitterness here
    How about this
    Chof Beis Shvat is around the corner.
    Can we invite a Representative from each Sem .
    To an open Evening,
    with a MODERATOR asking ?–
    to help us understand, how these SEMINARY WORK.
    There application form.
    There level of one and one care for each girl.
    There classes etc etc.
    Anyone up to organizing.
    Please post on COL

    What a fantastic idea. number 145
    Guest
    What a fantastic idea. number 145

    Thats the best idea I’ve heard in a long time; If such an event ever took place, you can be sure there would be ”standing room only”, no matter where the venue, would be. infact there would probably be queues outside. Which is why, come to think of it, it would never happen, the representative risks being bombarded by the crowds of mothers and grandmothers attending the evening, and I cant see anyone willing to take that risk; still, is is a fantastic idea. maybe they could just write an article or even an Op -ed explaining it all, its… Read more »

    144- thank u!
    Guest
    144- thank u!

    Just what I like to hear. there’s more down-to-earth people out there than u think which do NOT care where u went and even more so if u didn’t go at all, the girl can be just as aidel from the start, so the judging here is just insane and abnormal. Years ago, it wasn’t such a huge ‘thing’ to go to Seminary cause girls used to back then go cause they really wanted to, i.e., to become a teacher, but nowadays it’s way too common and overrated, going too much for the social aspect, making the ones that never… Read more »

     . . . and the comments are still pouring in!
    Guest
    . . . and the comments are still pouring in!

    “Will this ever end!?”

    To #144
    Guest
    To #144

    You rock guy we need people like you around here what you wrote is so smart and simple but unfortunately many people think that if u dont go to sem you’re a BAD girl.
    PS to # 148 everyone wants to give an opinion and remember there are thousands of people in the world

    its about the girl
    Guest
    its about the girl

    I’m divorced, and don’t have money, my daughter applied to two seminaries and got accepted to both. I really think they look at the girl (her grades, behavior ,etc) otherwise i doubt she would’ve got in. She’s having now a great year in Seminary B’H and thanks me all the time but its really about her and her efforts.

    150!!!!
    Guest
    150!!!!

    Couldnt resist writing the 150th comment!!
    I guess as was said before, a huge amount of people are pretty sore about all this, hence these amazing results! But, if only we could all see a change, an understanding, a difference into whats been going on until now as a result of al this, it would be all worth it

    HaHa
    Guest
    HaHa

    Sorry Mr(s). 151

    seminary gave me so so much
    Guest
    seminary gave me so so much

    The tuition is extremely difficult but I still live with the chassidus I’ve gained in seminary every day. I’m sorry but I’m not the only one. Most girls from my class and grade that went to my sem BCTZ gained tremendously. What I’ve gained there helps me in my marriage , in running a chassidisher home in raising my children and in my shlichus so far away from everyone. I thank hHashem every day for my two years in Beis Chana. And my mother who knew that for a chassidisher chinuch it is well worthwhile , is also reaping the… Read more »

    SEMINARY IS
    Guest
    SEMINARY IS

    Just a drop in the ocean, just one step in an a mile, just a leap towards the furthest start, just a year in a life time but a life time carries on its the moment when you realize who you are!!!

    to # 153
    Guest
    to # 153

    Then there is a problem with the girls high schools if they don’t teach that. I can understand the seminary is an additional year and may teach more, but it sounds like you weren’t exposed to these topics beforehand in at least a semi-comprehensive manner.

    just so everyone knows....
    Guest
    just so everyone knows....

    the hanhala of seminary msy doesnt sleep for 2 months over the application progress. they have pur agmas nefesh from so many good girls and so few places.
    yes their forms are ridiculous (been there, done that) but sem is worth the writers cramp!!!!!
    its not overated in any way shape or form…though slightly over priced!

    to # 155
    Guest
    to # 155

    I’m sorry break it to you but I grew up in an extremely chassidisher home, was exposed to loads of chassidus and chassidisher hanhagos and learned plenty sichos in high school, participated in achos hatmimim and was totally involved in any such activities …. Nevertheless my years at beis chana were pivotal to really understanding chassidus and what its all really about. The classes, the farbrengens, the atmosphere deeply ingrained chassidus in me for life. And all my friends too. I am grateful to my high school but it just did not give me what I’ve gotten in seminary. anyone… Read more »

    To # 157
    Guest
    To # 157

    I’m 155.
    Good for you, I’m happy that you gained a lot in sem. My issue is with the highshools – they should be giving you all that too. In yeshiva, we learned real, non-watered-down chassidus – even in mesivtah. True, we learned a bit more in zal, but it was mostly additional quantity and not necessarily quality. I’m not putting down seminaries, I’m just saying they shouldn’t have to be so crucially necessary because you aren’t learning properly in highschool. The highschools should improve and give that to you.

    Questions on Camp Applications Are No Better
    Guest
    Questions on Camp Applications Are No Better

    Why do they need to know “mother’s maiden name” and all the other dozens of questions which are yentish???

    My opinion
    Guest
    My opinion

    I think that sem has its importance, but some people give TOO MUCH importance to it… Im finishing high school soon, so i still didnt have my experience yet, but whatever ill do, what i’m lookin for is something that is going to make me grow, not just a year to Waste. I mean, if i wont go to sem, i’ll go help shluchim, or kids with special needs. I know girls who went to sem and didnt gain a thing, and girls who totally changed. It doesnt necessarily depend on the sem(in some cases it does) but mostly on… Read more »

    My opinion
    Guest
    My opinion

    I think that sem has its importance, but some people give too much importance to it. I mean, i’m finishing high school soon so i didn’t have my experience yet, but what i do know for sure is that i want to use the year after high school in a good way, to mature more and gain. I don’t know for sure if i’m goig to sem, but i don’t want it to be a wasted year. If i won’t go to sem, i’ll help shluchim, or kids with special needs. It doesn’t really matter in what seminary you go… Read more »

    regarding mother's maiden name
    Guest
    regarding mother's maiden name

    The reason for asking the mother’s maiden name on some application forms is possibly to determine if the child is truly Jewish. It is better to simply say, that the organization, camp, seminary, mesader kiddushin, etc needs proof of Jewish identity. It is better to be up front about it and state that providing proof is asked of everyone. Sems probably have a quota system so that they try to take a mixture from different backgrounds and possibly the intrusive questions are to determine background. Still, it seems very unprofessional to ask questions that have no bearing on the candidates… Read more »

    Number 162
    Guest
    Number 162

    How on earth would the mothers maiden name determine if the girl in question is Jewish?? And so, if shes s fully fledged genuine Baalas Teshuva from way back, with the maiden name being, lets say, Mrs Black. . . she therefore is less Jewish than someone born frum, with a maiden name ‘well known in the Chabad world?? How sad is that!! and even more so, if the family background are True genuine Geirim, so they too, lose their chance?? Give me a break, if thats the reason theyre asking for mothers maiden name, its a real sad one.… Read more »

    i thought this exists only by the litvisher.
    Guest
    i thought this exists only by the litvisher.

    quite sad to see that this subject has arrived in chabad to.

    at time is not who youa re but who you know
    Guest
    at time is not who youa re but who you know

    i have a friend who got her daughter and friend because of who she knew. i have a daughter who will go if she wants to but i am not forcing her or letting her be under the pressure of you have to go. it dose not make you a better wife or mother.

    to 163 from 162
    Guest
    to 163 from 162

    I see that we are in agreement with each other about the situation of asking about background in a round about way. Yeshivas, day schools, and seminaries routinely ask for proof of Jewish background or geirus and that is fine if everyone involved understands the reasons for the questions.

    X